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[Football] Poor old Bury



beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,312
Saunders said:
... How Fking hard can this be for the EFL to work out when agreeing a CVA unless their memory lapses when they see shiney things pushed towards them.
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i dont believe its as simple as that, its not upto the EFL, company law applies no special rules for sports clubs. its easy to say have special articles of association, that might be ok if starting afreash but you'd have to get all the clubs to agree. and the owners would probably find it impossible to sell or raise funds through shares or debt with such rules.
 




S

Saunders

Well-known member
Oct 1, 2017
2,292
Brighton
beorhthelm said:
i dont believe its as simple as that, its not upto the EFL, company law applies no special rules for sports clubs. its easy to say have special articles of association, that might be ok if starting afreash but you'd have to get all the clubs to agree. and the owners would probably find it impossible to sell or raise funds through shares or debt with such rules.
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I disagree its as simple as a person who is shagging your daugher will have an interest in your business.
 




PILTDOWN MAN

PILTDOWN MAN

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Sep 15, 2004
18,705
Hurst Green
Sussex Nomad said:
Up to this point I haven't written on this post. Unusual for me, being as I'm a gobshite. PL clubs, us, and the rest, should be helping the likes of Bury and Bolton. They cannot be allowed to just fade away. Why? Because the arrears of these age old clubs are less than the salary of a run of the mill player in the PL. With conditions, they cannot see clubs fall by the wayside whilst we get richer. We have a duty to do to them for what they did for us. This is a big issue for us that were helped by all the other clubs back in 97. We cannot see these clubs go to the wall.
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Problem with that, is it allows mismanagement as they know there’s a way out.

There needs to be a proper look at EFL clubs and how they’re run. FFP is not working so why not introduce a risk management strategy?

My proposals would be.
Every club owner has to place a bond with the EFL of say, £500 000. This pays a dividend but is there to pay football debtors should the need arise. If and when this happens the EFL immediately take control through specialist appointees to resolve the issues at that club. This can be done by including it in the articles of association. The refusal to do would tell you that the owner doesn’t have the club at its best interest.

A restriction on ground borrowings and that it has to be ratified by the EFL.

All loans relating to football clubs be logged and have to pass stringent tests and personnel guarantees given.

Any transfer fee agreed with a club in a higher league to be paid in one sum upfront.

Full accounts disclosure.

All above can be introduced, any club unwilling has their membership revoked.
 


S

Sussex Nomad

Well-known member
Aug 26, 2010
18,185
EP
PILTDOWN MAN said:
Problem with that, is it allows mismanagement as they know there’s a way out.

There needs to be a proper look at EFL clubs and how they’re run. FFP is not working so why not introduce a risk management strategy?

My proposals would be.
Every club owner has to place a bond with the EFL of say, £500 000. This pays a dividend but is there to pay football debtors should the need arise. If and when this happens the EFL immediately take control through specialist appointees to resolve the issues at that club. This can be done by including it in the articles of association. The refusal to do would tell you that the owner doesn’t have the club at its best interest.

A restriction on ground borrowings and that it has to be ratified by the EFL.

All loans relating to football clubs be logged and have to pass stringent tests and personnel guarantees given.

Any transfer fee agreed with a club in a higher league to be paid in one sum upfront.

Full accounts disclosure.

All above can be introduced, any club unwilling has their membership revoked.
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I think you need to apply to be the person that holds EFL purse strings.
 




Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,149
Faversham
Sussex Nomad said:
We don't agree at all, but on this one I am with you. This is totally wrong and upsetting.
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I have given you an unreasonably hard time and am now going to unblock you permanently. Best wishes.
 








Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,149
Faversham




Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,149
Faversham




G

Gwylan

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
31,341
Uffern
PILTDOWN MAN said:
Problem with that, is it allows mismanagement as they know there’s a way out.

There needs to be a proper look at EFL clubs and how they’re run. FFP is not working so why not introduce a risk management strategy?

My proposals would be.
Every club owner has to place a bond with the EFL of say, £500 000. This pays a dividend but is there to pay football debtors should the need arise. If and when this happens the EFL immediately take control through specialist appointees to resolve the issues at that club. This can be done by including it in the articles of association. The refusal to do would tell you that the owner doesn’t have the club at its best interest.

A restriction on ground borrowings and that it has to be ratified by the EFL.

All loans relating to football clubs be logged and have to pass stringent tests and personnel guarantees given.

Any transfer fee agreed with a club in a higher league to be paid in one sum upfront.

Full accounts disclosure.

All above can be introduced, any club unwilling has their membership revoked.
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Those sound like pretty good ideas to me - the only one I'd quarrel with is transfer fees being paid in full upfront. It's quite normal to pay in instalments and it would put the English leagues at a disadvantage with European ones. But the rest are all steps in the right direction
 


Triggaaar

Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,205
Goldstone
The fit and proper persons test is conducted by the EFL :facepalm:

The EFL are the problem.
 






Beanstalk

Beanstalk

Well-known member
Apr 5, 2017
2,542
London
Gwylan said:
Those sound like pretty good ideas to me - the only one I'd quarrel with is transfer fees being paid in full upfront. It's quite normal to pay in instalments and it would put the English leagues at a disadvantage with European ones. But the rest are all steps in the right direction
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There is pretty much no deal in football that is paid cash up front any more. It just doesn't make financial sense for any party.

But yes, whilst all the others make sense and I agree with them, it is hard to see a future where football clubs remain private businesses and have to work to more transparent guidelines. The only way I see British football changing is to introduce a 50+1 rule for all new owners but this is not a quick fix and, as we've seen in Germany, there are many loopholes. It does, in principle, put fans at the centre of the running of a club and that can't be a bad thing.
 




Blue Valkyrie

Blue Valkyrie

Not seen such Bravery!
Sep 1, 2012
32,165
Valhalla
Juan Albion said:
Bury's owner only got the CVA through by cooking the books by selling debt to his daughter's significant other.
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There is no way the albion, other clubs, the PL or anyone should be facilitating any such shenanigans by bailing out any skulduggery. And encouraging future dodgy characters.

AFC Bury is the way forward. FCUM once ground-shared with Bury. Time to call in the favour ?
 


beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,312
PILTDOWN MAN said:
Problem with that, is it allows mismanagement as they know there’s a way out.

There needs to be a proper look at EFL clubs and how they’re run. FFP is not working so why not introduce a risk management strategy?

My proposals would be.
Every club owner has to place a bond with the EFL of say, £500 000. This pays a dividend but is there to pay football debtors should the need arise. If and when this happens the EFL immediately take control through specialist appointees to resolve the issues at that club. This can be done by including it in the articles of association. The refusal to do would tell you that the owner doesn’t have the club at its best interest.

A restriction on ground borrowings and that it has to be ratified by the EFL.

All loans relating to football clubs be logged and have to pass stringent tests and personnel guarantees given.

Any transfer fee agreed with a club in a higher league to be paid in one sum upfront.

Full accounts disclosure.

All above can be introduced, any club unwilling has their membership revoked.
Click to expand...

great suggestions, the trouble is how to get from here to there. a majority of clubs (or more 75%?) would have to agree, and most would be in breach of those covenants. some would change the nature of the EFL too much into an executive function running clubs business. the bond and full published accounts should be agreeable though, and should have been done long ago.
 






One Teddy Maybank

One Teddy Maybank

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 4, 2006
21,627
Worthing
Harry Wilson's tackle said:
Mmmmmm.....probably not. The Albion were stuck in Div 3 South well beyond their escape date due to the arrangements and limited promotion opportunities, till the late 50s.

First it gives a tin pot feel to the regional leagues.
Second you can have a strong and weak regional league yet each have equal promotion arrangements (which is why Burton switched when in tier 6 - and got promoted).
Third, actually the lower tiers are better, more professional (literally), more vibrant than they have ever been! The National league makes the old Conference look pallid.

Basically some of the older clubs may be reaching their sell-by dates, especially those in the grim, poor north. Phoenix time.....and so it goes.


So it's a no from me.
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Hear what you saying but perhaps you have more than 3 up or down, Mix the leagues up a bit.

Having watched the national league, I do think the better quality is bit a bit of a myth, professional running of club may not be.

Your last para is very true and perhaps it’s just inevitable......

All very sad though


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 


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