[Albion] The timing at the end.

trueblue · Sep 27, 2020

Ok, so it'll be time to move on soon but just to be clear... I've had my stopwatch in action..

Albion equalised with a little over 30 seconds of stoppage time remaining. Then, more time needs to be added for the aftermath of the goal.

Steve McManaman declared about 28 seconds after the ball went in that 'the goal will stand Brighton fans'. The VAR check complete, so there was no long delay. BT were on replays but it seems safe to assume much of the time wasted between then and kick-off was Man United moping around feeling sorry for themselves, as they'd all gone down in the box like Bayern Munich in the '99 Champions League Final. Not something for which Albion should be penalised.

In any case, less than 1 min 23 seconds elapsed between the ball hitting the net and the resumption. That was the point BT cut back to the action and the ball was already in play.

In which case, the final whistle should have been blown just after the ball went out for the corner, as United did not have enough time left to take it.

Marginal enough to suggest it's no great conspiracy - but that big club bias in full effect once more. I suspect at Old Trafford, the whistle would have gone and we'd all be sore we didn't get the chance to take the corner. But we'd have one point.

Bold Seagull · Sep 27, 2020

trueblue said:
Ok, so it'll be time to move on soon but just to be clear... I've had my stopwatch in action..

Albion equalised with a little over 30 seconds of stoppage time remaining. Then, more time needs to be added for the aftermath of the goal.

Steve McManaman declared about 28 seconds after the ball went in that 'the goal will stand Brighton fans'. The VAR check complete, so there was no long delay. BT were on replays but it seems safe to assume much of the time wasted between then and kick-off was Man United moping around feeling sorry for themselves, as they'd all gone down in the box like Bayern Munich in the '99 Champions League Final. Not something for which Albion should be penalised.

In any case, less than 1 min 23 seconds elapsed between the ball hitting the net and the resumption. That was the point BT cut back to the action and the ball was already in play.

In which case, the final whistle should have been blown just after the ball went out for the corner, as United did not have enough time left to take it.

Marginal enough to suggest it's no great conspiracy - but that big club bias in full effect once more. I suspect at Old Trafford, the whistle would have gone and we'd all be sore we didn't get the chance to take the corner. But we'd have one point.

I already thought way too much time had been played extra when the ball went out for a throw before the actual corner.

The other point is, we don’t stop the clock each time a ball goes out of play. Scoring a goal and restarting is no different to a slow ball retrieval and goal kick - something we don’t add time on for. I don’t think time needs to be added for scoring and then lining up for the restart, only for excessively long celebrations or a VAR, none of which happened.

WilburySeagull · Sep 27, 2020

once again I repeat that the amount of added time is soleey down to the ref on the pitch. The 4th official simply indicates the minimum that should be added. The only relevant stopwatch after that is the refs.

Wrong-Direction · Sep 27, 2020

You'll find corruption everywhere nowadays. Cheating *******

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Bozza · Sep 27, 2020

If we scored 4:30ish into 5 minutes of added time, then surely there should only be c30 seconds of play remaining, even if we'd taken 15 minutes celebrating our equaliser.

Yes, yes I know it's "a minimum of..." but I can't recall anything happening in those 4 minutes 30 seconds that would have warranted any extra at all.

I suspect Kavanagh had wanted to blow around the time of the corner but, when the corner was given, decided to let it come across before blowing up - "What's the worst that could happen?"

midnight_rendezvous · Sep 27, 2020

Does anyone know the timing between the restart and when the corner was given? Just curious

drummerboy10 · Sep 27, 2020

WilburySeagull said:
once again I repeat that the amount of added time is soleey down to the ref on the pitch. The 4th official simply indicates the minimum that should be added. The only relevant stopwatch after that is the refs.

Which is fine, but like people have said before, you can’t just play until you feel like it. It

trueblue · Sep 27, 2020

midnight_rendezvous said:
Does anyone know the timing between the restart and when the corner was given? Just curious

As above, if the referee added on every single second between us scoring and play resuming (which would be extremely unusual and, I'd say, incorrect) then there was just about time to concede the corner. But not enough for United to take it.

drummerboy10 · Sep 27, 2020

Bozza said:
If we scored 4:30ish into 5 minutes of added time, then surely there should only be c30 seconds of play remaining, even if we'd taken 15 minutes celebrating our equaliser.

Yes, yes I know it's "a minimum of..." but I can't recall anything happening in those 4 minutes 30 seconds that would have warranted any extra at all.

I suspect Kavanagh had wanted to blow around the time of the corner but, when the corner was given, decided to let it come across before blowing up - "What's the worst that could happen?"

Exactly! I’ve seen plenty of games where the referee blows up after a corner is declared, but before it’s taken. Lack of consistency strikes again.

trueblue · Sep 27, 2020

WilburySeagull said:
once again I repeat that the amount of added time is soleey down to the ref on the pitch. The 4th official simply indicates the minimum that should be added. The only relevant stopwatch after that is the refs.

This is true. In which case he must have forgotten to restart it for 20 seconds or so at kick-off. Or, as the 4th official gets his information from the ref, Kavanagh must have, for some reason, not told him long enough in the first place.

trueblue · Sep 27, 2020

Bozza said:
If we scored 4:30ish into 5 minutes of added time, then surely there should only be c30 seconds of play remaining, even if we'd taken 15 minutes celebrating our equaliser.

Yes, yes I know it's "a minimum of..." but I can't recall anything happening in those 4 minutes 30 seconds that would have warranted any extra at all.

I suspect Kavanagh had wanted to blow around the time of the corner but, when the corner was given, decided to let it come across before blowing up - "What's the worst that could happen?"

Indeed. You're bang on. You'd imagine that it would take a few seconds for the ref to stop his watch after a goal (once the celebrations are dragging on) and he'd start it again as soon as the ball was kicked. So the gap should naturally have been even less than the 1'36, or whatever I said, between the two.

Some of the confusion I suppose is that everyone else's clock keeps running. I'm a long standing fan of the independent timekeeper and stadium clock approach to be honest.

LlcoolJ · Sep 27, 2020

I think I have the answer to this. The referee is a wanker.

monkeymz · Sep 27, 2020

i read somewhere that a goal should add 30 seconds to extra time

Music City Gull · Sep 27, 2020

Granted I’ve never actually read the rules, but soccer endings has always seemed to me to be when the ref deems the ball is in a sort of dead area (neutral, nobody really attacking or making a play) or cleared. When a team is attacking or a ball is out of bounds or being kicked in I can’t recall a ref ever blowing his whistle. I’ve always thought that’s kind of weird but just a quirk with the game.

I’ve always kind of thought it makes sense to do like basketball or American football where when the ball is out of bounds or penalty the time stops and/or like a play clock or throw in clock in basketball a team has 5-10 seconds to throw it in or the ball is given to the other team. Always felt like It’s a good way to stop play from slowing at the end and to give the power more to the rules and less to the ref who always has to deal with slow play and complaining players. Eliminate a lot of the extra time by forcing quicker play. In a game that is pushing towards precision like VAR, the ending of games seems very arbitrary.

Though I think the MLS tried his like 20 years ago by using a countdown time instead of counting up and seemed somewhat corny. Basically I have nothing to add, haha.

Bozza · Sep 27, 2020

monkeymz said:
i read somewhere that a goal should add 30 seconds to extra time

I think as a rule of thumb "30 seconds for a sub, and 30 seconds for a goal" is about right, but that doesn't mean you add an additional 30 seconds to whatever is already left - it considers the clock to be running throughout and not stopped.

In yesterday's example, it would mean :"finish the game at 90 + 5'30", not at 90 + 5"

hoveboyslim · Sep 27, 2020

It annoys me how the minutes of added time are treated differently to the rest of the game. Time keeping has to be consistent all the way through. Don’t suddenly adopt the time keeping of American Football

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zefarelly · Sep 27, 2020

I thought Everyone knew about 'Fergie time' ?

An extra minute here or there until Manure big wigs are happy with the result. It's a corporate decision, not a sporting one.

Aspinal's Body Double · Sep 27, 2020

There were no stoppages or substitutions after 90 minutes. We scored on 94. 26. Kavanagh restarted the game on 95.45 ( whistle heard at this point). Manchester United took a corner on 96.28. This was 9 seconds after the full-time whistle should have been blown.

Got screen grabs for all this, but NSC failing to upload goal one

Easy 10 · Sep 27, 2020

Clive Thomas famously chalked off a Brazil "goal" in the 1978 World Cup when Zico headed in from a corner in the dying seconds. He allowed the corner to be taken, but blew for time whilst the ball was in flight and before it had crossed the line. Then he just walked off the pitch.

Shame that twunt Kavanagh didn't have the balls to do that.

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drew · Sep 27, 2020

Not too bothered about whether it was 5mins or 5.3 mins or 6 mins. Since the Clive Thomas debacle, I thought the refs would allow for corners to be taken if the ball has gone out of play before time.

My biggest beef remains the penalties we weren't given.

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[Albion] The timing at the end.

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