[Politics] Our vigilant immigration regime

studio150 · May 2, 2019

Harry Wilson's tackle said:
Exactly this. On Westminster Bridge there are gang members up at Parliament Square and down by the hospital, constantly on phones, constantly on the look out. And on some days there are more than a dozen 'games' going, with up to ten operators per game, male and female. I spoke to a copper (no, I didn't scream) nearby a few months ago and he was completely not interested.

Should he be interested in the game though, if you are stupid enough to stop and play you deserve to be parted from your money.
There have always been scams on the streets, from the 'gold' ring found next to someone waiting, to more sophisticated ones.

NooBHA · May 2, 2019

portlock seagull said:
Good grief. The sanctimony here is nauseating. It is ok to mention race and colour in conversation without immediately hitting the golden buzzer and going straight to Klan Wizards final. Stereotypes prevail for a reason. There’s a good lot of truth in them. And HWT makes a god point, this country because of colonial legacy has an inordinate amount of difficulties arising from the past and open door from almost every country on this planet. I very much doubt in say China, that you must provide health leaflets in 10 languages as normal. Or have school classes with 20+ different nationalities. These are all major challenges and cost a lot of money. Then of course there’s all the cultural differences that lead to a difference of opinion etc. They’re all creating challenges. And costs. People don’t leave their cultures behind or ways of thinking just because they move. So when it happens on mass as it has here then it’s bound to create a lot of challenges. And we ought to be allowed to acknowledge this without acquisitions of racism. Because this country was and for time being remains predominantly White with the same heritage that has given us a certain uniformity as a nation that is now obviously rapidly changing. Not necessarily for the better in my opinion! But that’s because I don’t trust our tribal species to integrate civilly. Christ, we can’t even watch a gameof football without being separated.

A load of old pish - We all migrated to this piece of land. It's just that some of our descendants did it several thousand years earlier. Skin pigmentation altered gradually through the Generations to adjust to the cooler Northern Climates

What is wrong with people these days. Why should you care that a school has 10 different nationalities ? I think it is wonderful

You think ''White Heritage'' gave you a certain ''Uniformity'' ? - I think it gave us a conceitedness and self entitlement. That's what changing now and thank god for it. Good Riddance to that point of view

father_and_son · May 2, 2019

portlock seagull said:
Good grief. The sanctimony here is nauseating. It is ok to mention race and colour in conversation without immediately hitting the golden buzzer and going straight to Klan Wizards final. Stereotypes prevail for a reason. There’s a good lot of truth in them. And HWT makes a god point, this country because of colonial legacy has an inordinate amount of difficulties arising from the past and open door from almost every country on this planet. I very much doubt in say China, that you must provide health leaflets in 10 languages as normal. Or have school classes with 20+ different nationalities. These are all major challenges and cost a lot of money. Then of course there’s all the cultural differences that lead to a difference of opinion etc. They’re all creating challenges. And costs. People don’t leave their cultures behind or ways of thinking just because they move. So when it happens on mass as it has here then it’s bound to create a lot of challenges. And we ought to be allowed to acknowledge this without acquisitions of racism. Because this country was and for time being remains predominantly White with the same heritage that has given us a certain uniformity as a nation that is now obviously rapidly changing. Not necessarily for the better in my opinion! But that’s because I don’t trust our tribal species to integrate civilly. Christ, we can’t even watch a gameof football without being separated.

Notwithstanding that HWT has apologised for the "White" comment, the issue that people have was the implication that "white" should jump you to the top of the queue... and it is right to be upset by that and "hitting the golden buzzer".

I am sure you are right... in China they probably don't print all their leaflets in 20 languages. But then China has over a billion people and do not have a labour shortage that requires a continuous influx of foreigners to do the jobs that the locals don't want to do. Nor do they have a long standing history of annexing large parts of the globe for their own benefit and owing any duty of care to those nations having upped and left.

But then being "white" wouldn't be the catch-all to resolving the language issues. Lots of "white" people don't speak English, so we would still need multiple leaflet variations if the "whites first"-implication were followed through on.

In this instance, HWT has explained his shorthand, but reacting to and declaring this sort of casual racism as socially unacceptable is the way to remove it from society. Getting all defensive over other people getting upset suggests a desire to continue with the status quo and maintain a level of bigotry deemed acceptable in the 1970s but not in more enlightened times. The barriers to integrating civilly come primarily from those exhibiting the racist attitudes as they are the ones creating a barrier to integration.

Tom Hark Preston Park · May 2, 2019

father_and_son said:
Notwithstanding that HWT has apologised for the "White" comment, the issue that people have was the implication that "white" should jump you to the top of the queue... and it is right to be upset by that and "hitting the golden buzzer".

I am sure you are right... in China they probably don't print all their leaflets in 20 languages. But then China has over a billion people and do not have a labour shortage that requires a continuous influx of foreigners to do the jobs that the locals don't want to do. Nor do they have a long standing history of annexing large parts of the globe for their own benefit and owing any duty of care to those nations having upped and left.

But then being "white" wouldn't be the catch-all to resolving the language issues. Lots of "white" people don't speak English, so we would still need multiple leaflet variations if the "whites first"-implication were followed through on.

In this instance, HWT has explained his shorthand, but reacting to and declaring this sort of casual racism as socially unacceptable is the way to remove it from society. Getting all defensive over other people getting upset suggests a desire to continue with the status quo and maintain a level of bigotry deemed acceptable in the 1970s but not in more enlightened times. The barriers to integrating civilly come primarily from those exhibiting the racist attitudes as they are the ones creating a barrier to integration.

Not a big fan of these NSC bullying BURN THEM WITH FIRE!! flare-ups that occasionally, er, flare up. Especially against established posters who have little prior history of being COCKS. Nobody's at their best at half eleven at night. I should know. I've started ill-advised venting threads at that time of night. Always with drink taken. Have been wished a horrible death by cancer before now, by people who are current posters. Have to say I understand completely their level of venom at the time. I fully deserved it at the time. I remain disappointed with those posts of mine to this day :down:

rippleman · May 2, 2019

studio150 said:
Should he be interested in the game though, if you are stupid enough to stop and play you deserve to be parted from your money.
There have always been scams on the streets, from the 'gold' ring found next to someone waiting, to more sophisticated ones.

You are right; there have always been street scams and HWT also is right that the police are not interested.

Not so long ago a car pulled up and a guy asked me if I wanted to buy some "gold". I laughed at him and told him to **** off. Couple of ours later I saw the same guy on foot. This time he was approaching seniors trying to get them to buy his "gold". Now he was never going to scam me but obviously approaching seniors was a different matter.

The cop shop was less than five minutes away so I hastened there and explained the situation to the desk officer. She wanted to take my details and a report. I send "no, we don't have time. Find somebody to come with me now. I know where he is and can identify him". The officer replied "Oh no, we can't do that". I just gave up and left. What was the point?

Bevendean Hillbilly · May 2, 2019

clapham_gull said:
I had a Chinese Lecturer at London University when I did my Computer Science Masters. Looking at his profile it was quite obvious the man was a genius but unfortunately I couldn't understand a word he said and never could anyone else. Fortunately his notes were brilliant.

However to put that into context, one of my best mates is from Ghana and during the cold war he went to study Engineering in Russia... in Russian.

First year learn Russian, then do degree and he passed.

There are levels to how well you learn a language and apparently understanding "comedy" in another language is the peak. Well having studied at three Universities and been around a number of foreign students, I'll never understand how they manage.

Doing a masters in a foreign language ? Blimey.

I can understand basic food in Spanish and order a beer.

Ask for sausage and chips in Polish (with mustard).

Say my break lights are broken in German.

That's it......

There’s a whole thread just waiting to be started on here by you Clapham.

“Bizarre phrases, that you know in a foreign language,...that you don’t otherwise speak”

I know how to say “I have shit my trousers”in a passable Munich accent.

Don’t ask.

Herr Tubthumper · May 2, 2019

Tom Hark said:
Not a big fan of these NSC bullying BURN THEM WITH FIRE!! flare-ups that occasionally, er, flare up. Especially against established posters who have little prior history of being COCKS. Nobody's at their best at half eleven at night. I should know. I've started ill-advised venting threads at that time of night. Always with drink taken. Have been wished a horrible death by cancer before now, by people who are current posters. Have to say I understand completely their level of venom at the time. I fully deserved it at the time. I remain disappointed with those posts of mine to this day

[MENTION=14132]Two Professors[/MENTION] has a habit of this, although his claims are tenuous to say the least, and more designed to deflect from his personal inadequacies. Try mentioning, say gammons, in a post and you’ll see what I mean. In fact, he’s so stupid he’ll almost certainly do it in a reply to this.

carlzeiss · May 2, 2019

rippleman said:
You are right; there have always been street scams and HWT also is right that the police are not interested.

Not so long ago a car pulled up and a guy asked me if I wanted to buy some "gold". I laughed at him and told him to **** off. Couple of ours later I saw the same guy on foot. This time he was approaching seniors trying to get them to buy his "gold". Now he was never going to scam me but obviously approaching seniors was a different matter.

The cop shop was less than five minutes away so I hastened there and explained the situation to the desk officer. She wanted to take my details and a report. I send "no, we don't have time. Find somebody to come with me now. I know where he is and can identify him". The officer replied "Oh no, we can't do that". I just gave up and left. What was the point?

A few years ago while contracting I was approached by some "Irish" sounding chaps at the rear of the Metropole hotel Brighton asking if I would like to purchase some surplus electrical equipment from the back of their van .
I declined their offer and rang the Police with the reg no. of the vehicle that was being driven around the area slowly seeking other customers .

The call operator though could not understand my concerns for this activity and asked why I was suspicious of the sales persons intentions .

Thinking , perhaps my own prejudiced opinions might have clouded my judgment of the situation I decided to end the call before providing name and address details as requested .

Will never know if I missed out on a genuine bargain

Bevendean Hillbilly · May 2, 2019

carlzeiss said:
A few years ago while contracting I was approached by some "Irish" sounding chaps at the rear of the Metropole hotel Brighton asking if I would like to purchase some surplus electrical equipment from the back of their van .
I declined their offer and rang the Police with the reg no. of the vehicle that was being driven around the area slowly seeking other customers .

The call operator though could not understand my concerns for this activity and asked why I was suspicious of the sales persons intentions .

Thinking , perhaps my own prejudiced opinions might have clouded my judgment of the situation I decided to end the call before providing name and address details as requested .

Will never know if I missed out on a genuine bargain

There used to be a little crew of these lads working Brighton late 90s.

Van would pull up and the spiel was something like “we work for a wholesalers and have gone bust so we’ve got a van full of VCRs, Ghetto Blasters TVs, or in my case, Speakers..they’re a bargain blah blah”

They’d show you some out of the box, really good quality. I was stupid enough to buy some (they produced a new box from the back, all cellophaned and with pick notes stuck on them..as soon as I opened the box at home, there was just empty speaker cases inside with no electronics. Put it down to experience. Don’t buy high end electrical goods from Irishmen trading from a van.

carlzeiss · May 2, 2019

Bevendean Hillbilly said:
There used to be a little crew of these lads working Brighton late 90s.

Van would pull up and the spiel was something like “we work for a wholesalers and have gone bust so we’ve got a van full of VCRs, Ghetto Blasters TVs, or in my case, Speakers..they’re a bargain blah blah”

They’d show you some out of the box, really good quality. I was stupid enough to buy some (they produced a new box from the back, all cellophaned and with pick notes stuck on them..as soon as I opened the box at home, there was just empty speaker cases inside with no electronics. Put it down to experience. Don’t buy high end electrical goods from Irishmen trading from a van.

Wow , maybe my suspicions at the time were correct after all .

Sorry to hear though that you had a bad experience from the rascals .

Thunder Bolt · May 2, 2019

NooBHA said:
A load of old pish - We all migrated to this piece of land. It's just that some of our descendants did it several thousand years earlier. Skin pigmentation altered gradually through the Generations to adjust to the cooler Northern Climates

What is wrong with people these days. Why should you care that a school has 10 different nationalities ? I think it is wonderful

You think ''White Heritage'' gave you a certain ''Uniformity'' ? - I think it gave us a conceitedness and self entitlement. That's what changing now and thank god for it. Good Riddance to that point of view

Just 10 nationalities? I have tried to point out that immigration has taken place for centuries by quoting the crew make up of HMS Victory at the Battle of Trafalgar, previously. Admiral Lord Nelson's crew consisted of 22 different nationalities (not all pressed men).
Britain is multcultural and always has been. See the ancestry thread started by Publius.

NooBHA · May 2, 2019

Bevendean Hillbilly said:
There used to be a little crew of these lads working Brighton late 90s.

Van would pull up and the spiel was something like “we work for a wholesalers and have gone bust so we’ve got a van full of VCRs, Ghetto Blasters TVs, or in my case, Speakers..they’re a bargain blah blah”

They’d show you some out of the box, really good quality. I was stupid enough to buy some (they produced a new box from the back, all cellophaned and with pick notes stuck on them..as soon as I opened the box at home, there was just empty speaker cases inside with no electronics. Put it down to experience. Don’t buy high end electrical goods from Irishmen trading from a van.

I know I shouldn't laugh but I find some of these scams really funny - I hate to see vulnerable people lose out on their hard earned money but some scams are genius.

Years ago before my dad stopped smoking. A bloke came into the pub and was selling cheap cigarettes. The ones with 10 packs in them. They were all cellophane wrapped and I presume the weight must have been hard to tell. Either that or he was pissed. He was so greedy to get a bargain he bought 4 of them. Only to get them home to find it was all empty packets.

He called them all the ''Theiving Bs '' under the sun - Then he started laughing and said ''Good luck to them''

portlock seagull · May 2, 2019

NooBHA said:
A load of old pish - We all migrated to this piece of land. It's just that some of our descendants did it several thousand years earlier. Skin pigmentation altered gradually through the Generations to adjust to the cooler Northern Climates

What is wrong with people these days. Why should you care that a school has 10 different nationalities ? I think it is wonderful

You think ''White Heritage'' gave you a certain ''Uniformity'' ? - I think it gave us a conceitedness and self entitlement. That's what changing now and thank god for it. Good Riddance to that point of view

Because it’s impractical, it costs a lot of money, it means fewer opportunities for me and my family born here (so naturally there is some protectionism) because my nationality and heritage seems to be under attack, because it’s been hijacked by the far right and left in equal measure, because I enjoyed understanding what was being said all around me, because...there’s loads of reasons! But my biggest fear is clash of cultures which like it or not does happen. Look at the US, it’s so divided along rich, poor, religion, race...melting pots can become just that and as I said I just don’t trust our species to get along when there are a lot of sizeable minorities living together in cramped conditions which is where we’re at. It just gets worse. It’s another reason for conflicts. You can hold it together but when stressed it can burst with extreme violence such as former Yugoslavia.

portlock seagull · May 2, 2019

Thunder Bolt said:
Just 10 nationalities? I have tried to point out that immigration has taken place for centuries by quoting the crew make up of HMS Victory at the Battle of Trafalgar, previously. Admiral Lord Nelson's crew consisted of 22 different nationalities (not all pressed men).
Britain is multcultural and always has been. See the ancestry thread started by Publius.

I know and agree it has. For me it’s about the scale. That’s unprecedented and why there are so many challenges all at once. Controlled immigration is my wish. But this gets shouted down by so many who can’t differentiate and scream racist as soon as the word immigration is mentioned. We can’t have a sensible debate or conversation with such people so I just ignore now. They can think what they like even if it’s wrong.

carlzeiss · May 2, 2019

portlock seagull said:
I know and agree it has. For me it’s about the scale. That’s unprecedented and why there are so many challenges all at once. Controlled immigration is my wish. But this gets shouted down by so many who can’t differentiate and scream racist as soon as the word immigration is mentioned. We can’t have a sensible debate or conversation with such people so I just ignore now. They can think what they like even if it’s wrong.

For many , diversity in the UK will not be satisfactory until there is no diversity left . Wether or not this will be a good thing only history will determine .

Pretty pink fairy · May 2, 2019

knocky1 said:
Exactly he’d put himself on ignore, if it weren’t for his Narcissistic personality disorder.

Very disappointing thread opener.

Needy person , why put people on ignore

regards
DR

NooBHA · May 2, 2019

portlock seagull said:
Because it’s impractical, it costs a lot of money, it means fewer opportunities for me and my family born here (so naturally there is some protectionism) because my nationality and heritage seems to be under attack, because it’s been hijacked by the far right and left in equal measure, because I enjoyed understanding what was being said all around me, because...there’s loads of reasons! But my biggest fear is clash of cultures which like it or not does happen. Look at the US, it’s so divided along rich, poor, religion, race...melting pots can become just that and as I said I just don’t trust our species to get along when there are a lot of sizeable minorities living together in cramped conditions which is where we’re at. It just gets worse. It’s another reason for conflicts. You can hold it together but when stressed it can burst with extreme violence such as former Yugoslavia.

It cuts both ways - If you/we embrace others and their way of life then you/we/us/I will get it back in equal measures - Speculate to accumulate. We would all still be living in caves otherwise

carlzeiss · May 2, 2019

NooBHA said:
It cuts both ways - If you/we embrace others and their way of life then you/we/us/I will get it back in equal measures - Speculate to accumulate. We would all still be living in caves otherwise

Trouble is we don't allow other to embrace their way of life as some aspects don't conform with UK law . Would myself be happy for changes to be made for certain communities .

Pretty pink fairy · May 2, 2019

NooBHA said:
It cuts both ways - If you/we embrace others and their way of life then you/we/us/I will get it back in equal measures - Speculate to accumulate. We would all still be living in caves otherwise

you mean terror attacks ??
regards
DR

NooBHA · May 2, 2019

carlzeiss said:
Trouble is we don't allow other to embrace their way of life as some aspects don't conform with UK law . Would myself be happy for changes to be made for certain communities .

Sometimes it is our laws that need changing. Look at all the Equal Rights that people have gained in the last 30 or so years within the workplace

Look at the fact we no longer have Corporal Punishment in schools where children used to regularly beaten by teachers.

Look at the Catholic Church gradually now being held to account for the abuse of Children.

We can't sit back and just say, everything e have here in the UK is correct and we won't yield. W all have a lot to learn from people around the world.

Look at the way the EU dragged us kicking and screaming into modernity in terms of equal rights for women and same sex couples. Look at the way they forced Romania to change their Prison systems before they would allow them to enter the EU.

Society is evolving all the time. Everyone on this earth brings something to this Table that is Life - We borrow life but for a short time. We should try and make it better for ourselves and those that follow behind us.

I get so much more out of life by making an effort to try and like or understand others that I may not even currently know yet because I may need that understanding further into my journey in life.

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[Politics] Our vigilant immigration regime

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