The Vaccine Thread

dazzer6666 · Apr 11, 2021

Mustafa said:
It's a tough choice. I'm undecided, but I probably won't get it.

Numerous studies seem to suggest that natural immunity, as opposed to vaccine immunity, is considerably more effective at reducing transmissions and creating a long-term immunity in an individual. Problem is that the different vaccines work in such different ways - so some might be more effective than others, some might be more effective than natural immunity, which adds to the difficulty of the decision.

Either way, taking a vaccine is a risk that I don't feel I need to take. Personally I think it would be better if I caught Covid and let my body overcome it naturally. In terms of what's better for public health, we just don't know - numerous studies suggest that natural immunity is preferable.

In terms of people I contact with, I would hope that anyone who is vulnerable will have the vaccine soon, if not already.

Data is already showing that you’re taking a far greater risk in not having the vaccine........but it has to be a personal choice.

I think herd immunity will kick in soon (if it hasn’t already - the drop in infections despite schools opening possibly indicates it already has) which potentially means far less need for the remainder of the population to be vaccinated. However anyone not doing so is risking serious illness or death from Covid, obviously, that a simple couple of jabs can basically eliminate.

Can perhaps compare with flu at this stage - I don’t have a flu jab, because when I’ve had flu it’s been a bit of a crappy couple of days, but it’s rare (once in 15 years maybe) and doesn’t impact me that much. I had the Covid jab because there’s a much greater chance of it killing me, or a relative/friend I might pass it on to (and they might not necessarily be vulnerable).

I think we’ll see the very vast majority of Covid patients in hospital and on ventilators being unvaccinated U50s over the coming months.

dsr-burnley · Apr 11, 2021

Mustafa said:
It's a tough choice. I'm undecided, but I probably won't get it.

Numerous studies seem to suggest that natural immunity, as opposed to vaccine immunity, is considerably more effective at reducing transmissions and creating a long-term immunity in an individual. Problem is that the different vaccines work in such different ways - so some might be more effective than others, some might be more effective than natural immunity, which adds to the difficulty of the decision.

Either way, taking a vaccine is a risk that I don't feel I need to take. Personally I think it would be better if I caught Covid and let my body overcome it naturally. In terms of what's better for public health, we just don't know - numerous studies suggest that natural immunity is preferable.

In terms of people I contact with, I would hope that anyone who is vulnerable will have the vaccine soon, if not already.

In terms of public health, we do know. We have seen what happens with public health when we aren't vaccinated - we all have to be locked up for a year and over 130,000 people die anyway. I have no idea what effect you think the vaccine will have, but if you are thinking logically you must be thinking it will be worse than this past year.

As for yourself, you're ignoring one of the possibilities, as beorththelm has pointed out.

1. Get vaccinated, nothing happens.
2. Get vaccinated, die or be seriously ill.
3. Do not get vaccinated, get Covid, nothing happens.
4. Do not get vaccinated, get Covid, die or be seriously ill.
5. Do not get vaccinated, do not get Covid. Probably because so many other people have taken the risk that you don't want to take.

The probability of number 4 is very much higher than the probability of number 2.

dazzer6666 · Apr 11, 2021

Mustafa said:
Covid is pretty much zero risk for relatively young, healthy individuals such as myself. I would not be at all concerned for my own safety if I caught it.

As a key worker, my company is going to give all of us covid tests, which is likely to be twice a week - but could end up being daily. So because of this, I am in a fairly unique group where it is appropriate for me not to be vaccinated.

Also, it's important for scientific reasons that not everyone is vaccinated. I have opted in to NHS related research, following a random test I was selected for earlier on in the year. I intend to help in any way I can if they contact me again.

Why does testing make it appropriate not to be vaccinated?

dazzer6666 · Apr 11, 2021

Mustafa said:
I won't be much of a risk to others if I know early if I am infected - possibly less of a risk than those who have been vaccinated and not being tested, as they may still be able to transmit covid.

Possibly, possibly not......you won’t know how long you’ve had it, and the tests aren’t anywhere near 100% accurate. Most importantly though it has no bearing on the risk to you personally.

The Qcovid tool is interesting to use.........gives me a 1 in 11,000 chance of dying from Covid.

beorhthelm · Apr 11, 2021

dazzer6666 said:
Why does testing make it appropriate not to be vaccinated?

it doesnt, its just a thin veil to cover the selfishness of not taking the vaccine. herd immunity needs for most the population to be immunised, we all do our bit. everyone has sacrificed this past year, some people want to be special and not need to take the vaccine.

Driver8 · Apr 11, 2021

dazzer6666 said:
I think we’ll see the very vast majority of Covid patients in hospital and on ventilators being unvaccinated U50s over the coming months.

Which will give the anti-vaxxers something to think about.

Herr Ing Gull · Apr 11, 2021

Driver8 said:
Which will give the anti-vaxxers something to think about.

I can't decide whether that's a huge assumption or a oxymoron

Sent from my moto g(9) play using Tapatalk

e77 · Apr 12, 2021

I am not into compulsory vaccinations but unless you have a medical reason not to everyone should have the vaccination when offered. We might be getting to the stage now where we are vaccinating people with a low risk of dying but it is still extremely nasty and we don't know much about long Covid yet. But even if you are happy with that risk to yourself it only takes one chain of transmission through you to an elderly relative who the vaccination didn't work on and the death is on you.

crodonilson · Apr 13, 2021

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/idt-40ac92b1-1750-4e86-9936-2cda6b0acb3f?at_custom3=%40BBCNews&at_campaign=64&at_medium=custom7&at_custom2=twitter&at_custom1=%5Bpost+type%5D&at_custom4=F1CFCA4C-9C2F-11EB-94CE-E48E96E8478F

A good visual model of why the vaccine on its own is not the route out of the pandemic and some other measures will be needed for some time to come. Shows now more than ever with so many still unvaccinated bit now mixing that we stick to the rule of 6 and 2m distance from others outside our own bubble.

dsr-burnley · Apr 13, 2021

crodonilson said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/idt-40ac92b1-1750-4e86-9936-2cda6b0acb3f?at_custom3=%40BBCNews&at_campaign=64&at_medium=custom7&at_custom2=twitter&at_custom1=%5Bpost+type%5D&at_custom4=F1CFCA4C-9C2F-11EB-94CE-E48E96E8478F

A good visual model of why the vaccine on its own is not the route out of the pandemic and some other measures will be needed for some time to come. Shows now more than ever with so many still unvaccinated bit now mixing that we stick to the rule of 6 and 2m distance from others outside our own bubble.

It isn't a good visual model. It misses out a very important point - it misses out what the target is.

The future is a matter of how much risk we accept, and that's where the model is silent. You can't produce a model of what we have to do to reach of target position. if we don't know our target position.

When it boils down to it, all that model says is that the more precautions we take, the less likely we are to catch something. Which is in the Sybil Fawlty Mastermind category, "the bleeding obvious".

e77 · Apr 13, 2021

crodonilson said:
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/resources/idt-40ac92b1-1750-4e86-9936-2cda6b0acb3f?at_custom3=%40BBCNews&at_campaign=64&at_medium=custom7&at_custom2=twitter&at_custom1=%5Bpost+type%5D&at_custom4=F1CFCA4C-9C2F-11EB-94CE-E48E96E8478F

A good visual model of why the vaccine on its own is not the route out of the pandemic and some other measures will be needed for some time to come. Shows now more than ever with so many still unvaccinated bit now mixing that we stick to the rule of 6 and 2m distance from others outside our own bubble.

In terms of this country it is about the vaccine with track and trace and mass testing as a fallback if we get any outbreaks and to keep a look out for new variants.

There will come a point in the not too distant future that masks and social distancing become optional.

crodonilson · Apr 13, 2021

e77 said:
In terms of this country it is about the vaccine with track and trace and mass testing as a fallback if we get any outbreaks and to keep a look out for new variants.

There will come a point in the not too distant future that masks and social distancing become optional.

Will be a lovely moment when that eventually happens but we shouldn't rush it, I really don't think this should be dropped until everyone has been vaccinated fully. We can cope with this summer if it is similar to last summer, the worst thing that can happen is a premature relase allowing a slow bubbling under of cases throughout the summer that turns into a tidal wave in Autumn again.

dsr-burnley · Apr 13, 2021

crodonilson said:
Will be a lovely moment when that eventually happens but we shouldn't rush it, I really don't think this should be dropped until everyone has been vaccinated fully. We can cope with this summer if it is similar to last summer, the worst thing that can happen is a premature relase allowing a slow bubbling under of cases throughout the summer that turns into a tidal wave in Autumn again.

You can only speak for yourself.

50,000 people this month are dying in loneliness, unable to see their friends and relatives. 50,000 more are in their last month as we write this. We can't just let them die as incidental victims, just part of the cost of making life better for the rest of us; they need to be considered.

crodonilson · Apr 13, 2021

dsr-burnley said:
You can only speak for yourself.

50,000 people this month are dying in loneliness, unable to see their friends and relatives. 50,000 more are in their last month as we write this. We can't just let them die as incidental victims, just part of the cost of making life better for the rest of us; they need to be considered.

Last summer we were able to socialise outdoors in fairly large groups and indoors with social distancing protocols. I am not talking about lockdown but measures to ensure whilst increase mixing happens we put as much in place as we can to stop covid transmissions.

LamieRobertson · Apr 13, 2021

https://twitter.com/johnestevens/status/1381922550154981377?s=21

This kind of messaging doesn’t help promote vaccine uptake in my opinion

LamieRobertson · Apr 13, 2021

dsr-burnley said:
You can only speak for yourself.

50,000 people this month are dying in loneliness, unable to see their friends and relatives. 50,000 more are in their last month as we write this. We can't just let them die as incidental victims, just part of the cost of making life better for the rest of us; they need to be considered.

Aye ..little consideration given to the ‘cost’ of such measures

sydney · Apr 13, 2021

crodonilson said:
Last summer we were able to socialise outdoors in fairly large groups and indoors with social distancing protocols. I am not talking about lockdown but measures to ensure whilst increase mixing happens we put as much in place as we can to stop covid transmissions.

my mother passed away last May 93 yrs old , in a home , no visitors for the last 7 weeks of her life , i think dsr-burnley is referring to those kinds of people.

dsr-burnley · Apr 13, 2021

sydney said:
my mother passed away last May 93 yrs old , in a home , no visitors for the last 7 weeks of her life , i think dsr-burnley is referring to those kinds of people.

Correct. My sympathies for your loss.

My mother is 88, and not so well as she was this time last year, but fortunately she lives with me. She has seen very few of her friends for a year, she has not shared a cup of coffee with any of them because they are isolating too, and her social life is completely up the Swanee. Many of her friends are worse off. And many of them are not fit enough to sit out except in the finest of fine weather, which is not guaranteed.

For people in nursing homes, it must be far worse.

darkwolf666 · Apr 13, 2021

dsr-burnley said:
You can only speak for yourself.

50,000 people this month are dying in loneliness, unable to see their friends and relatives. 50,000 more are in their last month as we write this. We can't just let them die as incidental victims, just part of the cost of making life better for the rest of us; they need to be considered.

Very emotive language, can I ask for a link to the data that provides those figures please?

Blue Valkyrie · Apr 13, 2021

The Johnson and Johnson vaccine looking like it may have the same rare blood clotting issue as the AZ vaccine ?

Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊

The Vaccine Thread

Would you take a vaccine if offered, as per the post below?

YES - Let's get this COVID thing done and over with.

NO - I still have issues about a rushed vaccine/I don't need to/I'm not happy with being forced to.

UNSURE - I still can't tell what I'll do when it comes to it.

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

Well-known member

A. Virgo, Football Genius

On the road...

Active member

Well-known member

He/Him

Well-known member

Well-known member

He/Him

Well-known member

He/Him

Not awoke

Not awoke

tinky ****in winky

Well-known member

Well-known member

Not seen such Bravery!

Share this page