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[Finance] The cryptocurrency (Bitcoin etc) thread



Is it PotG?

Is it PotG?

Thrifty non-licker
Feb 20, 2017
23,587
Sussex by the Sea
https://news.sky.com/story/cryptoqueen-ruja-ignatova-added-to-fbis-most-wanted-list-12643524

Crypt.jpg
 




nicko31

nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
17,656
Gods country fortnightly
June was terrible for bitcoin, lost 1/3 of its value.

On the plus side, should save some energy and the silly pursuit of GPU's
 


Tom Hark Preston Park

Tom Hark Preston Park

Will Post For Cash
Jul 6, 2003
70,418
There's all manner of contagion spreading throughout the sector at the moment. Companies suspending withdrawals, margin calls not being met, loans defaulting etc etc. They reckon more than a few exchanges are desperately trying to hide the fact that they are pretty much insolvent and are running on fumes. It's the crypto equivalent of the financial sector's implosion of 2008. Maybe a good time not to Buy The Dip because things are likely to get a whole lot worse
 








beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,347
Tom Hark said:
There's all manner of contagion spreading throughout the sector at the moment. Companies suspending withdrawals, margin calls not being met, loans defaulting etc etc. They reckon more than a few exchanges are desperately trying to hide the fact that they are pretty much insolvent and are running on fumes. It's the crypto equivalent of the financial sector's implosion of 2008. Maybe a good time not to Buy The Dip because things are likely to get a whole lot worse
Click to expand...

this is about a week or two old news. not heard of exchanges at risk, for most part they've been doing just that, exchanging. its lending apps, VCs and investors that have got overexposed and blown up. unlike 2008, the industry is cleaning up its own mess.
 


Tim Over Whelmed

Tim Over Whelmed

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 24, 2007
10,216
Arundel
I'm only down 64%, luckily it was a fun punt for me across 15 coins, all of which have pretty much bombed!
 


Happy Exile

Happy Exile

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Apr 19, 2018
1,889
usernamed said:
I’m not sure all your assumptions are justified.

1. Music - Some never left vinyl or CDs, and Bandcamp already exists. I do have a Spotify account, but as I keep pointing out to Bandcamp support, if they’d implement playlists properly in their app, I wouldn’t need to, and they’d do even better business with me. NFTs not really a consideration there.

2. Game subscriptions? Checked with my family and their unanimous answer was that they buy titles from Steam. They say what they buy is theirs and they can reinstall it on a different computer with no problems. So, NFT strikes me as a solution looking for a problem to solve. I know that Sony and Microsoft offer game passes, but it’s a stretch to say that subscription is the main method of video game consumption.

3. If you believe the purpose of NFTs is to strip commercial rights-holders of (often undeserved) privileges they enjoy and return them to the consumer, then I confidently predict that rights-holders will simply amend their T&Cs to take their existence into account, and ensure they retain control.

And that’s without getting into the general usefulness of ‘alternative blockchain currencies’ which as far as I can tell rely entirely on the ‘Greater Fool’ financial theory.

Power hungry (colossal energy waste in mining) Limited ability to spend them, horrible “maximum transaction” limits which make them unusable in mass consumer real world situations, and regulators closing in on all sides to subject them to the control and scrutiny that they’re really not getting at the moment.
Click to expand...

So the GameStop NFT marketplace beta has launched this week - for what it's worth I'm on the fence about whether it's good (and it's apparently mostly just "art" at the moment though games are in testing) though I think the thinking behind it is solid. I've read some stuff that has seen this as the "Steam killer" which kind of answers your second and third points a little bit - an NFT is a unique token of ownership. I download my digital game which is an NFT in and of itself, and the creator gets paid a % of the sale fee by the platform. Where the NFT changes the model is that when I get bored of the game I can sell it to someone else and because it's a copy that is uniquely mine and associated with my digital wallet account as opposed to a generic download I can do that, which I can't do with Steam - with the GameStop platform the original creator gets a % of that secondary market sale too.

So as a buyer I know I can recoup some of my cost. As a creator I lose nothing - in fact I gain - because just like shops like CEX exist for people who won't pay £60 for a new game but will pay £30 for a used one, this marketplace will support that same model only I'll get some of the proceeds too. They've got hundreds of millions of $ in a fund for game developers to apply for - momentum could build fast for this. The other benefit their market place seems to have over others is very low cost to use as both a creator and a buyer (similar to eBay fees...in fact that seems to be almost the model - an eBay for new and used digital content but everything "buy it now" rather than auction). Also a Steam game can only be played through Steam, this new marketplace allows games to be bought and played independently of the platform.

It may or may not take off, but if I was Steam I'd be looking on very nervously, if I was a game developer I'd be eagerly waiting for my opportunity to make more money, and if I was a game player it'd be useful to know money spent on a digital download game wasn't gone forever, but could at least potentially be partially recouped - it's hard to see who the losers are with this model. Then apply that same model across other digital content - music, films etc and NFTs really could change a lot of the way we do things at the moment.
 




U

usernamed

New member
Aug 31, 2017
763
Happy Exile said:
So the GameStop NFT marketplace beta has launched this week - for what it's worth I'm on the fence about whether it's good (and it's apparently mostly just "art" at the moment though games are in testing) though I think the thinking behind it is solid. I've read some stuff that has seen this as the "Steam killer" which kind of answers your second and third points a little bit - an NFT is a unique token of ownership. I download my digital game which is an NFT in and of itself, and the creator gets paid a % of the sale fee by the platform. Where the NFT changes the model is that when I get bored of the game I can sell it to someone else and because it's a copy that is uniquely mine and associated with my digital wallet account as opposed to a generic download I can do that, which I can't do with Steam - with the GameStop platform the original creator gets a % of that secondary market sale too.

So as a buyer I know I can recoup some of my cost. As a creator I lose nothing - in fact I gain - because just like shops like CEX exist for people who won't pay £60 for a new game but will pay £30 for a used one, this marketplace will support that same model only I'll get some of the proceeds too. They've got hundreds of millions of $ in a fund for game developers to apply for - momentum could build fast for this. The other benefit their market place seems to have over others is very low cost to use as both a creator and a buyer (similar to eBay fees...in fact that seems to be almost the model - an eBay for new and used digital content but everything "buy it now" rather than auction). Also a Steam game can only be played through Steam, this new marketplace allows games to be bought and played independently of the platform.

It may or may not take off, but if I was Steam I'd be looking on very nervously, if I was a game developer I'd be eagerly waiting for my opportunity to make more money, and if I was a game player it'd be useful to know money spent on a digital download game wasn't gone forever, but could at least potentially be partially recouped - it's hard to see who the losers are with this model. Then apply that same model across other digital content - music, films etc and NFTs really could change a lot of the way we do things at the moment.
Click to expand...

1. As you said, a quick search didn’t bring up any games at all, but I accept it’s a beta.

2. Under the FAQs, only NFTs “minted” on the GameStop platform can be bought/sold on the platform. Details are light on the costs involved in so doing.

3. To buy/sell anything on the platform I’d need to first buy one of those rapidly falling in value cryptocurrencies and then connect my wallet to their site. I get very nervous whenever anything wants me to connect my wallet to anywhere.

“If you’d just connect your wallet to the end of this vacuum cleaner sir, the procedure will be almost painless.”

The scenario you describe above sounds potentially positive, the devil is always in the detail. E.g. does publishing (or “minting”) on this platform limit or restrict my ability to publish on other platforms? Can I use my good old FIAT currency? (seemingly not atm) How are disputes resolved? (I sold my game but accidentally missed a zero off the end of the price)

I appreciate you don’t work for these guys and I don’t expect you to have the answers, but it looks like what it is to me, a tech experiment a fair way from being a consumer usable product/service.

I’m still missing the bit that says why cryptocurrency is an essential part of the mix. What’s to stop Steam (if challenged by this service) simply introducing a marketplace feature that allows users to transfer their game licenses to other users, while giving the original publisher a percentage royalty for allowing it?

And if Steam aren’t doing that because publishers know they’ll miss out on new sales when people can buy second-hand, what incentive do publishers have for cannibalising their own sales?
 


Happy Exile

Happy Exile

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Apr 19, 2018
1,889
usernamed said:
1. As you said, a quick search didn’t bring up any games at all, but I accept it’s a beta.

2. Under the FAQs, only NFTs “minted” on the GameStop platform can be bought/sold on the platform. Details are light on the costs involved in so doing.

3. To buy/sell anything on the platform I’d need to first buy one of those rapidly falling in value cryptocurrencies and then connect my wallet to their site. I get very nervous whenever anything wants me to connect my wallet to anywhere.

“If you’d just connect your wallet to the end of this vacuum cleaner sir, the procedure will be almost painless.”

The scenario you describe above sounds potentially positive, the devil is always in the detail. E.g. does publishing (or “minting”) on this platform limit or restrict my ability to publish on other platforms? Can I use my good old FIAT currency? (seemingly not atm) How are disputes resolved? (I sold my game but accidentally missed a zero off the end of the price)

I appreciate you don’t work for these guys and I don’t expect you to have the answers, but it looks like what it is to me, a tech experiment a fair way from being a consumer usable product/service.

I’m still missing the bit that says why cryptocurrency is an essential part of the mix. What’s to stop Steam (if challenged by this service) simply introducing a marketplace feature that allows users to transfer their game licenses to other users, while giving the original publisher a percentage royalty for allowing it?

And if Steam aren’t doing that because publishers know they’ll miss out on new sales when people can buy second-hand, what incentive do publishers have for cannibalising their own sales?
Click to expand...

Great questions, you're right I can't answer most! I've seen minting is less than $1 though, and there's a commitment for free, carbon-neutral minting and other transactions soon. I understand OpenSea the main competitor for "art" starts at $10. I have no idea why crypto has to be used - I'm guessing it's a step towards making it a totally self contained system. Some of the stuff I've read suggests they will buy Loopring (which the platform utilises heavily). They've also got a partnership with Immutable X, an Ethereum token. They've said about "being your own bank", have said quite a lot about putting your money where your mouth is etc - depending how far down the tinfoil hat wearing stuff you read into them as a company they may be heading towards being able to offer stock dividends or even stock itself as NFTs and crypto on the platform which can then be lent out to content developers for a % of sale proceeds. Their slogan is something like bringing power to the players and power to the creators.

I can see how that becomes a self-perpetuating system. A platform, with it's own decentralised crypto currency that you can spend on the platform, or lend out to people to make content to sell on the platform and take some of their profits (with associated risk), or withdraw to FIAT if you want, with shareholders getting the crypto currency in return for ownership encouraging more people to buy shares. The value of your share-linked crypto goes up the more people use the platform too as company value increases. Just the Reddit posting fans of GameStop own over a billion $ worth of shares - that's a lot of people with a vested interest in seeing it succeed if that is the route they go down.

Like I say, it may be that they don't take off, but a lot of what they are doing will be adopted by others (possibly including Steam) I'm sure. It's interesting times.
 






Bold Seagull

Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
29,840
Hove


beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,347
nonce is a bit awkward, its a genuine establised term used in language and cryptography, means used once. only UK and Aussies seem use the other meaning. many a forum discussion about inappropriate, rest of the world won.
 


GrizzlingGammon

GrizzlingGammon

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
1,808
In one my crypto wallets I've been randomly sent 1900 USTC.

I also noticed that I have received 5 million of a coin called BSC-Coin token. the contract address is 0xE3e1147acD39687A25cA7716227c604500f5c31A. Current value is zero.

I can't find any info on the latter and I'm wondering if the first, or both, is some kind of crypto dusting scam. Any help for what's going on?
 




beorhthelm

beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,347
GrizzlingGammon said:
In one my crypto wallets I've been randomly sent 1900 USTC.

I also noticed that I have received 5 million of a coin called BSC-Coin token. the contract address is 0xE3e1147acD39687A25cA7716227c604500f5c31A. Current value is zero.

I can't find any info on the latter and I'm wondering if the first, or both, is some kind of crypto dusting scam. Any help for what's going on?
Click to expand...

unless an airdrop from holding something, more than likely a scam that will attempt to drain your wallet when you go to spend/transfer them.
 


GrizzlingGammon

GrizzlingGammon

Well-known member
Dec 15, 2018
1,808
beorhthelm said:
unless an airdrop from holding something, more than likely a scam that will attempt to drain your wallet when you go to spend/transfer them.
Click to expand...

That's what I suspected. Luckily its not a main wallet, just one I recently needed to swap tokens, and contains about $1.
 




bhafc99

bhafc99

Well-known member
Oct 14, 2003
7,121
Dubai








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