GrizzlingGammon
Well-known member
- Dec 15, 2018
- 1,794
Just wait for Boris 'the total Johnson' Johnson.
Depending on which way the political winds are blowing he may give you a form brexit. But he will say anything to get his power.
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[Politics] Brexit
- Thread starter KingstonSeagull
- Start date
Just wait for Boris 'the total Johnson' Johnson.
Depending on which way the political winds are blowing he may give you a form brexit. But he will say anything to get his power.
- Apr 5, 2014
- 23,587
No hurry. More important to get it right.
Hastings gull
Well-known member
- Nov 23, 2013
- 4,635
Isn't that true of politicians in general, and come to think of it, probably most folk doing their utmost to climb the greasy pole to the top?
Is it PotG?
Thrifty non-licker
Indeed. Anyone thinking that anything other than self fulfilment is the motivation for any of these clowns is deluded.
Last one was three years ago. Let’s have another.
I’m almost inclined to agree with you there. Bin it or get out.
daveinplzen
New member
- Aug 31, 2018
- 2,846
Yes, please, lets send the country into a potential economic disaster.. leavers are a 'bit fed up'
nicko31
Well-known member
Nice to see Mark Carney pull Alexander Johnson up on his latest lie about article 24 and no tariffs...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-48710999
He also stressed that in the event of a no-deal exit, the return of trade tariffs on goods shipped to the EU would be "automatic".
This contradicts a claim from Mr Johnson that the UK could secure a 10-year standstill in current arrangements using an article of the EU's General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade known as "Gatt 24".
"The Gatt rules are clear... Gatt 24 applies if you have a [withdrawal] agreement, not if you've decided not to have an agreement, or you have been unable to come to an agreement," Mr Carney said.
"So... we should be clear that not having an agreement with the European Union would mean that there are tariffs, automatically, because the Europeans have to apply the same rules to us as they apply to everyone else."
Best get used to the multiple lies from the highest office, welcome to Trump-Lite...
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-48710999
He also stressed that in the event of a no-deal exit, the return of trade tariffs on goods shipped to the EU would be "automatic".
This contradicts a claim from Mr Johnson that the UK could secure a 10-year standstill in current arrangements using an article of the EU's General Agreement on Tariffs and Trade known as "Gatt 24".
"The Gatt rules are clear... Gatt 24 applies if you have a [withdrawal] agreement, not if you've decided not to have an agreement, or you have been unable to come to an agreement," Mr Carney said.
"So... we should be clear that not having an agreement with the European Union would mean that there are tariffs, automatically, because the Europeans have to apply the same rules to us as they apply to everyone else."
Best get used to the multiple lies from the highest office, welcome to Trump-Lite...
*sigh* for the 40,000th time, which of the 40,000 versions of Brexit do you want? So boring hearing Brexiteers say this when it’s the Brexiteers voting AGAINST Brexit every time the gov tried to pass it.
Find a form of Brexit that has a mandate, vote it through. If there is no form that has a mandate, we have no choice but to either revoke or have a second referendum.
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Blue Valkyrie
Not seen such Bravery!
We could have a Norway type deal within 3 months - a country which *has it's cake ( is outside the EU ) and eats it ( enjoys massive trade benefits )*.
We could then move to a Switzerland type deal - if we want. This would take years to negotiate. Another country which *has it's cake ( is outside the EU ) and eats it ( enjoys massive trade benefits )*.
Just get on with it !
The reason why so many Leavers on here keep banging out the stupid 'get on with it' chant is that they have given up thinking about it and are simply left with frustration.
Emotions, unlike convictions, are notoriously changeable - and I would guess that if/when Brexit becomes a dreadful reality, the most vociferous visceral outrage will come primarily from the same people!
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Garry Nelson's teacher
Well-known member
This.
Johnson's erroneous claims about GATT 24 indicate that he is either unable to grasp details (a frequent criticism) or is an outright bullshitter (an even more frequent criticism). I am of the opinion that he is both. This dangerous , nasty, idiot is about to become our Prime Minister; it beggars belief.
I'm neither proud or ashamed of my 'leave longevity' - I was making the point that my mind was made up well before the most recent leave campaign and thus things like the bus played no part in me putting my cross next to leave. Leave had no need to convince me. Now remain did have a job to do .... to convince me to change my mind .... but given they didn't campaign on a very positive platform they failed completely.
1986 itself isn't significant .... hence me using the word 'around'. It was the period I got interested in politics.
Hampster Gull
New member
- Dec 22, 2010
- 13,462
It is very sad to see a once sensible and constructive party turn in on itself and pander to the right wing. They claim to be the party on the Union, of business. They are neither.
Oh okay, I just wondered if you had a specific reason for holding such views - and if anything 'around 1986' had caused them.....
Garry Nelson's teacher
Well-known member
Fair enough. But the lack of positivity is to a large extent in-built to any campaign that is in effect a 'no change' one. I'll accept that the Leave campaign was very effective in a kind of '4 legs good, 2 legs bad' sort of way. But winning a campaign is not quite the same as winning the argument.
I agree BUT the referendum was called because of pressure to leave the EU - you'd think that the remain campaign would have hammered home the positives of staying rather than the negatives of leaving. It's a bit like the current status of UK politics from the Tories - 'yes, we have our problems but if you don't vote for us you get Corbyn' - entirely negative, no attempt to 'sell' their vision.
I agree with this.
The Remain campaign was poor and negative, while the Leave campaign was strong and positive.
It's difficult to sell status quo when popular feeling is always for 'change'.
The Tory debate now has no higher vision than 'delivering Brexit' (whatever that cliche means), keeping the Party alive and beating Corbyn. That's it. No greater ambition.
We will no doubt get a 'feel good' factor from Prime Minister Johnson, but I think that will fade when it is no longer a novelty and everyone sees how vacuous the promise of 'sunny uplands' Brexit is...
pb21
Well-known member
- Apr 23, 2010
- 6,316
Without wising to go over old ground too much, the remain campaign started off extremely positive, "stronger, safer, better off" etc. (still all true IMO), and kept this positive message throughout, but obviously introduced/resorted to negative campaigning.
The problem was when the leave campaign said we would be even more stronger, even more safer and even more better off, if we left (all untrue IMO). Then when remain said that's not true they got labelled as unpatriotic and that they didn't believe in their county.
At that point it was inevitable what would happen.