Thompson720
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Angus Gunn masterclass
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[Albion] Premier League 20 - 22/9
- Thread starter Bozza
- Start date
I missed the penalty incident to which you're referring, so have no idea if I would have given it. But, the video assistant isn't judging whether he would give the decision, so we don't know if he would or wouldn't give something based on whether a call you disagree with isn't overturned. He might have thought 'I'd've given that' but his job is to look at the video and judge whether or not he 'can see why the ref gave it'.
I thought the VAR was there to intervene and correct 'clear and obvious errors.' Based on your comments above, the VAR is essentially nothing more than another pundit.
But we're not looking at 'can see why the ref gave it'- but the opposite. ie: 'should the ref have given it?' And that it what VAR is meant to decide.
It’s about time we got to hear the audio link between the ref and VAR, at least then we could try and understand how they arrive at these farcical decisions.
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That's what fans wanted from VAR. That's not how it is being implemented, nor what was promised at the start of the season when they explained how it would work.
https://www.skysports.com/football/news/11661/11777969/var-in-the-premier-league-the-ultimate-qa
(this section of the Q&A talks about red cards, but equally, fouls/penalties are subjective, so you can replace 'red card' with 'penalty')
Sounds fair. OK, subjective decisions: talk to me…
For example, the decision whether to show a red card for a tackle still comes down to perception.
A lot of weight is given to the referee's initial, real-time perception of a tackle. If the referee acknowledges that a defender has gone in high and more or less describes what the VAR can see on screen, and still shows a yellow card, that decision is likely to stick, unless VAR shows the referee has missed a major characteristic of the tackle.
I'm getting there... what do you mean by the referee's initial perception?
This is where it gets a bit complicated.
Because VAR only deals with "clear and obvious" errors or "serious missed incidents", if a referee does see an incident, then describes that incident accurately and disciplines accordingly, it is difficult to overturn. That is, unless they've missed a characteristic of the incident that the VAR deems to be serious.
A good example comes from Manchester City's 2-1 win over Liverpool in January, where Anthony Taylor showed Vincent Kompany a yellow card for a foul on Mohamed Salah. Many felt the tackle warranted a red, but if Taylor's words to the VAR more or less mirrored what we could see on screen - one foot off the floor, studs up, eventually wins the ball and just catches Salah - it is difficult to overturn.
Even with VAR, it is very unlikely Kompany would have been shown a red card in that situation if Taylor had described it accurately to the VAR.
For example, the decision whether to show a red card for a tackle still comes down to perception.
A lot of weight is given to the referee's initial, real-time perception of a tackle. If the referee acknowledges that a defender has gone in high and more or less describes what the VAR can see on screen, and still shows a yellow card, that decision is likely to stick, unless VAR shows the referee has missed a major characteristic of the tackle.
I'm getting there... what do you mean by the referee's initial perception?
This is where it gets a bit complicated.
Because VAR only deals with "clear and obvious" errors or "serious missed incidents", if a referee does see an incident, then describes that incident accurately and disciplines accordingly, it is difficult to overturn. That is, unless they've missed a characteristic of the incident that the VAR deems to be serious.
A good example comes from Manchester City's 2-1 win over Liverpool in January, where Anthony Taylor showed Vincent Kompany a yellow card for a foul on Mohamed Salah. Many felt the tackle warranted a red, but if Taylor's words to the VAR more or less mirrored what we could see on screen - one foot off the floor, studs up, eventually wins the ball and just catches Salah - it is difficult to overturn.
Even with VAR, it is very unlikely Kompany would have been shown a red card in that situation if Taylor had described it accurately to the VAR.
I thought the VAR was there to intervene and correct 'clear and obvious errors.' Based on your comments above, the VAR is essentially nothing more than another pundit.
Well, pundits tend to side with fans and disagree with refs and how they are interpreting the laws. Maybe instead of pundit, they're just a defensive stooge sent out to back up the decisions. And again, only subjective ones. For objective decisions they are cold machines, only interested in calculations, not the spirit of the game or entertainment.
Last edited:
- Thread starter
- #48
Leicester touching 2/1 looks value against Spurs who were in Greece on Wednesday night.
Allowing clearly incorrect no penalty calls, because they can’t overrule the subjective view of the ref is a complete copout. Last week a Newcastle defender blatantly held a Liverpool player down in the 6 yard box when a heading opportunity, last night Bmuf denied.
All a silly attempt by FIFA not to undermine refs as they see it.
In Cricket and Rugby the view of the video official is critical, and no one argues that the umpires/referee has been undermined. Initial judgements overturned or looked at to give the equitable decision.
VAR gives the evidence, so use it fully.
All a silly attempt by FIFA not to undermine refs as they see it.
In Cricket and Rugby the view of the video official is critical, and no one argues that the umpires/referee has been undermined. Initial judgements overturned or looked at to give the equitable decision.
VAR gives the evidence, so use it fully.
Palacefinder General
Well-known member
- Apr 5, 2019
- 2,594
Absolutely ridiculous spread of PL games, having FOUR played on a Sunday to feed the TV machine that in turn feeds this league. Rumours that the quality football mag When Saturday Comes is considering renaming itself When Friday, Saturday and Sunday Comes are apparently wide of the mark.
Dick Swiveller
Well-known member
- Sep 9, 2011
- 9,154
No different tomorrow than previous years. Two TV games and two games moved for Europa League involvement.
crookie
Well-known member
Only 3 Saturday 3 o clocks. Who'll be the odd man out on Soccer Saturday?
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Vankleek Hill Seagull
Well-known member
What a goal from Harry Kane. 
VAL1850
Well-known member
Should be a credible fith on MoTD
Green Cross Code Man
Wunt be druv
VAR. Destroys football once more.
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
Pathetic, that was in line and if that's that tight the goal should be given
Green Cross Code Man
Wunt be druv
Exactly. Scrap it NOW.
martin tyler
Well-known member
- Jan 25, 2013
- 5,844
Stupid that is. He is in line.
Problem is really like just happened gives home crowd and players a massive lift and 2 mins later 1-1
Problem is really like just happened gives home crowd and players a massive lift and 2 mins later 1-1
Ernest
Stupid IDIOT
If the line is on top of each other as that was then they are in line