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[Football] Poor old Bury



Icy Gull

Icy Gull

Back on the rollercoaster
Jul 5, 2003
72,015
Publius Ovidius said:
There but for the grace of tony bloom go we!
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Dick Knight saved the club, Bloom took it on when Falmer was approved no?

I feel the need to say this because DK is slowly being airbrushed from our history and being portrayed as a nutty old eccentric more and more as time goes on.

I say it again Dick Knight was the one who saved the club

Tony Bloom has done more than we could ever dream of but I’m not sure we wouldn’t have survived as some lowly lower league club if he hadn’t.
 




Fitzcarraldo

Fitzcarraldo

Well-known member
Nov 12, 2010
960
Nobby said:
Have a fit and proper person test that is fit for purpose?

Monitor club accounts quarterly with real threats if not provided?

Initiate rules that mean fans groups have first grabs at takeovers?

Look at making clubs community assets like pubs so chancers like Day Dale and Archer can’t just asset strip?

Do their f ing jobs - the EFL is not fit for purpose
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Spending money chasing the riches of the PL has rotted the whole League structure. The fit and proper person test is all well and good but the fact is, the majority of the clubs in League One and Two (and probably Championship) are in such a precarious financial position that anyone with the appearance of £££ will be waved through.

Fan group takeovers, whilst the club remains in the league, I think are a bit of romantic chimera. Without a wealthy benefactor immediately after the takeover they would be tied to the same expenses that drove the club to ruin before. Once the club has dropped down a few levels/become a phoenix club THEN they could happen.

What I think would be helpful would be salary/transfer fee caps in League One and Two. These could be linked to the average attendance so there is incentive for clubs to increase their fanbase and therefore sustainability.
 


E

East Staffs Gull

Well-known member
Jan 16, 2004
1,421
Birmingham and Austria
Can’t help but feel that instant expulsion from the FL is very harsh, especially when there is no impact on other clubs for the remainder of the season. Instead I’d like to see clubs in this situation have their FL status temporarily suspended for the remainder of the season and have their membership reassessed say at the end of the following May. That would allow much more time for clubs to be refinanced or sold and, if that happens, they would be allowed to recommence the following season.
 


beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,286
Nobby said:
It would not have been allowed to get to this point if quarterly checks had been made on the accounts, with threats of overspending/ losses would leading to fan group ownership.
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why do you suppose that fan owned club would necessarily be run any better? i would say its possible, though with severe restriction on building and expansion of a club. many clubs income are quite small with little chance to grow, they rely on wealthy benefactors to survive in the first place.

we could blame the EFL, they are constrained by first company law and second their members, the clubs. i think the thing they could do more is apply their own rules faster, so that clubs are assessed and relagated/expelled quicker and more consistently. their primary concern should not be who the owner is, and the integrity of the competition. having a club staggering into season is not helpful, and previously clubs have essentially bypassed punishment midway through season so it did not impact too much on the table. change will have to be radical, and agreement of the incumbent clubs, stand up to legal challenge, so back to the constraints.
 
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Ernest

Ernest

Stupid IDIOT
Nov 8, 2003
42,739
LOONEY BIN
Icy Gull said:
Dick Knight saved the club, Bloom took it on when Falmer was approved no?

I feel the need to say this because DK is slowly being airbrushed from our history and being portrayed as a nutty old eccentric more and more as time goes on.

I say it again Dick Knight was the one who saved the club

Tony Bloom has done more than we could ever dream of but I’m not sure we wouldn’t have survived as some lowly lower league club if he hadn’t.
Click to expand...

And Dick Tight nearly did a Bury to us too , he was out of his depth financially and if Bloom hadn't have bailed him out we would have been bust
 






Nobby

Nobby

Well-known member
Sep 29, 2007
2,605
Springal said:
What do you propose the EFL do if a club breaks whatever rules you want to put in place? The only thing they can really do is deduct points or kick people out the league. Or are you suggesting the government gives them powers to be able to take over clubs and run them if deemed to be run correctly? Sounds like a legal nightmare and giving the people not fit for purpose even more power.

There is a lot of romantic views around all this but really these are clubs that have been badly run for a very long time and are unsustainable. Genuine question - but were Bury fans protesting about this last season when things were going well and they bought their way to promotion?
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The rules if broken should not fall on the club and the fans but the owner. If Day knew he would be facing stiff penalties for overspending he would not have bought the club in the first place.

As to Bury, would you protest if your club was gaining promotion? Of course not - many wouldn’t have known about the mess that was being created, they’re just football fans. But with proper rules in place - no club would be able to buy their way to promotion - the bigger the club the further up the pyramid they will go. And fans would still be able to go to Bury games, probably in League 2.
Company Law means that owners can do what Day Dale and Archer did. But league rules stipulating financial propriety could be put in place.
But the EFL follow the gravy train like the FA and Premier League. No one gives a sh*t about us fans
 


Nobby

Nobby

Well-known member
Sep 29, 2007
2,605
beorhthelm said:
why do you suppose that fan owned club would necessarily be run any better? i would say its possible, though with severe restriction on building and expansion of a club. many clubs income are quite small with little chance to grow, they rely on wealthy benefactors to survive in the first place.

we could blame the EFL, they are constrained by first company law and second their members, the clubs. i think the thing they could do more is apply their own rules faster, so that clubs are assessed and relagated/expelled quicker and more consistently. their primary concern should not be who the owner is, and the integrity of the competition. having a club staggering into season is not helpful, and previously clubs have essentially bypassed punishment midway through season so it did not impact too much on the table. change will have to be radical, and agreement of the incumbent clubs, stand up to legal challenge, so back to the constraints.
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Yep change would have to radical - and unless it is, we will see many more clubs in the same position.
The EFL must implement financial rules so that clubs cannot get into this position
But it is probably too late - in many cases the stable door has already fallen off
 




JBizzle

JBizzle

Well-known member
Apr 18, 2010
5,815
Seaford
Icy Gull said:
Dick Knight saved the club, Bloom took it on when Falmer was approved no?

I feel the need to say this because DK is slowly being airbrushed from our history and being portrayed as a nutty old eccentric more and more as time goes on.

I say it again Dick Knight was the one who saved the club

Tony Bloom has done more than we could ever dream of but I’m not sure we wouldn’t have survived as some lowly lower league club if he hadn’t.
Click to expand...

100% this. I actually find it shameful how he has been almost completely airbrushed out of our history. Without Tony Bloom, there'd be no Premier League, no Stadium and no training complex, but without Dick Knight and his team, there is no Brighton and Hove Albion.

We are so lucky to have had two successive owners that served the purpose needed so effectively at the time we needed it. Although the Amex years have been by far the most luxurious period in our history (we really are spoiled these days and) in terms of consistent success, the Withdean-era was one of my absolute favourite times supporting the club. It serves as a reminder too of how far we've come.
 


E

East Staffs Gull

Well-known member
Jan 16, 2004
1,421
Birmingham and Austria
Ernest said:
And Dick Tight nearly did a Bury to us too , he was out of his depth financially and if Bloom hadn't have bailed him out we would have been bust
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Granted that DK only has a fraction of TB’s wealth, but DK had secured finance for the Amex. It was the credit crunch that pulled the rug from under his feet and effectively forced him to cede control to TB. If it were not for the credit crunch the club would now have mountains of institutional debt, agreed, but no way would DK have ever allowed us to go bust.
 


Chicken Run

Chicken Run

Member Since Jul 2003
NSC Patron
Jul 17, 2003
18,416
Valley of Hangleton
JBizzle said:
100% this. I actually find it shameful how he has been almost completely airbrushed out of our history. Without Tony Bloom, there'd be no Premier League, no Stadium and no training complex, but without Dick Knight and his team, there is no Brighton and Hove Albion.

We are so lucky to have had two successive owners that served the purpose needed so effectively at the time we needed it. Although the Amex years have been by far the most luxurious period in our history (we really are spoiled these days and) in terms of consistent success, the Withdean-era was one of my absolute favourite times supporting the club. It serves as a reminder too of how far we've come.
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Totally this, tbf where was TB in our hour of need?
 












Easy 10

Easy 10

Brain dead MUG SHEEP
Jul 5, 2003
61,747
Location Location
Ernest said:
And Dick Tight nearly did a Bury to us too , he was out of his depth financially and if Bloom hadn't have bailed him out we would have been bust
Click to expand...

Ironically, your semi tongue-in-cheek 'Dick TIGHT' moniker is the precise reason we managed to stay afloat until Bloom was in a position to take up the reins. Imagine if we'd done a Bury and started signing players on three year deals on 8 grand a week when we were at Gillingham, in pursuit of promotion. We'd never even have made it to Withdean, let alone Falmer.
 


Publius Ovidius

Publius Ovidius

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
46,002
at home
Blimey I thought you knew me!!!!! What a ridiculous thing to say..airbrushing history...FFS

I was referring to now as he is our bankroll. If he wasn’t around and decided to walk away, or had to, we would be seriously in the shit, but that seems to be the way at the moment

To keep going , you need a chair with deep pockets or a board who also have the same.

We are VERY fortunate to have a supporter who has very deep pockets. a
Icy Gull said:
Dick Knight saved the club, Bloom took it on when Falmer was approved no?

I feel the need to say this because DK is slowly being airbrushed from our history and being portrayed as a nutty old eccentric more and more as time goes on.

I say it again Dick Knight was the one who saved the club

Tony Bloom has done more than we could ever dream of but I’m not sure we wouldn’t have survived as some lowly lower league club if he hadn’t.
Click to expand...
 


Easy 10

Easy 10

Brain dead MUG SHEEP
Jul 5, 2003
61,747
Location Location
East Staffs Gull said:
Can’t help but feel that instant expulsion from the FL is very harsh, especially when there is no impact on other clubs for the remainder of the season. Instead I’d like to see clubs in this situation have their FL status temporarily suspended for the remainder of the season and have their membership reassessed say at the end of the following May. That would allow much more time for clubs to be refinanced or sold and, if that happens, they would be allowed to recommence the following season.
Click to expand...

In the meantime, with it all hinging on the suspended clubs ability to start the next season, nobody in the current league would know how many were to be relegated at the end of the season, and nobody in the league below would know how many were being promoted. "Sorry Plymouth, your Playoff win counts for nothing, because Bolton have proved they can start next season in L1 after all. Better luck next year. Oh, and Southend - yeah, turns out you ARE down after all..."

I'd say that would have quite an impact on them.
 


W

worthingseagull123

Well-known member
May 5, 2012
2,575
amexer said:
With there history terrible outcome. Little I have read 100% down to bad management. Even heard local MP saying loans at 130% taken out including on parking spaces. Have never felt comfortable with wages etc in Premier but with 100 plus million people watching a game you can understand. However money paid out in lower leagues by chasing the dream is in proportion more of a problem. Have never understood how clubs including many in National league with gates of 1/3000 can justify full time players. Whatever clubs history pruning is needed. how on earth do they expect to survive with 3/4 clubs in 10 mile radius.
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What a complete prat you are.

You clearly are no football fan.
 






Easy 10

Easy 10

Brain dead MUG SHEEP
Jul 5, 2003
61,747
Location Location
Its shocking seeing the L1 table today, already trimmed to 23 teams. Not even Bury with an asterisk next to them. Just expunged, disappeared. That must cut like a knife for those poor fans.
 


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