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[Politics] Brexit

If there was a second Brexit referendum how would you vote?

  • Total voters
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Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,133
Faversham
KZNSeagull said:
No. What I am suggesting is that parliament is very good at thwarting and delaying. What they should be doing is pushing for a resolution to this, one way or the other. They say that we are in a national crisis. Fine, that may be, but I did not notice any of them pushing for parliament to sit over the summer. I notice they were not sitting today. Are they going to postpone the party conference season? What I want them to do is sit in parliament and actually come up with a solution. If they decide that brexit should not happen, if no deal is the way forward, if tweaking the deal is what should happen, or something else then so be it, but have the balls to decide, not spend all their time thwarting, dithering, playing games and calling for other people to make a decision (ie the voting public). It is, frankly, pathetic and I am fed up with it. And no, I have no idea what the solution is but I am not paid to make that decision - they are and they should effing get on with it.
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The man who should have been getting on with it, all summer and now, is Boris. Negotiate. He hasn't. Corbyn cannot. The delay is down to the government (tories) not parliament. It is Boris' fault. He doesn't have the bus fare.
 






D

Deleted member 2719

Guest
birthofanorange said:
Oh, you're back. :) Spilled any blood recently? Planning on it? What a sap.
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Yes, I know I said a week, but there has been so much chumming up on here and I was starting to vomit.
Who said I was going to spill the blood?
Just wait it will happen the leaver has had enough.
Leave means leave.
 
















pastafarian

pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
dingodan said:
I said it before, all MP's took the decision to hold a referendum on Brexit. To ask the public as a whole to decide.

They also said, even after the result, that it should be and would be respected.

To be fair, some people on the remain side do care about the principles involved here, and have said that their MP, and all MPs, should carry out Brexit, even though they didn't vote for it, even in constituencies where the majority voted remain. Because the principle at stake here is important, that this was the instruction of the majority who voted in the referendum, and everyone taking part understood and agreed to how it was going to work.

It's only over time that people have gradually encouraged each other, from MPs down, that it's Ok to go back on the result because they didn't like the outcome. Now the principle that if we have all agreed to take part in a vote, and if in the end we personally lost, we will accept the result, that principle is gone. You might think half the population are defending Brexit and the other half are defending remain. Actually half the population are defending something much more fundamental to a civil society than that, and the other half are Ok with destroying it.

I can only imagine that their narrow short term political views have got in the way of their senses, but whatever, it's too late to go back now. The damage is done.
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Well said
Unfortunately the increasing number of pragmatic remainers who say they will take a deal instead of no deal(its almost as though having a no deal exit as a bargaining chip works and focuses minds) are still being drowned out by those who refuse to accept both the deal and no deal and simply want the decision to leave revoked and reversed. They are no deal enablers themselves, and cant even see it.


dingodan said:
Here's what we've done.

We've taught young people, many for whom this whole debacle was their first view of how politics works, that it's Ok to reject a democratic result. Using arguments like "people didn't know what they were voting for", "the vote was based on lies, it was illegal" etc.

Fast forward a generation or two.

People will feel it's legitimate to refuse to accept the result of a general election in the same way. Maybe your guy or girl will win the election, and opponents, maybe even the actual opposing candidate and their party, will refuse to accept the result.

You will cry foul, you will hold up the principles of democracy and losers consent. Few will remember what that actually looks like, and those who do will point to this time, call you a hypocrite, tell you that you didn't know what you were voting for in the election, and carry on righteously declaring that despite the actual vote count, you didn't win, or if you did it doesn't matter.

Well done you.

Those who have done this have destroyed what so many fought and died for. We've lost it, not after some invasion, or some international conflict against fascists, but self inflicted. From within, to ourselves.

If you ever get a moment away from your self righteousness and hubris, and can for a moment seperate your politics from your principles and think clearly, just for a moment, I invite you to have a think about that.
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Well said again.
There will be denial of course from those that don’t like what they see in the mirror
Probably whining and/or anger too.The ones who are desperate to continue the “should we leave or remain” debate, that ended when the votes were counted, are the easiest to spot.
 




pastafarian

pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
Westdene Seagull said:
What makes you so sure ? Apparently Macron didn't want to grant the extension to 31st October but was talked round by Merkel. One of the rules of the extension is that there has to be a good chance of progress being made during it. Given zero progress has been made in the last extension or the one before that, why would people like Macron decide to extend yet again ?
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The EU Council have previously said in a joint statement that the extension period cannot go beyond Oct 31st.If there is an extension request I predict with my powers they will either A/stick to that and say no extension or B/fold and agree to a further extension.

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Thunder Bolt said:
The EU don't care about no deal. It doesn't affect them,
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There is a lot of dumb stuff posted on here but this takes the biscuit.
 




birthofanorange

birthofanorange

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 31, 2011
5,922
David Gilmour's armpit
pastafarian said:
Well said
Unfortunately the increasing number of pragmatic remainers who say they will take a deal instead of no deal(its almost as though having a no deal exit as a bargaining chip works and focuses minds) are still being drowned out by those who refuse to accept both the deal and no deal and simply want the decision to leave revoked and reversed. They are no deal enablers themselves, and cant even see it.




Well said again.
There will be denial of course from those that don’t like what they see in the mirror
Probably whining and/or anger too.The ones who are desperate to continue the “should we leave or remain” debate, that ended when the votes were counted, are the easiest to spot.
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Nice prose, but as usual, utter bollocks.
The fact remains that No Deal is not wanted by the majority, nor was it ever wanted (nor suggested as an option) during the referendum.
Only odd folk like you and your ilk think it's okay to put the country at risk to prove a point.
Yes, yes, you 'won' the vote...the vote that has proven impossible to implement.
You're just being foolish, and you know it, but can't accept it.
 


D

Deleted member 2719

Guest
Lever said:
Oh, you really have returned a bit tetchy, Mouldy.......
Feel free to take another break.
Do you believe in unicorns though?
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No, unicorns w+nk, I do believe in democracy though.

Shame we have so many that don't on this thread and in parliament though.

Shame on you.

Leave means leave.
 

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pastafarian

pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
birthofanorange said:
Nice prose, but as usual, utter bollocks.
The fact remains that No Deal is not wanted by the majority, nor was it ever wanted (nor suggested as an option) during the referendum.
Only odd folk like you and your ilk think it's okay to put the country at risk to prove a point.
Yes, yes, you 'won' the vote...the vote that has proven impossible to implement.
You're just being foolish, and you know it, but can't accept it.
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Put your hand up and shout take the deal on offer then if you dont want a no deal exit.
You can even post it here to show you are one of the pragmatic remainers who think thats the best option for leaving.
 










birthofanorange

birthofanorange

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 31, 2011
5,922
David Gilmour's armpit
Mouldy Boots said:
No, unicorns w+nk, I do believe in democracy though.

Shame we have so many that don't on this thread and in parliament though.

Shame on you.

Leave means leave.
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10 of us went to a restaurant, the other week, and the options were fish or beef. 6 of us wanted fish, the other 4 wanted beef. To save delays, we decided to go with the democratic decision, so we all ordered the fish.
Upon hearing us, fellow diners warned us against eating the fish, as it had made several people ill. We thought about it for a while, yet still decided to go with the fish, as it seemed the right thing to do, seeing as the majority voted for it.
I have 3 funerals to attend in the next couple of weeks - still, we did the right thing, eh?
 


pastafarian

pastafarian

Well-known member
Sep 4, 2011
11,902
Sussex
birthofanorange said:
Tell me what the deal is.
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The deal on offer has been in the news and talked about a fair bit, its been voted down 3 times. Entirely possible to bring it forward again as a motion in a new parliamentary session or even directly as legislation. Its the one with the withdrawal section that the EU have said is the only version available and cant be opened for negotiation.
Come on,if you dont want a no deal exit.... shout out..... Take the deal on offer!!!!
 


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