[Albion] How do you feel about the Potter revolution thus far?

Icy Gull · Sep 15, 2019

Bakero said:
Looking at the expected goals stats for the teams we've played it doesn't seem we've been giving them loads of clear cut opportunities (discounting City). In fact every team we've played bar Watford have outperformed their xg, suggesting they've been clinical, rather than us being loose at the back.

Watford xg1

West Ham xg0.6

Southampton xg1.8 (AGAINST 10 MEN OF COURSE)

Man city xg2.3

Burnley xg0.4

What exactly about the defending don't you like? Seems to me like we are keeping the ball well and restricting the opposition's chances. The problem is we're not taking our chances.

Last season after the first couple of months we hardly made any chances, this season we are losing and drawing because we are not taking our chances. If it doesn’t change we will get relegated. However I am hopeful that things will start to click soon, we are moving the ball very well and look comfortable in possession so no reason to think we won’t start scoring. At least we are making the chances.

I keep saying it, we will be in a relegation battle but I am loving the change in the way we play :shrug:

There are some fans on here who seem to want us to fail so they can say “told you so”

How sad is that after five games?

London Irish · Sep 15, 2019

Icy Gull said:
As comical as your comments about how useless Stephens is?

I don’t think he’s useless though, I just don’t think we’ll progress to being a mid-table team while he’s running the midfield due to his limitations. I think that’s a genuine debate along fans. Again I do remember a time when it was possible to have interesting exchanges about such stuff as this with you :shrug:

Acker79 · Sep 15, 2019

theboybilly said:
I really don't know what you were watching last season but Albion were definitely one of the worst three teams last season. Cardiff did the double over us, they had numerous dodgy refereeing decisions go against them but all Albion could do was try and draw their way out of trouble. Three successive 1-0 wins in the Autumn papered over some huge cracks especially at St James'Park. Albion didn't do anywhere near enough to save themselves. On top of that we were appalling to watch. We're not now

I'm not arguing we played entertaining football. I'm not arguing we played better football than Cardiff, Fulham or Huddersfield. In football you earn points by scoring more than you concede, or conceding no more than you score. How well you play to do that ultimately isn't relevant. You don't only get two points for a win if you rely on luck. The table isn't arranged by how entertaining a team is. It is arranged by how many points you have after 38 games. We did that more than Cardiff, Fulham, and Huddersfield. We stayed up because after 38 games we won more points than them. Yes, they dropped points. So did we. We managed to drop fewer points than them. We won more points than them. In doing so, in a league system, we stayed up.

There were only three teams that didn't do enough to save themselves, the other 17 did. We were one of the 17 that did.

rogersix said:
it's called the business end of the season for a reason

Yeah, it's called cliche.

rogersix said:
you can't get relegated in the first month, but you can in the last,
so it is different

No, you get relegated at the end of the season, when all the games are played and all the results are known. Even if it is mathematically impossible to stay up come the middle of April, you stay in that division until the end of the season when all the games have been played and all the results are known, then you are dropped down a division. Where the points come from doesn't matter one jot. If teams are tied on points it's not a case of 'you won more points in May so you go above them'. We may have a greater understanding of where we are heading as the season draws to a close, but it is just our perception that is different. Three points in the last month are worth 3 points. 3 points in the first month are worth 3 points. They all count.

theboybilly said:
It was the inference that the final league table is evidence of everything. Things don't even themselves out over the season. we had a fair few decisions go our way too. In that run of three 1-0 wins I mentioned, if the opposition in two of those games could have actually hit the barn door they were trying to knock down we would have been 3-1 losers at least. Not to mention the capitulations at Craven Cottage and against a Vardy- reinforced Leicester at the Amex where we just seemed to melt as soon as he came on. People were getting carried away when we were (if memory serves me correctly) on 14pts after 9 games. I thought at the time how that could so easily have been just 4. In the end Cardiff were a better side than us, showed more fight (with the honourable exception of our defensive unit), showed more guile. We were very, very lucky.- I take no pleasure in saying that

A) Inference = you. You inferred it.
B) I'm not saying it tells the whole story. I'm saying survival is dictated by how many points you have at the end of the season. We had more than Cardiff, Fulham and Huddersfield. We got those points. Fair or not, earned or lucky, we got them. Cardiff, Fulham, and Huddersfield had the same number of games and the same opportunities to get points, fair or not, earned or lucky. We won more points than them and thus saved ourselves.

Let me be absolutely clear: this is not about defending or attacking either Hughton or Potter. It's not about whether the football this year is better than last. It is about the non-sense idea that the league works in some magical way. It doesn't. It is cold and methodical. Points = prizes. Not performances. Not emotive ideas like trying to attack and failing to convert chances while also failing to defend is more worthy of a win than trying to defend and keeping your opponent out while managing to sneak a goal at the other end. The points you earn across the season, based on the number of goals you concede in a match v the number of goals you score. Cold hard recordable data. They all count, regardless of how it seems or how aware you are what the target is. It is the reality of how a league system works.

spence · Sep 15, 2019

Napper said:
More entertaining but we look weak

Writing on wall for relegation in my opinion

Lots of people are caught up in the nice attacking football we play. I suppose when you have been subjected to 5 months of painstakingly dull stuff under Hughton then you will take anything just to enjoy the game again.
Don't get we wrong some of the football is nice we play and refreshing but it's come at a price. We can't defend for shit and are to exposed.

spence · Sep 15, 2019

Weststander said:
This. Locadia’s been put on some pedestal, simply because he’s an alleged striker. Over 18 months he produced little in his PL appearances. Andone scored the greatest Albion I’ve ever seen, but even when coming on a sub he was bone idle, his nasty streak cost us, and the player wanted out. Paul Hayward’s insight was very revealing.

What is this Hayward thing ? Link please

Weststander · Sep 15, 2019

spence said:
What is this Hayward thing ? Link please

https://mobile.twitter.com/_paulhayward/status/1168547363180490752?lang=en

= Andone was not liked by his squad mates.

Super Steve Earle · Sep 15, 2019

theboybilly said:
It was the inference that the final league table is evidence of everything. Things don't even themselves out over the season. we had a fair few decisions go our way too. In that run of three 1-0 wins I mentioned, if the opposition in two of those games could have actually hit the barn door they were trying to knock down we would have been 3-1 losers at least. Not to mention the capitulations at Craven Cottage and against a Vardy- reinforced Leicester at the Amex where we just seemed to melt as soon as he came on. People were getting carried away when we were (if memory serves me correctly) on 14pts after 9 games. I thought at the time how that could so easily have been just 4. In the end Cardiff were a better side than us, showed more fight (with the honourable exception of our defensive unit), showed more guile. We were very, very lucky.- I take no pleasure in saying that

But the final League table IS evidence of everything. If a couple of decisons had gone differently or another team could have hit a barn door, Liverpool would have won the Premier League. We were very, very lucky that there were three teams worse than us. But you can't emphasise your point unless you emphasise it evenly. If results had been different throughout the League, different decisions made by refs, and more shots had gone in, we would have gone down or could have finished higher. Not much of a point to make is it? But I do realise from your comments that you glass is generally empty.

spence · Sep 15, 2019

Weststander said:
https://mobile.twitter.com/_paulhayward/status/1168547363180490752?lang=en

= Andone was not liked by his squad mates.

He failed the no dicks heads policy ?

Weststander · Sep 15, 2019

spence said:
I'm talking about the goals we have conceded since the start of the season. They have been largely down to poor defending. Even that poor article i read about us and Man City. It was laughable. That could have easily been 6 or 7 like i said before. A couple of there goals were quality granted. The others poor. Our defending in that game was shit. It's that simple.
The other homes games we conceded poor goals.
I've said this before but clean sheets will be a rarity under Potter. We cannot defend and it's verve racking seeing us defending.
Stats are all well and good but i rather watch with my own eyes. I don't like what i'm seeing. I just think the system we play is wrong for us at this level.

Agree with you about the defending. Most scored after being exposed down Montoya’s side, plus individual lapses of concentration or positional sense.

But I have faith in Potter finding solutions.

Bakero · Sep 15, 2019

spence said:
I'm talking about the goals we have conceded since the start of the season. They have been largely down to poor defending. Even that poor article i read about us and Man City. It was laughable. That could have easily been 6 or 7 like i said before. A couple of there goals were quality granted. The others poor. Our defending in that game was shit. It's that simple.
The other homes games we conceded poor goals.
I've said this before but clean sheets will be a rarity under Potter. We cannot defend and it's verve racking seeing us defending.
Stats are all well and good but i rather watch with my own eyes. I don't like what i'm seeing. I just think the system we play is wrong for us at this level.

Watford -no goals conceded
West ham- good run and finish, against the run of play
Southampton- wonder strike, goal on break when we were chasing an equaliser. 10 men.
Man city= man city. I suppose we could have parked the bus and lost 3-0
Burnley- great strike, only shot on target, against run of play

NooBHA · Sep 15, 2019

spence said:
Both offered nothing. Locadia was lazy and Andone is well Andone. Think you are missing my point also.

They offered numbers if injuries are incurred

lizard · Sep 15, 2019

Bakero said:
Watford -no goals conceded
West ham- good run and finish, against the run of play
Southampton- wonder strike, goal on break when we were chasing an equaliser. 10 men.
Man city= man city. I suppose we could have parked the bus and lost 3-0
Burnley- great strike, only shot on target, against run of play

Consulting my crystal ball....

Newcastle - Unlucky to lose to a penalty, at least we hit the woodwork and played pretty ineffective triangles.
Chelsea - Lampard's getting a tune out of them, what hope did we have.
Spurs - Well, when Harry Kane's on form, happy with our late consolation despite being three down.
Villa - They did spend heavily, so a good point.
Everton - Bossed them for eighty minutes, unlucky with both goals.

Despite my premature characteristic bed-wetting, I do prefer the way we're playing this season. However, feel it my duty to declare as things stand I believe we are pretty ****ed this season. Sorry. Three from four, Newcastle, Villa, Sheff U and us. Hope I'm wrong, but either way it won't stop me enjoying the season.

spence · Sep 15, 2019

NooBHA said:
They offered numbers if injuries are incurred

I said you missed my point entirely. The timing was all wrong in letting them go. It still doesn't change anything. Both offered nothing and were right to be offloaded.

One Teddy Maybank · Sep 15, 2019

Icy Gull said:
The key phrase there is “Potter changed it” something that CH didn’t ever do except in THAT Newcastle game. We have a manager still getting to know his players strengths and weaknesses and we’ve been a little unlucky with injuries. Not going to say that we have been unlucky though. We need to start taking the opportunities we get, at the moment we aren’t and the opposition are.

Potter has more than one plan and his go to plan means we are entertained. he still has my full support. Mind you I am looking forward to seeing El Galgo getting game time so I may not have a clue about football anyway

Agree with all this [emoji23][emoji23][emoji23][emoji6]

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Herr Tubthumper · Sep 15, 2019

NooBHA said:
They offered numbers if injuries are incurred

But Potter made a decision based on this, and their respective attitudes, and decided all things considered it was better to ship them out than keep them.

spence · Sep 15, 2019

Bakero said:
Watford -no goals conceded
West ham- good run and finish, against the run of play
Southampton- wonder strike, goal on break when we were chasing an equaliser. 10 men.
Man city= man city. I suppose we could have parked the bus and lost 3-0
Burnley- great strike, only shot on target, against run of play

Weststander · Sep 15, 2019

It’s not a bed of roses elsewhere. The Arsenal and Everton forums tonight are calling for the dismissal of Emery and Silva. Potter isn’t a favourite for the boot just now.

NooBHA · Sep 15, 2019

Herr Tubthumper said:
But Potter made a decision based on this, and their respective attitudes, and decided all things considered it was better to ship them out than keep them.

Perhaps he did but I can't help but think that is or will be an error of judgement. Just a personal opinion.

Sussex Nomad · Sep 15, 2019

I think we are 50 to 75% better than last year. Gutted with a 90:17 goal and we were the better side again. We need a killer touch, no more, no less.

ac gull · Sep 15, 2019

Potter signings Maupay and Webster both look good - Trossard a level above AK even after a few games

Potter know what he wants and not afraid of tough decisions

Best of all is flexible when plan not working - as changes after 30 minutes yesterday evidenced

We still have Trossard, Izzy and Biss to get up and running - not yet time to give up

Three wins in a row as we had last November can change everything

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