[Football] Its simple, copy cricket and tennis.

Saunders · Aug 19, 2019

I will confess that I want VAR I feel it will reduce cheating and we will benefit from it. However as with all sports that have introduced it, it isnt going well at the beginning. Even the stop start American Football game has now made it so the coach has so many challenges to make i feel that will be the way to go otherwise there is a temptation from the officials to review everything.

The biggest problems at the moment are:
1. A reluctance of the officials to tell us when they are reviewing an incident. They are doing this to either avoid controversy or having to add on extra time for these reviews. Added time should be higher this year on average due to us having these reviews It wont be though on the evidence so far it will be your average 4-5 minutes. 1 minute was added at half time on Saturday.
2.The wording of "clear and obvious" it isnt clear to the fans what this means ie black and white decisions so this will include a toe being offside or it skimming someones arm.
3.The handball law has now been ruined just so that they wouldnt be criticised over a handball being deliberate or not.
4. Fans in the ground are the least informed and cannot fully celebrate a goal until the game has kicked off again because they wont tell us if the goal is under review or not. We need the referee miced up or whoever is making the decision to review to QUICKLY update the scoreboard.

end rant.

Harry Wilson's tackle · Aug 19, 2019

Green Cross Code Man said:
Var is like Brexit. But in this case the leave majority is not close but overwhelming.

Is it? Really? I disagree. Not even on here where small numbers of repeat posters can give the impression their opinion prevails is it obvious that most people support binning VAR.

Why are MOTD and managers in favour of VAR if it so obviously should be binned?

Finally, whether we have VAR or not is in no way going to be determined by a referendum so your analogy is completely fallacious.

Harry Wilson's tackle · Aug 19, 2019

Saunders said:
I will confess that I want VAR I feel it will reduce cheating and we will benefit from it. However as with all sports that have introduced it, it isnt going well at the beginning. Even the stop start American Football game has now made it so the coach has so many challenges to make i feel that will be the way to go otherwise there is a temptation from the officials to review everything.

The biggest problems at the moment are:
1. A reluctance of the officials to tell us when they are reviewing an incident. They are doing this to either avoid controversy or having to add on extra time for these reviews. Added time should be higher this year on average due to us having these reviews It wont be though on the evidence so far it will be your average 4-5 minutes. 1 minute was added at half time on Saturday.
2.The wording of "clear and obvious" it isnt clear to the fans what this means ie black and white decisions so this will include a toe being offside or it skimming someones arm.
3.The handball law has now been ruined just so that they wouldnt be criticised over a handball being deliberate or not.
4. Fans in the ground are the least informed and cannot fully celebrate a goal until the game has kicked off again because they wont tell us if the goal is under review or not. We need the referee miced up or whoever is making the decision to review to QUICKLY update the scoreboard.

end rant.

Agree.

Green Cross Code Man · Aug 19, 2019

Harry Wilson's tackle said:
Is it? Really? I disagree. Not even on here where small numbers of repeat posters can give the impression their opinion prevails is it obvious that most people support binning VAR.

Why are MOTD and managers in favour of VAR if it so obviously should be binned?

Finally, whether we have VAR or not is in no way going to be determined by a referendum so your analogy is completely fallacious.

Look at the vote. And MOTD had very mixed views on Saturday, with Danny Mills voicing direct opposition to it. I think that will increase unless they loosen up on offside and also address penalties not being given

Triggaaar · Aug 20, 2019

nickjhs said:
Get over yourself

Personally I would rather asked questions when I am not entirely sure of something than pretend I know the answer.

I've no problem with that, but since you didn't know the rules it seems a bit odd that your stating exactly what's wrong with VAR and how to fix it with such certainty, while those that have come up with it do indeed know all the rules.

Its comments like yours that have people hiding away with their eyes cast down to scared too ask a question for fear of people like you trying to score cheap points from it. Got news for you pal that won't work with me.

Triggaaar · Aug 20, 2019

nickjhs said:
You are assuming without reason that a team will automatically use their referral if a goal is scored

No, it's not without reason, it's common sense. On average, most teams will concede less than one goal per half, so when they do concede a goal, of course they're going to bloody use it. They're not going to risk losing one nil because they didn't think to use VAR.

I suspect they would be cautious about risking losing the referral. Even so lets look at Watford, 3 goals one penalty appeal.

No, they wouldn't, because there aren't many goals in football. In cricket, the batting team have 10 wickets to protect, and 2 referrals, so they don't like to throw them away early on. It's not the same with football, because if you had 1 review per half, you'd use it. The only point in not using it is if you suspect the other side will score another goal in that half, which should have been ruled out but wasn't. Seriously, teams would use it unless it was completely clear that there couldn't have been anything wrong with it.

So according to your rational Watford would have appealed the O/G hoping Murray was deemed offside and interfering with the play, so that is their appeal gone

Or Gross offside before the pass to him, or something else, yes.

second half we half 3 more incidences and only one appeal which would have been overturned leaving no more use of the VAR in that game so at least one of those goals or both (not sure if the penalty shout came before or after the goals) the players and fans could have relaxed and gone mental without fear of it being over turned and the minutes worrying about a penalty would not have happened.

So you think our players and fans didn't go mental for the third goal? Did you not watch it?

West Ham it would not have made a difference, except I doubt West ham would have appealed the "first" goal which would have been a mistake on their part.

You're mistaken.

So no I am not certain it would always improve the situation but I do think it would in high scoring/ high incidence games.

In high scoring games teams would indeed run out of referrals, and then we'd just carry on without VAR. If your best version of VAR is one where we just stop using it part way through a game, then I'll accept you just dislike all VAR, so it doesn't really matter which version we go for.

We'll see how it goes this season - how many goals get ruled out, and whether fans stop celebrating.

nickjhs · Aug 20, 2019

Triggaaar said:
No

This about sums up your responses so far. Not only this you throw out srawmans like confetti as in, I dont like VAR, when i have clearly stated I do want a version of it, and "did you not watch it" when it is fairly friggin clear I did, then we have the argument to authority that if I dont know all the nuances of the offside rules then my views on VAR and its effect upon the spectator experience are basically without merit. If VAR stays in its current form, judging by the responses from the fans and managers such as Santo it will be against the majority wish. Anyhow done with arguing with you, its going in circles and once we get into having tackle strawman arguments it has become boring and pointless.

Triggaaar · Aug 20, 2019

nickjhs said:
This about sums up your responses so far.

Yep. To the point, and accurate.

"did you not watch it" when it is fairly friggin clear I did

Then why say that if it was down to referrals and they had been used up, that our 'players and fans could have relaxed and gone mental without fear of it being over turned', when they did relax and go mental anyway?

Beanstalk · Aug 20, 2019

Saunders said:
I will confess that I want VAR I feel it will reduce cheating and we will benefit from it. However as with all sports that have introduced it, it isnt going well at the beginning. Even the stop start American Football game has now made it so the coach has so many challenges to make i feel that will be the way to go otherwise there is a temptation from the officials to review everything.

The biggest problems at the moment are:
1. A reluctance of the officials to tell us when they are reviewing an incident. They are doing this to either avoid controversy or having to add on extra time for these reviews. Added time should be higher this year on average due to us having these reviews It wont be though on the evidence so far it will be your average 4-5 minutes. 1 minute was added at half time on Saturday.
2.The wording of "clear and obvious" it isnt clear to the fans what this means ie black and white decisions so this will include a toe being offside or it skimming someones arm.
3.The handball law has now been ruined just so that they wouldnt be criticised over a handball being deliberate or not.
4. Fans in the ground are the least informed and cannot fully celebrate a goal until the game has kicked off again because they wont tell us if the goal is under review or not. We need the referee miced up or whoever is making the decision to review to QUICKLY update the scoreboard.

end rant.

Absolutely. Relating to point 4 especially.

However, this is IFABs fault not the PL. The PL have communicated via pundits and commentators that they want reviews shown live so that the crowd are not excluded from the action. Despite this, IFAB do not want the referee's decision to be influenced by the crowd and have refused to budge on showing "contentious" replays in the grounds live. The PL have managed to circumvent this by allowing a still photo of the frame that best shows the incident to be shown on the big screen. Frankly though it is not enough. IFAB are not going to change their mind however.

It would be nice to be able to hear clarification from the Referee/fourth official of why the decision has been made like in the NFL and until IFAB change their tune, this may be the best alternative (with the still photo) we will get.

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[Football] Its simple, copy cricket and tennis.

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