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[Finance] Missing tax return - how far back to HMRC check?



W

warmleyseagull

Well-known member
Apr 17, 2011
4,221
Beaminster, Dorset
Triggaaar said:
I do self assessment tax returns. My online account says that I didn't complete a return some years ago. That's not correct, but I don't have a copy of the return, as it was done on paper back then and it's a long time ago. I'm just wondering if at some point they're going to hassle me for a missing return, which I'm sure I submitted.

So my question is, how many years back can they go for a missing return?

Thanks
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As you and others have now found out, strict answer is a long way. But HMRC will do that only if they smell big dough, and use this facility only for tax evasion. or avoidance where they have won a case (e.g. the film avoidance scheme that has caught Sir Alex among others).

If they haven't chased, they are a fault. either because it was submitted and account wrong, or they lost it. Bigger fish for them to fry. Worry about Burnley.
 




H

Hendrax

Well-known member
Jan 23, 2013
3,517
Worthing
Triggaaar said:
Basically, yes. It was 11 years ago.
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If you were not issued demands and initial fines for late submission, and you hadn't moved address in that time then you have nothing to worry about.

Ask them for a paper trail of correspondence in regards to said return.

I had a similar battle with the council from something that.i was made aware of years after the fact.

It was dropped because they could not prove I had received any demands/letters.
 




N

NooBHA

Well-known member
Jan 13, 2015
8,584
Hendrax said:
If you were not issued demands and initial fines for late submission, and you hadn't moved address in that time then you have nothing to worry about.

Ask them for a paper trail of correspondence in regards to said return.

I had a similar battle with the council from something that.i was made aware of years after the fact.

It was dropped because they could not prove I had received any demands/letters.
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Not good advice for an "out of date" Return. Get an Estimated Return lodged and stop faffing about. If an original was lodged it is not gonna turn up now 8 years later. Any tax liabilities pertaining to that year will accrue interest so just get it lodged quickly and go from there
 


B

Bodian

Well-known member
May 3, 2012
11,858
Cumbria
Are they actually asking you about it? Or is it just 'missing' on your online account? Don't go poking with a stick if the hornets are asleep.

Other than that - your bank may have records going back that long, depending on how you paid, they may show whether you paid tax or not?
 




H

Hendrax

Well-known member
Jan 23, 2013
3,517
Worthing
NooBHA said:
Not good advice for an "out of date" Return. Get an Estimated Return lodged and stop faffing about. If an original was lodged it is not gonna turn up now 8 years later. Any tax liabilities pertaining to that year will accrue interest so just get it lodged quickly and go from there
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As I understand it, it was submitted and they have lost/not filed it?

All before it was all digital. Must admit I'm not too sure of the powers from councils to HMRC.

Trader: submitted
HMRC: haven't got it
Trader: prove it.

You have proof you sent?

You're suggesting bend over and accept?
 


Wrong-Direction

Wrong-Direction

Well-known member
Mar 10, 2013
13,427
Can you pay in a dubious tax rebate cheque after 4 years with no questions asked?

Sent from my SM-A600FN using Tapatalk
 








Triggaaar

Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,205
Goldstone
Hendrax said:
If you were not issued demands and initial fines for late submission, and you hadn't moved address in that time then you have nothing to worry about.
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It's that long ago I had to think - but no, I haven't moved since.

Ask them for a paper trail of correspondence in regards to said return.

I had a similar battle with the council from something that.i was made aware of years after the fact.

It was dropped because they could not prove I had received any demands/letters.
Click to expand...
Thanks for the advice.
 


Triggaaar

Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,205
Goldstone
Bodian said:
Are they actually asking you about it? Or is it just 'missing' on your online account?
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Just noted as missing. They haven't contacted me, I just saw it on my online account.
Don't go poking with a stick if the hornets are asleep.
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Yeah, I don't really want to go poking about. I never have any trouble with my accounts, and they're pretty straightforward with no creative accounting. It's annoying to read they can go back 20 bloody years though.
 




Triggaaar

Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,205
Goldstone
warmleyseagull said:
As you and others have now found out, strict answer is a long way. But HMRC will do that only if they smell big dough
Click to expand...
So not if it just smells a bit musty then?

If they haven't chased, they are a fault. either because it was submitted and account wrong, or they lost it. Bigger fish for them to fry.
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Indeed there are. If this isn't something they do for your average Joe, then I won't be hearing from them.

Worry about Burnley.
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Good advice, I shall.
 


Triggaaar

Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,205
Goldstone
Hendrax said:
You have proof you sent?
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I would have handed it in at the branch in Brighton. I expect I'd have taken a photo copy of it before handing it in, but I don't know where that is now.
 


H

Hendrax

Well-known member
Jan 23, 2013
3,517
Worthing
Triggaaar said:
I would have handed it in at the branch in Brighton. I expect I'd have taken a photo copy of it before handing it in, but I don't know where that is now.
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It's hard to pass on advice to he honest. I had a very similar case about 4 years ago involving council tax from 2010.

They were very aggressive, came to my house when I was working away, threatening my pregnant wife with consfication of goods.

It went from a 2k bill within 12hrs to an apology from the council for false accusation but more importantly, threatening behaviour towards my wife.

After 6 months of regulations and laws, all it took was a threat to release on social media all the messages and I was offered a settlement.
 




K

knocky1

Well-known member
Jan 20, 2010
12,971
Thanks [MENTION=30752]NooBHA[/MENTION] for hint on way to pay NI2 rather than NI4 when income only from property.

Our garden plant business brings in a few hundred pounds a year, the wife enjoys the propagating and we pay £1,000 less in National Insurance contributions.

All above board, too.
 


beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,313
you probably have a bank statement with the amount paid if they ever do dig into it, would show at least a payment was made.
 


H

Hendrax

Well-known member
Jan 23, 2013
3,517
Worthing
knocky1 said:
Thanks [MENTION=30752]NooBHA[/MENTION] for hint on way to pay NI2 rather than NI4 when income only from property.

Our garden plant business brings in a few hundred pounds a year, the wife enjoys the propagating. and we pay £1,000 less in National Insurance contributions.

All above board, too.
Click to expand...

Love this word.
 


L

LVGull

New member
May 13, 2016
1,959
Triggaaar said:
Further reading suggests it's 20 years, which is irritating, as I don't even have all my documents any more.
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You have just answered your own question? If you didn’t post you would of found the answer you were looking for earlier?
 




Triggaaar

Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,205
Goldstone
LVGull said:
You have just answered your own question?
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Maybe roughly.
If you didn’t post you would of found the answer you were looking for earlier?
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I was expecting one of our finance experts here to know the answer, as some have probably dealt with this sort of thing before. Also, in posting what I've now read up, the experts here could tell me why that's not the case, if there's something I've missed. From reading online, as well as the replies here, it looks like it is 20 years, but HMRC don't generally bother using the 'Discovery' rules unless there are other suspicious accounts or it's a lot of money. So still useful to get the wisdom of NSC.
 
Last edited:


LamieRobertson

LamieRobertson

Not awoke
Feb 3, 2008
46,741
SHOREHAM BY SEA
Triggaaar said:
Maybe roughly.
I was expecting one of our finance experts here to know the answer, as some have probably dealt with this sort of thing before. Also, in posting what I've now read up, the experts here could tell me why that's not the case, if there's something I've missed. From reading online, as well as the replies here, it looks like it is 20 years, but HMRC don't generally bother using the 'Discovery' rules unless there are other suspicious accounts or it's a lot of money.
Click to expand...

Good to see you posting Trig....not sure about WiFi when doing porridge :whistle:
 


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