maresfield seagull
Well-known member
- May 23, 2006
- 2,247
Wingers / inside forwards Inconsistent flair players Ever it was thus
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[Albion] Knockaert joins Fulham on initial one-year loan
- Thread starter BUTTERBALL
- Start date
Jimmy Grimble
Well-known member
I’m in the camp who thinks under the right guidance AK could still offer something at our level. He definitely has the skill set for it.
Unfortunately, he was never going to be the player he was in the Championship because the two things that made him unplayable at that level were A) his ability to regularly beat a defender in 1 on 1s and B) his confidence and thus self-image as the best in that division.
If someone could’ve worked on transforming his self-image to being a good Premier League player and convincing him that is something to be happy with, it could’ve been different.
I think a big part of him still wanted to be the Box Office guy every game and found it hard that he wasn’t, especially against lower to middling sides, who to his mind, had players who were not better than him. Against the bigger sides he was usually very good as he revelled in the image of the underdog role.
Anyway I think my point is, what you get from Knockaert is so dependent on how he perceives himself in the team and context he’s in. And how he perceives himself is framed by his manager, teammates and fans of the club. I guess the weight that comes with managing that just isn’t quite worth it at PL level.
Oh, and he’s definitely a better finisher than Trossard.
Unfortunately, he was never going to be the player he was in the Championship because the two things that made him unplayable at that level were A) his ability to regularly beat a defender in 1 on 1s and B) his confidence and thus self-image as the best in that division.
If someone could’ve worked on transforming his self-image to being a good Premier League player and convincing him that is something to be happy with, it could’ve been different.
I think a big part of him still wanted to be the Box Office guy every game and found it hard that he wasn’t, especially against lower to middling sides, who to his mind, had players who were not better than him. Against the bigger sides he was usually very good as he revelled in the image of the underdog role.
Anyway I think my point is, what you get from Knockaert is so dependent on how he perceives himself in the team and context he’s in. And how he perceives himself is framed by his manager, teammates and fans of the club. I guess the weight that comes with managing that just isn’t quite worth it at PL level.
Oh, and he’s definitely a better finisher than Trossard.
Eggman
Well-known member
Trossachs is 2x Knocky. Fact
Eggman
Well-known member
Give over. Why is he a bit part player at a struggling Championship side?
blue-shifted
Banned
Our whole team were a lot further back under Hughton.
The only way we ever scored was by launching free kicks and corners at Murray and Duffy.
We barely created any chances from open play. You may have already seen this hinted at on NSC
But if you compare the stats from Knockaert’s last season and Trossard’s first, there is actually little between them.
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blue-shifted
Banned
Trossard, to me, is emblematic of our ineptitude in front of goal.
The number of times he's lined one up this season and spanked it miles over from presentable positions, I just don't really want him in the team any more ... despite the fact that there is clearly a player there.
Maybe he'd be better playing deeper ... We need better finishers up front .... not sure who though
The number of times he's lined one up this season and spanked it miles over from presentable positions, I just don't really want him in the team any more ... despite the fact that there is clearly a player there.
Maybe he'd be better playing deeper ... We need better finishers up front .... not sure who though
Machiavelli
Well-known member
Wrong. Trossard: 5 goals, 3 assists. You can post the Knockaert stats to indicate how much there was between them (note also, Knockaert took many more set pieces than Trossard).
https://www.premierleague.com/players/20486/Leandro-Trossard/stats?co=1&se=274
Wrong [emoji6]
Knockaert 2 goals 6 assists.
2018/19 season.
3 less goals, 3 more assists..... as I said in previous posts. If you are comparing a season, which is the fairest comparison.
You have to remember he was in a more defensively minded team.
Trossard is also weighted towards his excellent start, he went off the boil after his injury.
Knockaert added a lot more in terms of workrate.
Similar for me.
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Last edited:
scooter1
How soon is now?
The first sentence, yes.
The second sentence, definitely no. He’s a liability in our final third, with his inability to not back heel or flick, or twist. We do ok with simple passing out of the back/middle third, but I’d worry if he was played any deeper
He seems far more effective when he's playing in less wide positions, but there's a queue of players who are better in that position. The wider he goes, the more he seems to dwell on the ball (seeming to be deciding if he's going to beat the man or looking for the worldie pass), and in the end this has slowed up transition for us. When he's more central he can be pivotal and moves the ball far more quickly. We've not (consistently) seen the best of Trossard yet, but I am convinced the best of him is way better, at a higher level, than the best of Knocky.
This, all day long
herecomesaregular
We're in the pipe, 5 by 5
Some odd comments here. Everyone forgotten the beautiful interplay between Mac and Tross vs Leeds, erm, a whole week ago? Then came on as sub yesterday and should have had two assists..... except for woeful finishing by others?
Trossard frustrates immensely but still delivers some very effective play every game I've seen him in (ok, not Newport!). I admit he frustrates me a bit further because he never ever smiles or looks like he's enjoying himself, which irrationally marks him down (aswell as the dead Robbie Williams look).
I loved Knocky. He was the total opposite a very emotional, joyful and sometimes angry looking player. You saw it all on his face. Brilliant in the Championship, unplayable in fact in our promotion season. Still good in the Prem. But there's no doubt, for whatever the reason (and it looked like personal reasons tbf), he went off the boil for quite a long time after promotion and really did look like he needed a change when Hughton left.
I'd have them both if possible. And would love to see Knocky return to form with Chris at Forest. Will always have fond memories of both.
Trossard frustrates immensely but still delivers some very effective play every game I've seen him in (ok, not Newport!). I admit he frustrates me a bit further because he never ever smiles or looks like he's enjoying himself, which irrationally marks him down (aswell as the dead Robbie Williams look).
I loved Knocky. He was the total opposite a very emotional, joyful and sometimes angry looking player. You saw it all on his face. Brilliant in the Championship, unplayable in fact in our promotion season. Still good in the Prem. But there's no doubt, for whatever the reason (and it looked like personal reasons tbf), he went off the boil for quite a long time after promotion and really did look like he needed a change when Hughton left.
I'd have them both if possible. And would love to see Knocky return to form with Chris at Forest. Will always have fond memories of both.
agree with a lot of this. Knocky at his best was almost world class. Yes he played his best in the Champ, but his sharp drop in from caused by inner demons, alleged gambling issues, death of dad etc.
And for me that is the issue with Trossard, he started brilliantly with us and at the time did look an upgrade on Knockaert. Probably culminated in two goals vs Norwich.
He then got injured (?on international duty), and since then has only shown glimpses. When he is not ‘on it’, he looks really poor and (IMO), worse than Knockaert, as he offers less for the wider team.
The Leeds game, great interchange for the goal, but finished poorly when well placed, and did okay, but no more than a 6/10.
Hopefully he’ll pick up again, but compare the last season of Knockaert and first season of Trossard, there’s little to indicate the difference in players.
I don’t want Knockaert back as his time is gone, but for me the jury is out on Trossard.
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Cowfold Seagull
Fan of the 17 bus
The trouble is, who the heck do we have who can do a better job? It certainly isn't just Trossard who is guilty of missing chances though, even our strikers do, Maupay, Welbeck, Connolly et al have missed complete sitters this season.
Cowfold Seagull
Fan of the 17 bus
Come off it, as much as l loved him Knocky was hardly almost world class. He played his best football in the Championship remember, and has never replicated it in the top league.
A very good player most certainly, but as he couldn't quite hack the Premier League, l wouldn't describe him as anything more than that.
Papa Lazarou
Living in a De Zerbi wonderland
We did very well out of Knockaert, both in terms of his performance in the Championship and the amount we got for him from Fulham.
severnside gull
Well-known member
Bordeaux are interested in signing Fulham's out-of-favour French winger Anthony Knockaert, 30. (Football Insider)