Dealing with travellers the German way

[Sorrel]

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I am not sure putting them in a more permanent settlement solves the problems. There is an enclave at St Mary Cray in Orpington (the area where the Hither Green burglar was from). They are detested by the other residents of Orpington, including other council house tenants in St Mary Cray.

It is the problem behaviour we have to address, rather than their location. This is the case with all groups who operate outside society's norms and create havoc (e.g. street gangs). We seem to want to fiddle around the edges with good intentions rather than deal effectively with the actual problem.

Once people have a permanent address it's much easier to start enforcing the law on them as we should equally with everyone. It's not a quick process and I'm not pretending I'd like to live next people who behave in that demonstrable anti-social way - but it's a start.

Making it a criminal offence to occupy land without the landowners permission would also be a good idea in England.

[Murray 17]

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Making it a criminal offence to occupy land without the landowners permission would also be a good idea in England.

And like with some driving offences, if you're caught committing an offence (ie occupying land illegally), you have your caravan seized and crushed. Job done.

[Guinness Boy]

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Once people have a permanent address it's much easier to start enforcing the law on them as we should equally with everyone. It's not a quick process and I'm not pretending I'd like to live next people who behave in that demonstrable anti-social way - but it's a start.

Making it a criminal offence to occupy land without the landowners permission would also be a good idea in England.

Exactly this. If you want the respect of being treated as a “race” then behave yourselves. Sort out the stealing, blagging and dumping of shit everywhere and you may find the stereotypes disappear and the permanent sites become a bit more viable.

Sadly all the do-as-you-likies that have pitched up near me in the last two years have robbed, fought and littered their way in to people’s bad books.


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[Sorrel]

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And like with some driving offences, if you're caught committing an offence (ie occupying land illegally), you have your caravan seized and crushed. Job done.

The problem is that you can't take away people's homes from those who are not connected with the offence (i.e. other family members). However, you could use the Proceeds of Crime Act to take assets away if you can separate them to specific individuals and connect the assets to specific crimes - I would guess that doing so is the problem in these cases.

[Superseagull]

Our friendly traveling community are back in force in Brighton this evening. Huge convoy down A23 around 6pm. Some deliberately blocking roads so the convoy stayed together. Coming to a park near you!

[AmexRuislip]

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Our friendly traveling community are back in force in Brighton this evening. Huge convoy down A23 around 6pm. Some deliberately blocking roads so the convoy stayed together. Coming to a park near you!

Palarse a bit early for their away game

[AmexRuislip]

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/debate/ar...c-brewery.html

[oneillco]

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Didn't realise the Irish travelled to the Continent. Benefit of EU membership I guess

It's not "the Irish". These are travellers who don't subscribe to the concept of nationality.

[carlzeiss]

http://www.theargus.co.uk/news/16301...s/?ref=mr&lp=5

SHOP owners and dog walkers lived in fear for almost a week after a convoy of travellers camped near the seafront.

Nick Davies, 60, owner of Spitfire Cafe in Barford Court, Kingsway, Hove, said he had sleepless nights because he was constantly harassed and intimidated by travellers.

Fifteen trailers parked on Hove Lawns next to the King Alfred Leisure Centre last Thursday.

However, Brighton and Hove City Council moved them off the site yesterday morning.

Mr Davies said the travellers affected his business because customers were too afraid to go to his shop.

He said: “We experienced harassment, intimidation, verbal abuse and attempted theft.

“Around 15 kids, aged between five to 17, were standing by the shop and tried to steal our products.

“They all asked me, at the same time, how much this and that cost.

“Then they would put down 50 pence and ask if they could buy a an ice cream.

“It’s a distraction theft strategy. Some of them rode bikes and they cycle at such a dangerous pace it could have seriously hurt someone.

“They shouted at my wife and I and they also used the ‘f’ word.

“We lost business because customers are too terrified to come to the cafe.

“We had to close early on Sunday because of them.

“We’ve had several sleepless nights because we were afraid they would damage our shop.

“They urinated on our front and back doors. Even when we poured bleach and hot water in the areas the smell remains.

“A couple of kids even approached people and pretended to collect money for charity.

“When the travellers left, there was a trail of mess on the lawn. Rubbish bags, food, beer cans, used nappies, tent pegs and gas canisters were strewn all over the site.”

Mr Davies said since he bought the cafe last June, he has seen the travellers pitch up on the same site five times.

He added: “We’re absolutely terrified.

“Last year they stole one of my staff member’s bike lights.

“The council needs to build steel bollards to stop them coming in.

“They come every summer, usually in June and August.”

Dog walker Kevin Stickings, 45, from Brighton, said he had to avoid the Lawns because of the travellers

. He said: “I walk my dog here every day, but I had to change route because the travellers are quite aggressive.

“I have a small dog and some of them own big, aggressive dogs.

“Nearby businesses suffer because customers are frightened of the group.

“They come here every summer, especially in June and the August bank holiday.

“I notice they often arrive on Thursdays.

“If they are discovered by the council on the Friday, they can’t really take action immediately because no one works on the weekend.

“So the travellers earn themselves a few more days. Usually they leave a mess behind and it’s just really sad.”

The mess was cleared up by pupils from St Christopher’s School in Hove.

A school spokesman said: “We cleared up the mess on Hove Lawns not specifically because of the travellers but pupils just want to keep our seafront clean.”

A council spokesman said: “The encampment at Hove Lawns was vacated voluntarily yesterday morning after being warned yesterday that fixed penalty notices would be served today if they remained on the land.

“The council is exploring options to improve the security of the land.”