Main Coronavirus / Covid-19 Discussion Thread

Billy the Fish · May 17, 2021

Just reading that most of the hospitalised people hadn't taken up their vaccine offer.

That in itself is reason enough not to delay the roadmap.

I'm all for personal choice and allowing people the freedom to decline, but if you don't get vaccinated and subsequently end up in hospital that's down to you.

The Clamp · May 17, 2021

Yoda said:
Oi! I work in IT and I can't wait to get back to the office.

The only trouble is our office closed due to the building the local CCG were using ended their lease for a new one without enough space for us too, the contract that my CSU has with them expires in 5 months and we are being tuped to a new CSU that will be providing the service.
Due to this they won't be finding us an office to work in for the rest of the contract. Currently waiting to hear what the new CSU have in plan for us. So I'm stuck working from home until at least the beginning of November at the earliest.

Of course. It’s not going to be possible to just walk out of lockdown and back to an office. As you say, many of them simply aren’t there anymore.
Genuinely wish you the best of luck

The Clamp · May 17, 2021

Billy the Fish said:
Just reading that most of the hospitalised people hadn't taken up their vaccine offer.

That in itself is reason enough not to delay the roadmap.

I'm all for personal choice and allowing people the freedom to decline, but if you don't get vaccinated and subsequently end up in hospital that's down to you.

This. All day long.

darkwolf666 · May 17, 2021

The Clamp said:
Yes, sounds reasonable. For a couple of months . We can’t have people sat indoors, collecting benefits indefinitely while the rest of us continue to go to work and risk our health to pay their way. The country needs to get up and running, everyone playing their part. Including the jobseekers. Far too many shirkers hiding behind Covid anxiety. The free ride is over, I’m afraid.

I'm sort of hoping your reply is slightly tongue in cheek as I thought you worked in the caring profession, but cleay don't care! Or I've been wooshed!

What about those classified as extremely vulnerable and who may get some small amount of benefit, you going to force them Into a situation where they may not be safe?

Think you should put your copy of the Daily Mail down and realise not everyone on benefit is a scrounger!

The Clamp · May 17, 2021

darkwolf666 said:
I'm sort of hoping your reply is slightly tongue in cheek as I thought you worked in the caring profession, but cleay don't care! Or I've been wooshed!

What about those asskfied as extremely vulnerable a d who may get some small amount of benefit, you going to force them I to a situation where they may not be safe?

Think you should put your copy of the Daily Mail down and realise not everyone on benefit is a scrounger!

You’re right, I’m being a bit tongue in cheek. I’ve salted the bacon somewhat in my responses but I do feel, when safe and appropriate for the majority, that we need to get going again now and nerves are going to have to be overcome. As mammoth a task as that may seem to some right now. They’ve not been in the Trenches or being shelled in The Somme. They’ve been gently coaxed by Joe Wicks and have struggled a bit with their cross-stitch.

crodonilson · May 17, 2021

Billy the Fish said:
Just reading that most of the hospitalised people hadn't taken up their vaccine offer.

That in itself is reason enough not to delay the roadmap.

I'm all for personal choice and allowing people the freedom to decline, but if you don't get vaccinated and subsequently end up in hospital that's down to you.

It is but the hospital don't get the choice of whether to take that patient in or not and a surge in cases amongst the unvaccinated will take a lot of the resource for the NHS and many other services will once again suffer as a consequence, not to mention the fact that after the last 15 months many NHS professionals are physically and mentally drained.

dazzer6666 · May 17, 2021

crodonilson said:
It is but the hospital don't get the choice of whether to take that patient in or not and a surge in cases amongst the unvaccinated will take a lot of the resource for the NHS and many other services will once again suffer as a consequence, not to mention the fact that after the last 15 months many NHS professionals are physically and mentally drained.

Genuinely struggling to see how enough people are going to get sick enough to cause an overwhelming of the NHS. The numbers - assuming the vaccine is as effective as the data from multiple countries (including India) is showing - simply don't point to a material number ending up in hospital except in the extreme worst cases outlined in the modelling.

crodonilson · May 17, 2021

dazzer6666 said:
Genuinely struggling to see how enough people are going to get sick enough to cause an overwhelming of the NHS. The numbers - assuming the vaccine is as effective as the data from multiple countries (including India) is showing - simply don't point to a material number ending up in hospital except in the extreme worst cases outlined in the modelling.

It can only be because they are anticipating would could be an explosion in cases, even young people get sick and can be hospitalised, amongst the unvaccinated and with indoor meetings the virus could now spread like wildfire. If enough people get it, even if only a small proportion overall are hospitalised as a percentage of cases this can still put extreme pressure on the NHS. The NHS was under great strain in the first wave when hospitalisations peaked at just over 20,000 then the second wave when it peaked at 40,000, there is now a huge backlog on most other services, even hospitalisations into 5 figures will put great strain on an already exhausted workforce.

dazzer6666 · May 17, 2021

crodonilson said:
It can only be because they are anticipating would could be an explosion in cases, even young people get sick and can be hospitalised, amongst the unvaccinated and with indoor meetings the virus could now spread like wildfire. If enough people get it, even if only a small proportion overall are hospitalised as a percentage of cases this can still put extreme pressure on the NHS. The NHS was under great strain in the first wave when hospitalisations peaked at just over 20,000 then the second wave when it peaked at 40,000, there is now a huge backlog on most other services, even hospitalisations into 5 figures will put great strain on an already exhausted workforce.

Explosion
Wildfire
Extreme pressure
Great strain
Huge backlog
Great strain
Exhausted

Take a break from the media fella, you’re not helping yourself

Hugo Rune · May 17, 2021

nicko31 said:
Yep, they are breaking their own rules

View attachment 136788

Sadly they are going ahead, IMHO we're taking a big step into the unknown

In the absence of this we need a complete vaccine blitz and surge testing in areas with the Indian variant NOW and hope for best

And now we get this, hidden away after the 10 O’clock news programmes so that the loosening of restrictions gets the positive headlines the Government want.

This variant is incredibly contagious.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57150131

“Mr Hancock told the House of Commons there were now 2,323 confirmed cases of the Indian variant in the UK.
This means there has been a 77% increase in confirmed cases of the variant over the last five days.
"There are now 86 local authorities where there are five or more confirmed cases," he said. There are 343 local authorities in England.”

This variant is surely going to rip through our under 40’s and those eligible vaccine dodgers killing hundreds or even thousands as the Government tries to avoid yet another lockdown having failed to stop it getting into this Country at source for political reasons. FFS.

crodonilson · May 17, 2021

Hugo Rune said:
And now we get this, hidden away after the 10 O’clock news programmes so that the loosening of restrictions gets the positive headlines the Government want.

This variant is incredibly contagious.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57150131

“Mr Hancock told the House of Commons there were now 2,323 confirmed cases of the Indian variant in the UK.
This means there has been a 77% increase in confirmed cases of the variant over the last five days.
"There are now 86 local authorities where there are five or more confirmed cases," he said. There are 343 local authorities in England.”

This variant is surely going to rip through our under 40’s and those eligible vaccine dodgers killing hundreds or even thousands as the Government tries to avoid yet another lockdown having failed to stop it getting into this Country at source for political reasons. FFS.

Looks like the government is now quickly rowing back on 21st June and may reverse some of today's unlocking before then.

https://www.itv.com/news/2021-05-17/covid-likelihood-of-full-lockdown-restrictions-being-lifted-on-june-21-close-to-nil

Yoda · May 18, 2021

Hugo Rune said:
And now we get this, hidden away after the 10 O’clock news programmes so that the loosening of restrictions gets the positive headlines the Government want.

This variant is incredibly contagious.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-57150131

“Mr Hancock told the House of Commons there were now 2,323 confirmed cases of the Indian variant in the UK.
This means there has been a 77% increase in confirmed cases of the variant over the last five days.
"There are now 86 local authorities where there are five or more confirmed cases," he said. There are 343 local authorities in England.”

This variant is surely going to rip through our under 40’s and those eligible vaccine dodgers killing hundreds or even thousands as the Government tries to avoid yet another lockdown having failed to stop it getting into this Country at source for political reasons. FFS.

I would love to know where these new 1010 cases plot on this chart. We need to know when the samples were from as they may be linked either to someone arriving back from India or a direct travel contact. In which case, community spread may still be low and under control.

Note what it says on the chart: "Due to the lag in sequencing variant cases can be identified many weeks after the sample date."

Blue Valkyrie · May 18, 2021

Billy the Fish said:
Just reading that most of the hospitalised people hadn't taken up their vaccine offer.

That in itself is reason enough not to delay the roadmap.

I'm all for personal choice and allowing people the freedom to decline, but if you don't get vaccinated and subsequently end up in hospital that's down to you.

Indeed. It is down to them. Darwinism.

But also down to them will be the withdrawal of non-covid hospital services for others as they take up the resources.

Hamilton · May 18, 2021

Why, with a new variant emerging, are we letting people jet off on holiday?

Why was India not on the red list earlier?

Why were people traveling to India in the first place? Except for essential reasons (not weddings)

Why?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

beorhthelm · May 18, 2021

Hamilton said:
Why, with a new variant emerging, are we letting people jet off on holiday?

Why was India not on the red list earlier?

Why were people traveling to India in the first place? Except for essential reasons (not weddings)

Why?

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

we know these things:
because holiday's are apparently a human right.
because other countries hadnt banned or limited travel. (they still havent limited travel, only imposed quarantine)
because families and travelling for religious festivals, and to look after ill relatives. (ironic eh?)

the variant only got classified as "of concern" in May, a couple of weeks after restrictions came in, which was largely because of general infection rates in India.

dazzer6666 · May 18, 2021

No discernible change in number of people testing positive over the last week.......around 2k per day, as it’s been for several weeks now. Assume almost all of these must now be the Indian variant if it’s ‘ripping through the population’ and ‘spreading like wildfire’.

Poojah · May 18, 2021

dazzer6666 said:
No discernible change in number of people testing positive over the last week.......around 2k per day, as it’s been for several weeks now. Assume almost all of these must now be the Indian variant if it’s ‘ripping through the population’ and ‘spreading like wildfire’.

The latest from the BBC seems to suggest that it will become the dominant strain in the ‘coming days’. Sounds scary, but what does that really mean? The consensus seems to be that the Indian variant is more transmissible than the Kent variant, but also that it is no more immune to protection from vaccines.

Whilst it clearly has spread ‘like wildfire’ in India, the conditions there are regrettably very different. To my knowledge, the Indian variant has yet to encounter a population as well immunised as the UK yet (at least in any meaningful way) - as such forecasting the impact it will have on cases and more importantly illness seems to be based on little more than wild speculation.

Quite right to be monitoring the situation, but once again the doom mongering media hyperbole is both frustrating and premature. It’s like they couldn’t wait.

crodonilson · May 18, 2021

dazzer6666 said:
No discernible change in number of people testing positive over the last week.......around 2k per day, as it’s been for several weeks now. Assume almost all of these must now be the Indian variant if it’s ‘ripping through the population’ and ‘spreading like wildfire’.

We should have learned by now that's not how covid works and taking the whole cases across the UK on face value doesn't tell the true picture. At the moment there are small clusters where the indian variant is taking hold. Bolton, Blackburn, Glasgow, Bedford. Look at the increase in cases in this areas in the past few weeks when starting from very small numbers and with many restrictions still in place. With indoor mixing, hugging and hospitality now open and people moving freely across the country the likelihood is this now spreads to more towns/cities and ultimately nationwide, so the increase in numbers in areas where the Indian variant is becoming the dominant strain will be repeated elsewhere and now multiply quicker, that will feed through to the national numbers which are already modestly rising within a few weeks. We have to hope that the transmissibility isn't as much as the 50% doomsday scenarios predicted by some members of SAGE otherwise we could be in real trouble.

Kinky Gerbil · May 18, 2021

Poojah said:
The latest from the BBC seems to suggest that it will become the dominant strain in the ‘coming days’. Sounds scary, but what does that really mean? The consensus seems to be that the Indian variant is more transmissible than the Kent variant, but also that it is no more immune to protection from vaccines.

Whilst it clearly has spread ‘like wildfire’ in India, the conditions there are regrettably very different. To my knowledge, the Indian variant has yet to encounter a population as well immunised as the UK yet (at least in any meaningful way) - as such forecasting the impact it will have on cases and more importantly illness seems to be based on little more than wild speculation.

Quite right to be monitoring the situation, but once again the doom mongering media hyperbole is both frustrating and premature. It’s like they couldn’t wait.

The more that comes out makes me think this is just a vaccine drive.

Get vaccinated or else

Poojah · May 18, 2021

Kinky Gerbils said:
The more that comes out makes me think this is just a vaccine drive.

Get vaccinated or else

Seems to be effective if so. Apparently a significant number of people queueing for their vaccine in Bolton yesterday were from a demographic which has been eligible for vaccination for some time.

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