[Albion] How much better are we, one year on?

Stat Brother · Jul 13, 2020

Durlston said:
Potter binned off both cups which was an insult to the fans and then we get another relegation battle. Nowhere near good enough.

Deffo because in that time all Potter has done is:-

Completely change the style of play.
Made us enjoyable to watch.
Fully rotate the squad.
Made substitutions when he wanted to not when the clock told him.
Changed formations.
Coped with the traditional striker shortage.
All largely with a CH squad.
Still managed to still reduce the ave age by about 20.
Dealt with a pandemic considerably better than many more experienced managers.

Hardly a glowing résumé for 12 months in charge.

I really wish we were Villa so we could get dry humped by City 3 times this season. In

GOM · Jul 13, 2020

Last season I hated the premier league, this season I like it.

That's the progress

Perfidious Albion · Jul 13, 2020

Position wise we are not a lot better. The way to quickly change it would have been to throw shed loads of money into new players and hope that you have bought wisely. ..but we cannot do that.
It is going to take time to progress but I do see the "green shoots" of improvement.
In Lamptey, McAllister and Alzate we have the makings of three very good players.

southstandandy · Jul 13, 2020

Just happy to have a club at all, let alone be in the Prem, after what happened in the 90's.

I'm accepting of us realistically being a botom 6 club for most seasons and survival is an achievement for us each season, but we all hope that one year we could replicate what Sheff Utd or Wolves have done and that is the dream.

The biggest disappointment for me is the relative ineffectiveness of some of our costlier signings such as Ali J at £17m, Locadia at £15m, Bernardo £9m, Andone £5m, and Izzy at £13.5m (although accepted that injury in his case has scuppered his career with us). But that's still that's the best part of £60m we've seen very little return on and for us that's a lot of money at our level.

Would love to see a bit more value from any future 'expensive additions' but on the flip side players like Lamptey do look a bargain. More like him please!

dazzer6666 · Jul 13, 2020

Stat Brother said:
Deffo because in that time all Potter has done is:-

Completely change the style of play.
Made us enjoyable to watch.
Fully rotate the squad.
Made substitutions when he wanted to not when the clock told him.
Changed formations.
Coped with the traditional striker shortage.
All largely with a CH squad.
Still managed to still reduce the ave age by about 20.
Dealt with a pandemic considerably better than many more experienced managers.

Hardly a glowing résumé for 12 months in charge.

I really wish we were Villa so we could get dry humped by City 3 times this season. In

Yeah, but apart from that, what has Potter actually done ?

neilbard · Jul 13, 2020

2019-20 Season:
5 Home wins, 20 Goals
3 Away wins, 16 Goals

2018-19 Season:
6 Home wins, 19 Goals.
3 Away wins, 16 Goals

Marshy · Jul 13, 2020

Miles better off. I have my love of football back

Grombleton · Jul 13, 2020

For the first season in charge in a new country (management wise) and a new league, it was always going to be about consolidation; learn who the squad is, begin to impart the philosophy on the team and where possible, improve the squad. Mission accomplished.

The biggest difference for me was that last season, you could pick the matchday lineup pretty easily...this time, GOD knows who will be playing and where, the reason for that is that Potter has picked they players he thinks will do best for the opposition we are facing, not necessarily the 'best' players. I like that, it shows a willingness to be flexible and plan ahead. He's made mistakes as any manager has but it's the willingness to try that I like - as much as I loved Hughton, it often felt that there wasn't a Plan B.

I see this season as a slightly longer version of Poyet's first 1/2 season in charge - learn, implement and achieve the target, then improve on that the following season: how that goes with the whole Covid bollocks messing up the standard plan for the season, no-one knows but if anyone can adapt and make the best of it, then i think Potter can. Bloom was confident enough to give him a 6 year deal, and I trust him.

Eric Youngs Contact Lense · Jul 13, 2020

I think we have progressed and have enjoyed it. I am not 100% convinced we are safe, but the commitment of the Club to the longer term really excites me; even if that means the trap door opens. This season has been the same, and ever will it be so, that to get anything from the top teams they need be off the pace and we need to be the best we can be. The games with the big teams, certainly in the last 10 days or so have shown that as have our victories vs. Spurs/Arsenal. What is different in my opinion is the way we have competed, often outplayed for long periods (often not with result to show for it) the teams around us.
Next season will be similar in many ways, but the hope is that we will turn 1 point into 3, make less mistakes in certain games.. (I don't mind losing 0-5 to City, but 4 of the 5 goals were simply horrible from our perspective)
I hope of course that we end with something of a flourish, 4 or 6 points to put the gloss on what has been a good season, albeit a couple of drab draws would do (!) and really look forward to the next moves of TB et al

dazzer6666 · Jul 13, 2020

Grombleton said:
For the first season in charge in a new country (management wise) and a new league, it was always going to be about consolidation; learn who the squad is, begin to impart the philosophy on the team and where possible, improve the squad. Mission accomplished.

The biggest difference for me was that last season, you could pick the matchday lineup pretty easily...this time, GOD knows who will be playing and where, the reason for that is that Potter has picked they players he thinks will do best for the opposition we are facing, not necessarily the 'best' players. I like that, it shows a willingness to be flexible and plan ahead. He's made mistakes as any manager has but it's the willingness to try that I like - as much as I loved Hughton, it often felt that there wasn't a Plan B.

I see this season as a slightly longer version of Poyet's first 1/2 season in charge - learn, implement and achieve the target, then improve on that the following season: how that goes with the whole Covid bollocks messing up the standard plan for the season, no-one knows but if anyone can adapt and make the best of it, then i think Potter can. Bloom was confident enough to give him a 6 year deal, and I trust him.

Not only the lineup, but the tactics, the bus-parking to defend a draw/avoid a caning, the hoofing the ball upfield to no-one (or a totally isolated Muzza), the 71st minute like-for-like substitution..............we're now at the other extreme as GP continues his crazy experiments...........hopefully we'll settle somewhere in the middle, but it's been a much better watch this season.

DJ NOBO · Jul 13, 2020

This argument will never be resolved because it depends how you look on it.
Points-wise - we are not much better off. Love Potter all you like. That is a fact.
Playing-style wise - for the most part, it’s come on a lot at times but not to the extent it’s improved the points tally over the course of the season all that much.

My view - taking into account the ambitious changes In playing style And personnel, I’d take survival this season. A 6/10 for Potter. Fine.
I am hoping for , and expect, better next season though.

dazzer6666 · Jul 13, 2020

DJ NOBO said:
This argument will never be resolved because it depends how you look on it.
Points-wise - we are not much better off. Love Potter all you like. That is a fact.
Playing-style wise - for the most part, it’s come on a lot at times but not to the extent it’s improved the points tally over the course of the season all that much.

My view - taking into account the ambitious changes In playing style And personnel, I’d take survival this season. A 6/10 for Potter. Fine.
I am hoping for , and expect, better next season though.

It will be resolved though. This was always a transitory season and the start of the 'next stage', and alignment of what the first team does closer to the longer term strategy of the club - we could also end up 9 points better than last season - if we do, that would be enormous progress IMO. Anyone expecting the transition to happen in a single season has unrealistic expectations really.
If we get relegated next season it will have clearly failed (as will Potter)
If we're in the relegation mix most of the season it'll be very disappointing - and probably seen as a failure
If we get 50 points it'll be vindicated

Mo Gosfield · Jul 13, 2020

Talk of top ten and solid mid-table is very positive and encouraging but is it realistic? Since it started, 49 different clubs have appeared in the PL. Six in every season and Man City since 2002. Those 7 will not be relegated. It doesn't mean they will be the top seven, it just means they have the pedigree, global support and finance to stay where they are ( Everton included ) That leaves a mini league of 13. Every season that will include three new clubs, who, to some extent will be unknown quantities. One usually overperforms and the other two struggle to stay afloat. On that basis, providing you continue to progress/strengthen, you should finish above two of the promoted teams.
So many clubs have apparently consolidated in the PL ( more than 5 seasons )....Swansea ( 7 ) Stoke ( 9 ) Bolton ( 11 ) Wigan ( 8 ) Charlton ( 7...2nd spell ) Leeds ( 12 ) and Blackburn ( 7...1st spell...incl title....11..2nd spell )...only to eventually find that time runs out. Changes of ownership, changes of management, less effective player recruitment etc. Once the dynamic changes ( even slightly ) the demise starts.
What can we expect. Well, providing the ownership and senior management stays settled and I have no reason to doubt otherwise and the manager is in situ for another 3-4 years, then hopefully we can emulate some of these other clubs.
We are better, in every respect. Its a learning curve. We need more pace and dynamism in midfield and at least another striker. We will still take hammerings but I believe we will get more surprise results than before and that can make the difference between struggling and staying out of trouble. Lets enjoy our time in the top flight and lets not get too far ahead of ourselves.

Lever · Jul 13, 2020

Mo Gosfield said:
Talk of top ten and solid mid-table is very positive and encouraging but is it realistic? Since it started, 49 different clubs have appeared in the PL. Six in every season and Man City since 2002. Those 7 will not be relegated. It doesn't mean they will be the top seven, it just means they have the pedigree, global support and finance to stay where they are ( Everton included ) That leaves a mini league of 13. Every season that will include three new clubs, who, to some extent will be unknown quantities. One usually overperforms and the other two struggle to stay afloat. On that basis, providing you continue to progress/strengthen, you should finish above two of the promoted teams.
So many clubs have apparently consolidated in the PL ( more than 5 seasons )....Swansea ( 7 ) Stoke ( 9 ) Bolton ( 11 ) Wigan ( 8 ) Charlton ( 7...2nd spell ) Leeds ( 12 ) and Blackburn ( 7...1st spell...incl title....11..2nd spell )...only to eventually find that time runs out. Changes of ownership, changes of management, less effective player recruitment etc. Once the dynamic changes ( even slightly ) the demise starts.
What can we expect. Well, providing the ownership and senior management stays settled and I have no reason to doubt otherwise and the manager is in situ for another 3-4 years, then hopefully we can emulate some of these other clubs.
We are better, in every respect. Its a learning curve. We need more pace and dynamism in midfield and at least another striker. We will still take hammerings but I believe we will get more surprise results than before and that can make the difference between struggling and staying out of trouble. Lets enjoy our time in the top flight and lets not get too far ahead of ourselves.

I think this just about sums it up...

Albumen · Jul 13, 2020

Kosh said:
So, yeah, it’s been a year or so since we made our ‘progressive’ appointment. The question being, just how much or indeed little genuine progress have we made?

No loaded question, just after thoughts...

My thoughts centre around two fine managers, two wholly differing approaches, same singular outcome. We’ve found a new way to win, and a new way to lose - with style? Hmmmmmmmm

Points wise, we’ve not really progressed, style wise (sometimes) yes, sometimes not really for me. The highs we saw under CH (at this level) Utd at home (for a start) were brilliant deserved victories as was this year at Arsenal... ultimately though, if you remove the gloss... yes we’ve arrested the CH slide, but not really much else.

The core of our squad remains, unable to push beyond its obvious limitations and thus a rebuild is required... that or a bigger influx of academy level Alzate types... who can cut it.

Two different approaches, same outcome = obvious issue with resources. I sincerely hope we let a few move on this summer as apposed to hoping GP can finally turn Dale Stephens (for example) into Patrick Viera.

It’s that or settle for our perennial battle against the rest of the bottom five.

Money will be a real issue, so I suspect youth is the road map but surely we all recognise the dire need for actual ****ing quality.

Thoughts?

Is this because we lost 5-0 to City and Liverpool only lost 4-0 to them?

DJ NOBO · Jul 13, 2020

dazzer6666 said:
It will be resolved though. This was always a transitory season and the start of the 'next stage', and alignment of what the first team does closer to the longer term strategy of the club - we could also end up 9 points better than last season - if we do, that would be enormous progress IMO. Anyone expecting the transition to happen in a single season has unrealistic expectations really.
If we get relegated next season it will have clearly failed (as will Potter)
If we're in the relegation mix most of the season it'll be very disappointing - and probably seen as a failure
If we get 50 points it'll be vindicated

I meant never resolved , as Resolved in this thread now. Not put too well, I give you.
PotterBall (such a convenient word) will definitely look Good if we win the last three. Much less, and it’s a marginal Points improvement from Hughton.
When you talk about Unrealistic expectations for this season, I agree with you .....although didn’t the club itself ramp up Expectations when Potter was appointed?
Your assessment of next season is bang on.

dazzer6666 · Jul 13, 2020

DJ NOBO said:
I meant never resolved , as Resolved in this thread now. Not put too well, I give you.
PotterBall (such a convenient word) will definitely look Good if we win the last three. Much less, and it’s a marginal Points improvement from Hughton.
When you talk about Unrealistic expectations for this season, I agree with you .....although didn’t the club itself ramp up Expectations when Potter was appointed?
Your assessment of next season is bang on.

Yeah...bit of a circular discussion now really. It'll be another couple of seasons before we really know whether it's solidly going the right way - problem for Potter (and the club) is any blip and it all unravels if we're relegated (or even seriously threatened). Tony will be looking for gradual and visible improvement - the 'top ten' thing he's publicly stated isn't an immediate thing. The reaction from some fans to the City game (not just on here) is laughable though. They've had multiple 5-0 wins this season (and beat Liverpool 4-0), we rested key players, had just played Liverpool (and did OK for an hour) yet we instantly seem to want half the squad binned off. #teamslikeBrighton will always get a couple of canings every season - I'm just glad it was City and not ****ing Bournemouth

seagulls99 · Jul 13, 2020

I appreciate that 'xGoals/xPTS' etc has its limitations however last season's xPTS under Hughton was 36 (coincidentally what we ended up on) and this season's xPTS is currently 45, with 3 matches to go. Project Potter has without doubt been a success and if luck had been on our side or we had been more clinical we would be in the Everton/Southampton bracket as opposed to the Watford/West Ham bracket. A couple of proven acquisitions at striker and perhaps left back will enable us to push on even further next season.

CheeseRolls · Jul 13, 2020

Potter deserves huge respect for the way he has handled the dressing room. The decision to move both Andone and Locadia on was a gamble. Locadia has been missed said no one ever and Andone's season has been a mixture of injury and the odd spark. There is no doubt this is a Potter team now, with opportunities for young players if they are good enough.

We are also starting to see a side capable of scoring on the counter attack. Has any manager delivered this since Micky Adams first time round?

Things look promising for next season, particularly if we can get a couple of quality new payers in.

Terry Butcher Tribute Act · Jul 13, 2020

Personally i think I'd have enjoyed the season more without the relentless blowing smoke up the arse of 'Potterball' and the Ashworth project. The club spin on everything is tedious.

I don't especially enjoy the football. We've very few players that would get a crowd off their seat. It's largely relentless passing. Good up to a point...

It's an improvement because we were in dire straights at the end of last year, but not the wonderful experience the clubs PR machine would want you to believe. Last year we stayed up with 2 games to play and this year will do similar, helped with the season being reset to help our shocking run. Maupay and Lamptey have looked good, as has Alzate. Trossard has been disappointing until a week ago.

Baffling changes, poor selections, a weird contract extension for the manager, the rushed recall of Alexis, freezing out Duffy and Glenn, completely overusing Connolly, total reluctance to play with wingers and some frankly crap results mainly at home have been frustrating.

But there have been glimpses. Arsenal away was exceptional, as was Palace away first half, Spurs at home, and no doubt others. It's a long term project and one we'll really know the benefits of in a few months time.

6/10

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