[News] Shemima Begum being secretly flown to UK - Cherie Blair representing!

Eeyore · Sep 14, 2019

crookie said:
Be surprised if we didn't have special forces there with the Yanks, and obviously the RAF have been heavily involved, but yeah hardly on the Guy Fawkes level of treason !!

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Treason would be such a hypocritical charge. It would be more a charge of fighting against government policy which changes with the wind.

The UK government are familiar with supporting/funding groups which engage in nefarious activity- and changing sides where appropriate. The support of some groups is an endorsement of those activities and, if Begum has not actually killed anyone personally, just as bad.

This is not defend the actions of those who went to join IS. There is no justification for it. But to start quoting 'treason' leads to suggesting that not unquestionably supporting UK policy is treacherous. There are wider implications in that.

Green Cross Code Man · Sep 14, 2019

Brighton Lines said:
Treason would be such a hypocritical charge. It would be more a charge of fighting against government policy which changes with the wind.

The UK government are familiar with supporting/funding groups which engage in nefarious activity- and changing sides where appropriate. The support of some groups is an endorsement of those activities and, if Begum has not actually killed anyone personally, just as bad.

This is not defend the actions of those who went to join IS. There is no justification for it. But to start quoting 'treason' leads to suggesting that not unquestionably supporting UK policy is treacherous. There are wider implications in that.

Ridiculous argument. 'Not unquestionably supporting UK policy'. There was a huge march against the foolish war Blair and Bush unleashed, no-one was suggesting any of those people were committing treason. Going off to support a revolutionary movement that implicitly wishes to destroy the Western way of life and all of its freedoms is far removed from 'not unquestionably supporting UK policy'.

crookie · Sep 14, 2019

Brighton Lines said:
Treason would be such a hypocritical charge. It would be more a charge of fighting against government policy which changes with the wind.

The UK government are familiar with supporting/funding groups which engage in nefarious activity- and changing sides where appropriate. The support of some groups is an endorsement of those activities and, if Begum has not actually killed anyone personally, just as bad.

This is not defend the actions of those who went to join IS. There is no justification for it. But to start quoting 'treason' leads to suggesting that not unquestionably supporting UK policy is treacherous. There are wider implications in that.

I agree with a lot of that. But IS stated aims are/were the destruction of the Western way of life as we know it and the introduction of Sharia Law. Not specifically a campaign against any government, so in that sense you could argue being part of that group means you were fighting against Britain, the country, rather than against the Government in particular.

That said personally I can't see that charge sticking. Being a member of a proscribed terrorist organisation would be more likely. She has admitted to that, so pretty much open and shut case. Not really sure what the appropriate punishment for that should be though

Eeyore · Sep 14, 2019

Green Cross Code Man said:
Ridiculous argument. 'Not unquestionably supporting UK policy'. There was a huge march against the foolish war Blair and Bush unleashed, no-one was suggesting any of those people were committing treason. Going off to support a revolutionary movement that implicitly wishes to destroy the Western way of life and all of its freedoms is far removed from 'not unquestionably supporting UK policy'.

Although the some governments are not adverse to support such groups and regimes when it suits their needs.

Eeyore · Sep 14, 2019

crookie said:
I agree with a lot of that. But IS stated aims are/were the destruction of the Western way of life as we know it and the introduction of Sharia Law. Not specifically a campaign against any government, so in that sense you could argue being part of that group means you were fighting against Britain, the country, rather than against the Government in particular.

That said personally I can't see that charge sticking. Being a member of a proscribed terrorist organisation would be more likely. She has admitted to that, so pretty much open and shut case. Not really sure what the appropriate punishment for that should be though

Yes, being a member of IS is an affront to any value and standard. I agree.

But I'm tired of the endless delineation of goodies and baddies. Simply because it is fluid and changeable. The Saudi regime is one such example. Hard line religious law and questionable foreign policy that runs against our values. Yet they are still kept onside.

carlzeiss · Sep 26, 2019

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/index.html

'I've lost my babies. I've lost my friends. I just want to come home': Jihadi bride Shamima Begum says she's a changed woman (complete with lip gloss and nose stud) after moving to a new Syrian camp. So do YOU have any sympathy?

papajaff · Sep 26, 2019

carlzeiss said:
[So do YOU have any sympathy?

None whatsoever. She'll obviously be allowed back in but prosecute the idiot and shove her in jail for a long time.

schmunk · Sep 26, 2019

carlzeiss said:
(complete with lip gloss and nose stud)

I'd imagine the dry heat of Syria plays havoc with lip health, and a nose stud is a symbol of marriage in Islam.

blue-shifted · Sep 26, 2019

carlzeiss said:
https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/index.html

'I've lost my babies. I've lost my friends. I just want to come home': Jihadi bride Shamima Begum says she's a changed woman (complete with lip gloss and nose stud) after moving to a new Syrian camp. So do YOU have any sympathy?

No real sympathy. As long as the law is followed (a bit out of fashion perhaps) and the correct justice is served and nobody else gets hurt, i'll be happy enough

blue-shifted · Sep 26, 2019

schmunk said:
I'd imagine the dry heat of Syria plays havoc with lip health, and a nose stud is a symbol of marriage in Islam.

Or possibly she now has a PR person telling her that if she wants freedom, she has to first win in the tabloid court of popular opinion

Hastings gull · Sep 26, 2019

blue-shifted said:
Or possibly she now has a PR person telling her that if she wants freedom, she has to first win in the tabloid court of popular opinion

That is what one inevitably suspects. Get a nose job and a bit on the lip to look westernised, and hey presto, a few cosmetic changes, and you are a changed person. Somehow you just know what the outcome will be.

Guinness Boy · Sep 26, 2019

Hastings gull said:
That is what one inevitably suspects. Get a nose job and a bit on the lip to look westernised, and hey presto, a few cosmetic changes, and you are a changed person. Somehow you just know what the outcome will be.

Why would you need to look Westernised to be accepted?

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Springal · Sep 26, 2019

Is this the longest secret flight in the world?

marlowe · Sep 26, 2019

schmunk said:
.......and a nose stud is a symbol of marriage in Islam.

It's a symbol of marriage in Hindu culture, not Islamic culture.

vegster · Sep 26, 2019

Springal said:
Is this the longest secret flight in the world?

It's a handy little item to bring up periodically if you are a rabid Daily Mail reader, it has the handy double whammy of trying to smear Blair at the same time. Obviously the flight has to be " secret " in order to build a bit more outrage that it is being done over the heads of " ordinary right minded people " . I fully expect further postings/bounces of this on chat forums and FB on a regular basis.

hoof hearted · Sep 26, 2019

clapham_gull said:
Worth pointing out to the rabid frothing at the mouth string them up no deal leave means leave this is a Christian country I didn't vote for that in the 70s bring back hanging Tommy Robinson isn't a racist bloody Scottish judges enemy of the people we lived through rationing don't surrender brigade....

That one of your pin ups Rees Mogg wants her brought home to face justice.

Confusing isn't it ?

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It's probably only confusing to you, seeing as you like to pigeonhole people.

I consider myself left wing, but I have to say the left their own worst enemy.

Hastings gull · Sep 26, 2019

lawros left foot said:
A nice little distraction for all the right wing nutters, when Johnson goes back on his’dead in a ditch’ Brexit. Gotta keep the proles from thinking how they are being screwed over by the real elite in this country.

Another one so arrogant as to write off millions as being below his apparent intellect. I am genuinely not trying to make a political point, but it is fascinating how many folk of left-wing persuasion, who profess to be on the side of the many, can be so snooty and dismissive of others.

Hastings gull · Sep 26, 2019

Guinness Boy said:
Why would you need to look Westernised to be accepted?

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You can't be that naïve, surely. She is being advised that to be more readily accepted it would be a good idea to show visually that she looks like the rest of us and not in a fashion that can be associated with radical islam.

Springal · Sep 26, 2019

Hastings gull said:
You can't be that naïve, surely. She is being advised that to be more readily accepted it would be a good idea to show visually that she looks like the rest of us and not in a fashion that can be associated with radical islam.

Bloody hell thats well clever, the public will defo fall for that

lawros left foot · Sep 26, 2019

Hastings gull said:
Another one so arrogant as to write off millions as being below his apparent intellect. I am genuinely not trying to make a political point, but it is fascinating how many folk of left-wing persuasion, who profess to be on the side of the many, can be so snooty and dismissive of others.

Don’t be a tw@, I left school at 16, with 3 o levels, hardly an intellectual.
It seems pretty obvious from reading some of the posts on here, that some of those of a right wing persuasion will swallow anything the Sun, Mail , Express , etc put in their grubby little pages.
If you don’t want to be called thick, don’t act thick.
Easy.

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[News] Shemima Begum being secretly flown to UK - Cherie Blair representing!

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