Meanwhile in London

Albion Dan · Sep 27, 2020

Guinness Boy said:
So you priortise YOUR vision of the world in the next couple of decades over the health of everyone over 50 living today (that's not me btw, I'm the typical NSC demographic with two school age kids but you couldn't wait to get another incorrect personal assumption in to cover for the fact you didn't answer my question).

You claim to be left wing? That's hilarious. Left wing is all about the protection of the whole of society including, in fact especially, the old and vulnerable. We've seen the government bring in furlough, business support, eat our to help out, review train franchises and open up businesses as safely as possible, but with restrictions. All of those are similar to the central government control proposed by Corbyn that Johnson was deriding only in December.

He's done it - like the civil liberty changes - because we are in an emergency situation. Chicken Run, someone I sometimes disagree with, summed it up brilliantly on another thread. You'd be the person in wartime with your lights on in blackout just to show everyone how free you are.

I'll leave you to retort with your yoga trope again.

Protecting everyone in society means protecting a future for society to enjoy. Also your definition of left wing is incredibly narrow. Look at how it worked out for the millions state murdered under communism for example. There are many many people on the left wing against the approach by government. Like I said this transcends political lines.

We can go beyond Yoga if you think that’s what you need?

darkwolf666 · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
I dont see anything in your post that hasn't been debated and rationale given many many times on this site by me and many others but I'll pander this final time.

Yes I personally believe we should be opening up much more of society with far less restrictions (am happy with social distancing and to be honest I don't even really mind about masks although I still doubt their value outside of crowded spaces) . If a fraction of the BILLIONS this has cost had been used to protect the vulnerable properly then they would be safe and the world would still have a reasonable future.

I think your issue is a total lack of foresight of where the world is heading and the disastrous implications for the younger generations that follow. I get the feeling you might be of an older demographic? Maybe you're selfish and not bothered about impending long lasting economical disaster and the complete re-engineering of social structure our children will be faced with?

Also note that you still desperately want to label everyone not following your perspective into easy to demean audience groups. I'm pleased to let you know I'm not a flat earther, young, or right wing, and not anti 5g in current form now I've spent much time studying it to be comfortable from a work perspective (although have learnt much about the effect of vibrational frequency on the human body and how scary that could be if abused). What the protest showed yesterday is that people standing up are a very broad church with many people just like you but with the ability see what is really happening to the world.

Oh and thanks for the interest in what I was doing before I went to bed. You were doing so well but just had to do that creepy stalker thing again. Breathe in, breathe out. You can come through this, I promise.

Just a question. The death of one of your parents / loved ones / children over the lives of the yet unborn or someone who may or may not commit suicide?

Tough choice! No not really...!

And before I'm accused of making it emotional or personal, damn right, for millions it IS personal and very emotional knowing your loved one could die if they contract the virus.

You carry on supporting militant demonstrations and preaching to your bretheren, while I will batten down the hatches to keep my family safe.

Albion Dan · Sep 27, 2020

darkwolf666 said:
Just a question. The death of one of your parents / loved ones / children over the lives of the yet unborn or someone who may or may not commit suicide?

Tough choice! No not really...!

And before I'm accused of making it emotional or personal, damn right, for millions it IS personal and very emotional knowing your loved one could die if they contract the virus.

You carry on supporting militant demonstrations and preaching to your bretheren, while I will batten down the hatches to keep my family safe.

It wasn’t a militant demonstration it was incredibly peaceful. Then the police waded in and desperately tried to make it violent.

Albion Dan · Sep 27, 2020

Wrong thread

pb21 · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
The organisers of the last lockdown protest were all arrested and fined. A stark difference to the BLM protests.

Firstly, I was referring to the point that people attending the lockdown protest yesterday were treated differently to previous extinction rebellion and BLM protests. However, people attending the lockdown protest yesterday were also treated differently to previous lockdown protests too.

Regarding your point on the organisers of protests, I think there are a couple of important differences. Firstly, I am not sure if there is a specific organiser of the BLM and ER protests, like there is for the anti lockdown protests. Secondly, and more importantly, the organiser of the anti lockdown protest, is actively encouraging people to break government guidance and the law. The BLM and ER protests were undertaken with social distancing etc. encouraged (albeit this probably didn't work out in reality).

Albion Dan · Sep 27, 2020

pb21 said:
Firstly, I was referring to the point that people attending the lockdown protest yesterday were treated differently to previous extinction rebellion and BLM protests. However, people attending the lockdown protest yesterday were also treated differently to previous lockdown protests too.

Regarding your point on the organisers of protests, I think there are a couple of important differences. Firstly, I am not sure if there is a specific organiser of the BLM and ER protests, like there is for the anti lockdown protests. Secondly, and more importantly, the organiser of the anti lockdown protest, is actively encouraging people to break government guidance and the law. The BLM and ER protests were undertaken with social distancing etc. encouraged (albeit this probably didn't work out in reality).

Oh trust me there is 100% an organisation behind BLM and like most political groups there are also unsavoury aspects within.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter

darkwolf666 · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
It wasn’t a militant demonstration it was incredibly peaceful. Then the police waded in and desperately tried to make it violent.

It was a militant demonstration, as it was in clear breach of the current laws of the land and some there were quite happy to have a punch up with the police - and please don't turn that round with whatabout..., i.e. police started it, BLM, etc., etc., etc.

And the choice over who dies?

pb21 · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
Oh trust me there is 100% an organisation behind BLM and like most political groups there are also unsavoury aspects within.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Black_Lives_Matter

I wasn't saying there is no BLM organisation as such, rather there was no specific organiser of the national protests like there was for the last anti lockdown protest.

Guinness Boy · Sep 27, 2020

RossyG said:
It has remained flattened.

In the UK that's factually incorrect.

Albion Dan · Sep 27, 2020

darkwolf666 said:
It was a militant demonstration, as it was in clear breach of the current laws of the land and some there were quite happy to have a punch up with the police - and please don't turn that round with whatabout..., i.e. police started it, BLM, etc., etc., etc.

And the choice over who dies?

You are totally wrong and misguided. The protest was given authorisation to go ahead by the police. The one law you could argue was flouted was social distancing. Exactly like at BLM.

Albion Dan · Sep 27, 2020

pb21 said:
I wasn't saying there is no BLM organisation as such, rather there was no specific organiser of the national protests like there was for the last anti lockdown protest.

BLM were associated to all the events but many were organised locally by many different groups.

Albion Dan · Sep 27, 2020

darkwolf666 said:
And the choice over who dies?

There doesn’t need to be a choice for the millionth time. Invest in protecting the vunerable, simple.

e77 · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
The organisers of the last lockdown protest were all arrested and fined. A stark difference to the BLM protests.

BLM protests were before the fines came in.

darkwolf666 · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
You are totally wrong and misguided. The protest was given authorisation to go ahead by the police. The one law you could argue was flouted was social distancing. Exactly like at BLM.

So As I said, in breach of the laws of the land, which is why the police had to break it up. Despite frequent requests from the police for the demonstrators to social distance, many elected not too, hence the police action.

Despite what you may think, the police in this country don’t go looking for trouble...

Albion Dan · Sep 27, 2020

darkwolf666 said:
Despite what you may think, the police in this country don’t go looking for trouble...

I am stunned a football supporter could ever claim this supposing you have been to away football matches in your lifetime?

darkwolf666 · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
There doesn’t need to be a choice for the millionth time. Invest in protecting the vunerable, simple.

Agree, now demonstrate what that means and how that will look for the vulnerable?

Words like “protect the vulnerable” are cheap and easy, and as [MENTION=6886]Bozza[/MENTION] has demonstrated so eloquently before, very difficult to do without the other measures already in place. Measures you are so clearly against.

I know, let’s have Vulnerable camps, to keep all the vulnerable together out of harms way, bit like New Zealand’s “Covid camps” but in reverse?

darkwolf666 · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
I am stunned a football supporter could ever claim this supposing you have been to away football matches in your lifetime?

Individual officers do sometimes overstep the mark, but policing is not done by bargaining. Chief police officers, often with government guidance, will set out the parameters for how an operation is carried out and it is expected to be done.

Unfortunately in particular when dealing with large crowds, it can’t be done in a Sgt Wilson style, as in “would you kindly mind moving along, there’s a jolly old chap”, sometimes it has to be more forceful. You clearly have little or no trust for “authority” whether it be the police, government, mainstream media or for that matter anyone who doesn’t agree with your opinion.

Weirdly I have attended Brighton football matches home and away for just over 50 years and only once had a run in with the police, and that was when I broke the law, silly me!

Oh, and if you don’t like the way our police do things, try living in a country where they have guns and ****ing great batons - no messing about there!

beorhthelm · Sep 27, 2020

Albion Dan said:
There doesn’t need to be a choice for the millionth time. Invest in protecting the vunerable, simple.

like wearing a mask, so if you are asymptomatic you reduce risk of spreading to the vulnerable?

e77 · Sep 27, 2020

I think all sense of proportion has left the debate in certain areas. Now there are areas we are restricted in such as public gathering that are necessary at the moment but do need constant review. Shutting pubs at 2200 seems a bit arbitrary and hasn't been thought through as off licenses are still open and in larger cities is causing crowds as people go home at once and needs a rethink.

However I really don't get the fuss, outside of people with medical conditions, on wearing face coverings. If you really don't think they do any good, is any great effort to wear them anyway?

RossyG · Sep 27, 2020

I find masks dehumanising and difficult to breathe in, and using them can lead to respiratory disease.

Also, they look ****ing stupid. Have you seen those black designer ones that young people wear? They look like they’ve cut a bra in half.

And what do you find in a bra cup? A tit.

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