Employment law help... Untrue bad reference

SK1NT · Mar 9, 2017

I am hoping that the clever folk at NSC can possibly help or offer guidance to me on a situation I know very little about.

My girlfriend was dismissed from her teaching job today because one of her two references that she had to provide was negative. The negative reference came from a teaching job that she was at 5 years ago which ended with her handing her notice in as she was bullied and treated badly. She use to come home in tears every night. She left on good terms and all seemed fine.

She then got another job straight after based on the reference from this horrid school. So all seemed fine. Anyway 5 years later she has used this school as a reference again as she needed to provide two references and she’s only worked at two schools full time (she has done a year of contracting) only to find that the reference came back negative. Her current employers did all they could to keep her even with a negative reference however the HR dep won’t allow it.

My girlfriend wouldn’t say boo to a goose and takes her profession seriously. Every job she has done over the years has always ended with glowing comments. Over the last 5 years from her employment at this school it seems that the lady who use to bully her has progressed into a position that she can influence a reference. I can honestly say that any negative reference about her in this role is defamation.

I read that references are remissible. Is there anything I can do or should I get an employment lawyer involved.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated as we have a new baby and without her salary things could be very very tough.

bhanutz · Mar 9, 2017

They have to be fair, it all depends how vague they are. I see references with questions like...Would you employ this person again? It is a yes or no. If it is down to that question, it will be difficult to take further.

Eurobound · Mar 9, 2017

Bad references can be taken to court as libellous statements. Seek some legal advice
Many companies will not write a bad reference, as they may well end up in court. They either do not reply, or just confirm the dates between which employment started and ceased

Unfair dismissal could well be a claim here- no win no fee if you must.
Good Luck

DavidinSouthampton · Mar 9, 2017

SK1NT said:
I am hoping that the clever folk at NSC can possibly help or offer guidance to me on a situation I know very little about.

My girlfriend was dismissed from her teaching job today because one of her two references that she had to provide was negative. The negative reference came from a teaching job that she was at 5 years ago which ended with her handing her notice in as she was bullied and treated badly. She use to come home in tears every night. She left on good terms and all seemed fine.

She then got another job straight after based on the reference from this horrid school. So all seemed fine. Anyway 5 years later she has used this school as a reference again as she needed to provide two references and she’s only worked at two schools full time (she has done a year of contracting) only to find that the reference came back negative. Her current employers did all they could to keep her even with a negative reference however the HR dep won’t allow it.

My girlfriend wouldn’t say boo to a goose and takes her profession seriously. Every job she has done over the years has always ended with glowing comments. Over the last 5 years from her employment at this school it seems that the lady who use to bully her has progressed into a position that she can influence a reference. I can honestly say that any negative reference about her in this role is defamation.

I read that references are remissible. Is there anything I can do or should I get an employment lawyer involved.

Any advice would be greatly appreciated as we have a new baby and without her salary things could be very very tough.

How long has she been at the current school that has dismissed her? In my experience (as a school governor in the past) teachers would not be taken on and the position confirmed until the references had been cleared.

Is it a state school or a private school?

Is she a member of a union?

Daddies_Sauce · Mar 9, 2017

"Bad references can be taken to court as libelous statements. Seek some legal advice" - This

Because of the above a number of employers will only confirm employment dates, salary, job title and Job description.

Westdene Seagull · Mar 9, 2017

Google Fiona Martin of Martin Searle ..... has won me thousands over the years !

dazzer6666 · Mar 9, 2017

Agree with the comments above - a negative reference is very dangerous and quite unusual these days. Most firms just confirm facts (employment dates), although may state something about dismissal if this was the case. Link below might help, would definitely seek some advice, CAB in the first instance (free) perhaps ?

https://www.gov.uk/work-reference

tiberious · Mar 9, 2017

You could also write to the Headmaster and Guvernors telling them which bits you disagree with and asking them to provide evidence to support the Reference or else you will seek legal advice. they might just back down... I suppose it will be down to what was actually said. If its would you re employ and they said NO then you cant really argue that

marlowe · Mar 9, 2017

ACAS may be able to help initially. And they are free.
http://m.acas.org.uk/

Technohead · Mar 9, 2017

References have to be factually accurate and truthful. If one is unfair, misleading or blatantly untrue then legal action can be taken to claim damages.

I'm surprised that anybody would be dismissed on the basis of a bad reference - normally a job will be offered subject to the receipt of acceptable references but employment wouldn't actually start until said references were received and considered. Unfortunately a claim of unfair dismissal is probably not an option as you generally need a qualifying period of employment with the employer of 2 years ( there are exceptions relating to Health and Safety, statutory employment rights, whistleblowing, trade union activity and TUPE transfers, but from what you say I doubt these apply).

I would strongly recommend that in the first instance she asks for a detailed written explanation from her employer as to why she has been dismissed. The only real reason I would have thought that would warrent dismissal is if the employer perceived she has lied to them and that "the lie" is so severe it represents a unrepairable breakdown in trust and confidence.

Tarpon · Mar 9, 2017

If she got her second job with a reference from the school she resigned from it suggests it was not negative and that therefore the reference provided from the same school for her third post 5 years later was quite different - was it signed off by a different individual at the school? This could be very pertinant to any action taken against that school.

I would take advice but presumably the second school has her original reference. If so I would request a copy of this and if provided, send it to the third school to compare with the latest one they have received. If they differ and are signed off by two different people then you may have some joy. Most employers would refer to their original reference 5 years later and it would only vary if new, truthful information had come to light in the interim.

Goldstone1976 · Mar 9, 2017

Nothing to add to the excellent posts already made. Good luck to your girlfriend.

SK1NT · Mar 9, 2017

DavidinSouthampton said:
How long has she been at the current school that has dismissed her? In my experience (as a school governor in the past) teachers would not be taken on and the position confirmed until the references had been cleared.

Is it a state school or a private school?

Is she a member of a union?

Hi David, unfortunately she is no longer a member of the union however she was when she was at the school she was bullied at, not sure if this makes a difference. It is a state school. She was contracting there for about 3 months and then went of maternity leave. They then offered her a 3 day a week job which she has been doing for 3 months...

SK1NT · Mar 9, 2017

Tarpon said:
If she got her second job with a reference from the school she resigned from it suggests it was not negative and that therefore the reference provided from the same school for her third post 5 years later was quite different - was it signed off by a different individual at the school? This could be very pertinant to any action taken against that school.

I would take advice but presumably the second school has her original reference. If so I would request a copy of this and if provided, send it to the third school to compare with the latest one they have received. If they differ and are signed off by two different people then you may have some joy. Most employers would refer to their original reference 5 years later and it would only vary if new, truthful information had come to light in the interim.

Hi Tarpon, I feel this is great point. So the original reference was a good reference. However 5 years later the bully is now deputy head and is likely to have signed off the reference. The fact is this school has submitted 2 references poles apart.

Superphil · Mar 9, 2017

My sister experienced a similar situation with a reference from a school she left in West London a few years back, she got onto her union representative who helped her get the reference withdrawn, and updated, She eventually got the job.

SK1NT · Mar 9, 2017

Technohead said:
References have to be factually accurate and truthful. If one is unfair, misleading or blatantly untrue then legal action can be taken to claim damages.

I'm surprised that anybody would be dismissed on the basis of a bad reference - normally a job will be offered subject to the receipt of acceptable references but employment wouldn't actually start until said references were received and considered. Unfortunately a claim of unfair dismissal is probably not an option as you generally need a qualifying period of employment with the employer of 2 years ( there are exceptions relating to Health and Safety, statutory employment rights, whistleblowing, trade union activity and TUPE transfers, but from what you say I doubt these apply).

I would strongly recommend that in the first instance she asks for a detailed written explanation from her employer as to why she has been dismissed. The only real reason I would have thought that would warrent dismissal is if the employer perceived she has lied to them and that "the lie" is so severe it represents a unrepairable breakdown in trust and confidence.

When she was dismissed they were very nice about it however clearly said they need two positive references and the school she had a horrible time at supplied the bad reference. The school she was at for 5 years was a great reference.

The school did give a good reference when she got her 5 year teaching job. This really is down to bully now being deputy.

SK1NT · Mar 9, 2017

Superphil said:
My sister experienced a similar situation with a reference from a school she left in West London a few years back, she got onto her union representative who helped her get the reference withdrawn, and updated, She eventually got the job.

She is worried that by the time the reference is withdrawn the job she loves is gone ... And she will struggle to find a job that fits with looking after the baby...

Superphil · Mar 9, 2017

SK1NT said:
She is worried that by the time the reference is withdrawn the job she loves is gone ... And she will struggle to find a job that fits with looking after the baby...

That's a shame, has she told the new job that the very same school previously wrote a good reference? Might still be worth getting some advice pronto, maybe the union rep, maybe a solicitor.

SK1NT · Mar 9, 2017

I knew NSC wouldn't let me down.

Thanks to everyone who has taken the time to help out

SK1NT · Mar 9, 2017

Superphil said:
That's a shame, has she told the new job that the very same school previously wrote a good reference? Might still be worth getting some advice pronto, maybe the union rep, maybe a solicitor.

I think she was just so upset and crying that she didn't mention that the school has provided previously good references ...

Will have to act quickly... Thanks

Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊

Employment law help... Untrue bad reference

Well-known member

Well-known member

Brazil 2014- here we come

Well-known member

Falmer WSL, not a JCL

aka Cap'n Carl Firecrotch

Well-known member

New member

Well-known member

Active member

Well-known member

We Got Calde in!!

Well-known member

Well-known member

Dismember

Well-known member

Well-known member

Dismember

Well-known member

Well-known member

Share this page