[Football] The Periodic VAR Yes / No Poll Number 1

Guinness Boy · Aug 11, 2019

Easy 10 said:
I've said it before. If we're going down to forensics on offside decisions, then give the advantage to the attacker. If any part of his body is still level with the last defender when the ball is played (so a trailing leg or whatever), then he is deemed onside. The offside law as it stands and how it is now being applied is now ruining games.

Absolutely the most sensible bit of a decent post :thumbsup:

Agree 100% with that.

This is where I hope it is at least tweaked. It's like "Umpires Call" on LBWs in cricket. It allows the original spirit of batsmen getting the doubt to flourish if umpires think about it. Ball hitting the middle of middle? Out. Ball shaving the top of the outside of off? Decision stays with on field and the umpire should have had enough doubt to give it not out. Player 10 yards offside and the linesman and ref are asleep - yeah a massive injustive is avoided. Making 50,000 people wait around while you decide if Raheem Sterling's thumbnail was offside? **** off.

Guinness Boy · Aug 11, 2019

Harry Wilson's tackle said:
I don't read the papers. If I did, I'd be sleeping with a blow up doll of Princess Diana, and own a fridge full of frozen gammon.

However, I am prepared to do some casual research......2 minutes later I have found these gems:

"'I'm a big fan of VAR' - Pep Guardiola has no complaints after controversy in Man City win over Schalke" (https://www.independent.ie/sport/so...sy-in-man-city-win-over-schalke-37838477.html)

So he likes VAR when the decisions go in his favour.

But...wait!

"Pep Guardiola reveals what he thinks of VAR after 'cruel' Champions League exit"

OK, so you are right.....or are you?

His actual quote was

“It's tough,” said Guardiola. “We were close to going through. It's cruel, but we have to accept it." (https://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/news/pep-guardiola-reveals-what-thinks-14388849)

Apologies for the Sun link (no one needs to click on it) but he said VAR is killing the passion in football. It's not revolutionary technology. It's a large, yellow pair of granny knickers. With skid marks. And fanny batter. :wrong:

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/9697165/pep-guardiola-var-man-city-west-ham/

Harry Wilson's tackle · Aug 11, 2019

Easy 10 said:
Did anyone else enjoy 'celebrating' Maupay's goal yesterday, then putting it on hold while the big screen said it was under review, then giving a half-hearted cheer when it was given ? No, me neither.

The days of glancing over at a lino to check if his flags stayed down then going loopy are now over. It COMPLETELY dilutes the moment for me, and is absolutely the single worst aspect of VAR IMO. There are going to be so many goals chalked off because a player has a pube offside, like City's yesterday. Ridiculous, and there is no advantage to the attacker when the margins being measured are literally a pixels width.

I've said it before. If we're going down to forensics on offside decisions, then give the advantage to the attacker. If any part of his body is still level with the last defender when the ball is played (so a trailing leg or whatever), then he is deemed onside. The offside law as it stands and how it is now being applied is now ruining games.

I think some laws will change as VAR beds in to fit the new reality. I have no problem with that. There was a hilarious caller on 606 yesterday (before I switch off, sickened by Sutton's infantile thundercuntery) who made some comment about players wearing body stockings covered in censors like they use in the cinema for making characters like the schmiegel. That's a tad far fetched but a rule change that has been mooted previously in this context would be good - clear blue daylight. If there is no clear blue daylight between the attacker and the defender when the ball is passed to the attacker then it isn't offside. It would still require a VAR check but fans won't feel so cheated when it was 'only just' offside. I say that as someone who isn't that bothered about this, but would be happy to see a bit of pandering.

As for the loss of the moment thing, I never celebrated a Brighton goal unill I was sure the ref had given the goal. I don't mind. All this handwringing about the loss of the moment is a bit misguided if you ask me. Here is an analogy:

Is it more satisfying to enjoy a long and complex rigmarole, or is it better to go for a 5 second wham bam thank you ma'am? Think about it?

Nobby · Aug 11, 2019

Bold Seagull said:
It’s not black and white. The technology is not that accurate. If we had a goal like City’s chalked off for an offside that some shit bit of software has judged to be a thumbnail offside, I’d be incandescent. That’s bullshit. Yes, correct the clear and obvious errors, when we’re getting down to pixel widths being offside or not - **** off, not for me Jeff.

THIS

Everything about it currently is just wrong

Passion killer

No clear and obvious errors

The lines shown on screen leading down from the shoulders for the second City goal yesterday were not even straight

Complete joke and unless it is changed

VAR ha ha ha

Wardy · Aug 11, 2019

Hugo Rune said:
This.

If I want to watch a game judged to the millimetre, I’m quite happy to watch cricket and the snickometer etc. Cricket is so stop/start anyway, it suits all these replays a checks.

The marginal offsides and constant retaking of penalties is getting me down.

But even in cricket if the decision is close then it goes to umpires call. So the original decision stands

Acker79 · Aug 11, 2019

Harry Wilson's tackle said:
That's a tad far fetched but a rule change that has been mooted previously in this context would be good - clear blue daylight. If there is no clear blue daylight between the attacker and the defender when the ball is passed to the attacker then it isn't offside.

So no offsides for night games or rainy/overcast days?

:jester:

Harry Wilson's tackle · Aug 11, 2019

Guinness Boy said:
Apologies for the Sun link (no one needs to click on it) but he said VAR is killing the passion in football. It's not revolutionary technology. It's a large, yellow pair of granny knickers. With skid marks. And fanny batter.

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/football/9697165/pep-guardiola-var-man-city-west-ham/

I'm appalled you would stoop so low to enrich your narrative with such so-called facts!

Anyway, it is quite clear that friend Pep just blurts out any old nonsense depending on what mood he's in. Emotionally labile. "Mediterranean personality". Basically, unstable.

Finally, it hardly matters how many people are against it. Millions of people voted 'remain' but that doesn't mean they are right :shrug:

So.....on reflection this poll should be regarded as preliminary, and not even yet advisory. Relying on the spoutings of people in the game, including people whose opinions seem to blow with the wind, would be as wise as relying on the guidance of the 2016 version of Boris 'the liar' Johnson on whether to vote leave or not.

Harry Wilson's tackle · Aug 11, 2019

Acker79 said:
So no offsides for night games or rainy/overcast days?

You know what I mean, you cheeky monkey :lolol:

Harry Wilson's tackle · Aug 11, 2019

Swansman said:
This "its good cause its new" bollocks is just a way too simple way to look at things.

I agree that accepting anything that is new is madness. But....that isn't what I said. I am saying (and have said) that people resist change, and yet change is how human beings adapt and survive. We are very good at experimenting with change till we get things to be better.

Deadly Danson · Aug 11, 2019

Easy 10 said:
Did anyone else enjoy 'celebrating' Maupay's goal yesterday, then putting it on hold while the big screen said it was under review, then giving a half-hearted cheer when it was given ? No, me neither.

The days of glancing over at a lino to check if his flags stayed down then going loopy are now over. It COMPLETELY dilutes the moment for me, and is absolutely the single worst aspect of VAR IMO. There are going to be so many goals chalked off because a player has a pube offside, like City's yesterday. Ridiculous, and there is no advantage to the attacker when the margins being measured are literally a pixels width.

I've said it before. If we're going down to forensics on offside decisions, then give the advantage to the attacker. If any part of his body is still level with the last defender when the ball is played (so a trailing leg or whatever), then he is deemed onside. The offside law as it stands and how it is now being applied is now ruining games.

Agree completely. There is simply nothing to beat the spontaneous celebration of a goal (once the instant look at the ref and limo is done) and VAR has ruined that. I do hate the awful injustices (still not forgiven Mike Dean) but I'd prefer the odd one of those to this awful watering down of the passion of the game.

Sussex Nomad · Aug 11, 2019

I really, really dislike it. We'll get used to it, everything does when rule changes are made. It'll take a few seasons but they will change laws in order to make VAR work. Unfortunately this is the start of two tier football, changes made for VAR will affect lower leagues and grass roots football where VAR isn't used. All in all I think it's ridiculous to use this and I'd rather have the controversy of a bad decision than the controversy of what is still a human error. Murray handball yesterday, VAR didn't give it, why? TV judges not making the right call. So for these reasons, I'm out.

Kalimantan Gull · Aug 11, 2019

I want VAR to stop goals being scored by strikers 2 yards offside, to stop blatant handballs going unpunished, to stop cheaters diving. I think we all want that.

I don't want VAR running the rule on intent in tackles, on someone's arm beung 2cm offside, on determining ball to hand.

There has to be a satisfactory definition of 'clear and obvious' we can use, a margin of error similar to umpires call in cricket. Include that and I'll be happy

Kalimantan Gull · Aug 11, 2019

Guinness Boy said:
Absolutely the most sensible bit of a decent post Agree 100% with that.

This is where I hope it is at least tweaked. It's like "Umpires Call" on LBWs in cricket. It allows the original spirit of batsmen getting the doubt to flourish if umpires think about it. Ball hitting the middle of middle? Out. Ball shaving the top of the outside of off? Decision stays with on field and the umpire should have had enough doubt to give it not out. Player 10 yards offside and the linesman and ref are asleep - yeah a massive injustive is avoided. Making 50,000 people wait around while you decide if Raheem Sterling's thumbnail was offside? **** off.

Yep. I'm also trying to think back to any goal scored at any time by a player who was a fraction offside, and for that decision to be controversial and complained about and focused on.

Can't think of a single case. So people didn't care about 1 cm offsides in the past, but now we're being forced to. It's changing the game

Raleigh Chopper · Aug 11, 2019

I don't like it, it is too picky in its current format and needs changing to make it much more fluid.
But all the time the refs and assistants are making the most clear and horrendous decisions when they could clearly see action then VAR is a good thing.
Have people forgotten the terrible decisions of last season, it was almost every week.
But an armpit offside is just ridiculous.

studio150 · Aug 11, 2019

Thought it worked well at Watford yesterday

BUTTERBALL · Aug 11, 2019

I agree with Guardiola when he called VAR a passion killer. Controversial decisions have always been part and parcel of the game, part of the excitement and drama too, the game should be allowed to flow with the referees decision final good or bad.

drew · Aug 11, 2019

I am for VAR but accept that it is still in its infancy. I think it will improve but where I see the main problems at the moment is that the laws of the game need to change.

I'll give you two examples from the West Ham game yesterday. With regard to offside, I think the law should take a step backwards and remove the reference to offside only being an offence when a player in an offside position plays the ball. I think they should go back to it being an offence if you are in an offside position and seeking to gain an advantage from it. The first goal that was ruled out because a minute part of Sterling was ahead of the defender should be irrelevant as when the ball was played to Sterling, Jesus was clearly offside and in a position where he was seeking to gain an advantage.

The other incident would be the penalty retake. Encroachment has been going on for years due to the abject failure of refs to apply the rules. Yesterday, Aguero got a second chance because Rice encroached and cleared the rebound. I would say it would be more in the spirit of the laws if the rule was changed so that if both teams encroach that cancels each other out and the result of the spot kick stands. Yesterday both citeh players and west ham players were encroaching but it was just that Rice had got there first. In that case, no retake should have been taken. If only West Ham players encroached then, yes, there should be a retake. If Aguero scored and only Citeh players were encroaching then it should be a goal kick.

Can't see it happening though!

PILTDOWN MAN · Aug 11, 2019

IMO VAR should only look at offside by it being reviewed by the VAR ref with normal footage. Close calls like yesterday would naturally result in the goal being given, due to the fact to the naked eye it even looks off or not, leave at that.Yesterdays looked on and I can't believe anyone would have really complained had it been given. Coming down to mm's is just stupid especially where the shoulder becomes the arm.

Also then instruct TV companies they can't start putting technology on the screen.

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[Football] The Periodic VAR Yes / No Poll Number 1

Are you in favour of VAR being used in the Premier League?

Yes I am

No I'm not

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