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[Albion] Centre Midfield is the problem



neilbard

neilbard

Hedging up
Oct 8, 2013
6,245
Tyringham
Bakero said:
It's obviously not. Players like Dunk, Duffy, Stephens Knockaert and Murray have already proved themselves too good for the Championship. Do you really think Ryan, Bernardo, Propper, Gross and Andone are Championship at best?
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In my opinion they are all borderline, the league table doesn't lie, and if we are lucky to survive this season, next season will be just as hard.

People go on about just enjoy the ride, to be honest what I have been watching this season has been dross, with the exception of a couple of games.

All we can hope for is a vast improvement in recruitment this summer and the existing players improving.

p.s Hughton gets the best out of what he has available..
 






Weststander

Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
64,087
Withdean area
DarrenFreemansPerm said:
I don’t disagree, I think our midfielders are more than adequate, but the system is simply not helping them, they receive the ball jusy outside our box, the wingers are no further up the pitch, we have a solitary striker 40 yards away. Where do they go?
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Playing both Propper and Stephens gives our CM no pace, little mobility, no ball retention and next to no instinctive creativity (making big chances for others). Stains cottoned on to that and swamped them with simply better players.

To end this pattern, the club will hopefully sign new CM’ers this summers:
 




Icy Gull

Icy Gull

Back on the rollercoaster
Jul 5, 2003
72,015
DarrenFreemansPerm said:
I don’t disagree, I think our midfielders are more than adequate, but the system is simply not helping them, they receive the ball jusy outside our box, the wingers are no further up the pitch, we have a solitary striker 40 yards away. Where do they go?
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Exactly!
 




Icy Gull

Icy Gull

Back on the rollercoaster
Jul 5, 2003
72,015
Weststander said:
Playing both Propper and Stephens gives our CM no pace, little mobility, no ball retention and next to no instinctive creativity (making big chances for others). Stains cottoned on to that and swamped them with simply better players.

To end this pattern, the club will hopefully sign new CM’ers this summers:
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Will these new midfielders still be passing to a slow striker on his tod 30 yards up the pitch?
 


beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,315
samtheseagull said:
Scholes, Lampard, Pirlo, Carrick, Keane, just a few that had little pace.
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had pace alongside them didnt they?

and that is our problem, not individuals with lack of pace but too many without pace. theres a few players who are suited to a defensive game, but not the counter-attack or the box to box activity for 4-3-3. at least two key players probably need to move on in order to make this change work, not because they are not good enough but not suited.
 






Surf's Up

Surf's Up

Well-known member
Jul 17, 2011
10,172
Here
Pavilionaire said:
People are forgetting we bought Alexis McAllister in the January window and loaned him back to Argentinos Juniors, he looks a useful player in the attacking midfield role and could be part of the solution for next season.
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Except it will take him the best part of a season to acclimatise
 










H

Hastings gull

Well-known member
Nov 23, 2013
4,635
Icy Gull said:
Midfields tend to struggle when there is nobody in space in front of them to pass to :smile:

As long as our wingers are playing like fullbacks the midfield will struggle to go forward without passing to an isolated forward, which is pretty easy to defend against. The opposition win the ball and come back at a retreating Albion again and again and again and again.

I am in a minority in thinking our midfield is nowhere near as woeful as most suggest, the tactics are making it very difficult for them to shine imo.

The wingers, when they do get forward are failing to make an impact either imo.
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Exactly -this is exactly what happened against the Stains. A couple of time the ball was played to feet to Murray who was simply not fast enough to get to the ball first. The perpetual back and side passing we saw which naturally infuriated the crowd was inevitable, given that we do not break fast enough, as Murray is isolated and let's face it, rather too slow, and the wingers are told to concentrate also on defensive duties. I am sure that the midfield do want to pass forward, but they look up and see such little movement in front of them.
 


R

rippleman

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2011
4,578
the right footed denilson said:
Kayal never does much wrong.
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And he is always looking to go forwards either a pass or by running with the ball. How Stephens gets picked ahead of him is truly baffling. Maybe its because of Hughton's defensive negativity that he doesn't want the midfield to be looking to drive us forwards and get in positions to support the isolated Murray for fear of conceding (which we then do anyway!).
 




Nixonator

Nixonator

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2016
6,733
Shoreham Beach
the right footed denilson said:
Kayal never does much wrong.
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Except giving away a needless penalty against 10 men that cost us 2 points which we could really use right about now.

rippleman said:
And he is always looking to go forwards either a pass or by running with the ball. How Stephens gets picked ahead of him is truly baffling. Maybe its because of Hughton's defensive negativity that he doesn't want the midfield to be looking to drive us forwards and get in positions to support the isolated Murray for fear of conceding (which we then do anyway!).
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Hughton has rarely, if ever, deployed Kayal in that role. He even opts to play Propper in that role over Kayal. Our midfield is not like-for-like.
 


perseus

perseus

Broad Blue & White stripe
Jul 5, 2003
23,457
Sūþseaxna
We can only play on one wing at a time. Take a winger off and play another player in midfield, ideally a new left-sided midfielder.

vs Man City



Ryan
Bruno Duffy Dunk Bong
Bissouma Stephens Pröpper Bernardo
Locadia Andone

Subs: Button, Montoya, Burn, March or Kayal, Izquierdo, Knockaert, Murray





​
 


GT49er

GT49er

Well-known member
Feb 1, 2009
46,757
Gloucester
Icy Gull said:
Will these new midfielders still be passing to a slow striker on his tod 30 yards up the pitch?
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No. I don't believe Andone and Locadia are slow. Get the powerhouse, creative, 5 or 6 goals a season midfielders in over the summer, and the rest of the players will suddenly start looking and playing a lot better.
The attackers we have will convert a percentage of the chances they are provided with; the trouble with the way we are playing at the moment is that a percentage of next to nothing is ..... next to nothing!
 


Nixonator

Nixonator

Well-known member
Feb 8, 2016
6,733
Shoreham Beach
GT49er said:
No. I don't believe Andone and Locadia are slow. Get the powerhouse, creative, 5 or 6 goals a season midfielders in over the summer, and the rest of the players will suddenly start looking and playing a lot better.
The attackers we have will convert a percentage of the chances they are provided with; the trouble with the way we are playing at the moment is that a percentage of next to nothing is ..... next to nothing!
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Could you give me an example of a midfield powerhouse in a lower half side who is netting 5-6 times a season?

Højbjerg? Westwood? Capoue? Surman?

Our midfield is doing as instructed, Propper can offer a hell of alot more, Stephens is a limited midfielder but effective. Bissouma is raw.

How many times were Kayal/Stephens/Sidwell/Norwood netting in the Championship promotion campaigns? A couple each from memory. This is the way we play, the midfield is the second line of defence.
 




DarrenFreemansPerm

DarrenFreemansPerm

⭐️⭐️⭐️⭐️
Sep 28, 2010
17,335
Shoreham
Weststander said:
Playing both Propper and Stephens gives our CM no pace, little mobility, no ball retention and next to no instinctive creativity (making big chances for others). Stains cottoned on to that and swamped them with simply better players.

To end this pattern, the club will hopefully sign new CM’ers this summers:
Click to expand...

I think you’re a touch harsh on Pröpper. He can pick out a player, he can do the quick short passes, he can beat a man and run with the ball, but when he’s given no outlet and has approximately 2 seconds on the ball he’s never going to succeed. Our wingers are camped so deep in our own half he can’t use them, we also only have one attacker in the whole squad with searing pace, and he’s played about 100 minutes all season. We are an incredibly pedestrian team and if we face an opposition that presses us we are screwed.
 


Icy Gull

Icy Gull

Back on the rollercoaster
Jul 5, 2003
72,015
DarrenFreemansPerm said:
I think you’re a touch harsh on Pröpper. He can pick out a player, he can do the quick short passes, he can beat a man and run with the ball, but when he’s given no outlet and has approximately 2 seconds on the ball he’s never going to succeed. Our wingers are camped so deep in our own half he can’t use them, we also only have one attacker in the whole squad with searing pace, and he’s played about 100 minutes all season. We are an incredibly pedestrian team and if we face an opposition that presses us we are screwed.
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Problem is EVERY team now presses us because they know we can’t handle it with our formation and we haven’t got a plan B to counteract it. It’s been fecking depressing, Palace games and last 10 mins of Millwall game apart for months now. Still we change nothing.

There was a time earlier in the season where we did play a more expansive style and it didn’t work but at least it was entertaining. The packed defence no longer works either becuase managers are wise to us and press us so that doesn’t work either.

We are in a bad place and I really am not convinced CH has the tools or nous to sort it, does that make me a bad fan?

Not calling for his head btw but I will be very relieved if we don’t go down because the way we and Cardiff are playing I can see them turning us over. Never mind, a week is a long time in football :smile:
 


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