[Politics] Brexit

nicko31 · Sep 11, 2019

clapham_gull said:
Stay to look for a job with a view to stay. No restriction on the kind of job and no cap on numbers.

It was always part of the plan. Next we will see an Amnesty on illegal immigrants.

However - to be fair, that's what leave voters voted for.

Special gift for leave voters from the Tory party

daveinplzen · Sep 11, 2019

wellquickwoody said:
Turn the emotion off, we are in a shit storm that needs level headed leaders, not millennial whiners. Yes there will be victims of Brexit, some exist already. Newspapers with blood on their hands? Do grow up. The issue needs ending, decisively. From a voter and future pensioner of the UK, and a firm remainer. Leave means leave.

No deal exit means years, possibly decades of harm. Leaving without a deal won't be an 'ending'

Bakero · Sep 11, 2019

Thunder Bolt said:
The EU tax avoidance laws come into effect in January 2020. Yes, the hard right wing of the Tory party, most of whom are very rich.

Leadsom said today that "there is a move in opinion polls that suggests that migration is now increasingly popular".

Chicken Run · Sep 11, 2019

A second referendum means leave voters would have to get a majority TWICE to get the result they wanted which makes their vote half the value of a remain vote, unless there is a third referendum?

Ernest · Sep 11, 2019

Scottish judges rule prorogation was unlawful , what happens now

Eric Potts · Sep 11, 2019

Ernest said:
Scottish judges rule prorogation was unlawful , what happens now

Off to the Tower with Johnson .

lawros left foot · Sep 11, 2019

Westdene Seagull said:
And therein lies the problem .... the EU is far more than a trading union - the union we voted to join. How many of those other trading unions have a parliament, a flag, an anthem, a council, a foreign minister, courts, a currency ? All the mechanisums of state. Turn the EU back to a purely trading union like all the others and we wouldn't have the current mess.

Could be it has something to do with recent European history. When the members of a large multi national trading block have been participants in the last hundred years or so,in the 2 most destructive wars in human history, it might be a good idea to bind them to something bigger than self interest and nationalism. It appears to be working, so far,

Deleted member 2719 · Sep 11, 2019

Thunder Bolt said:
I haven't voted Labour for a long time, at least twenty years.

I don't want Corbyn to do a deal because I am a remainer so trusting him is neither here nor there to me.

Typical though, answering a question with a question. You want to leave, cannot stand Corbyn but if Corbyn has a leave deal then would you back him?

The answer to your question of which I would have thought obvious is NO, of course, I don't trust a man like Corbyn with his background as I said before he is a dangerous man, I have moral standards, even if I do want to leave, I certainly would not want him anywhere near our government.

Now can you answer my question?
Do you trust Jeremy Corbyn?

lawros left foot said:
Mouldy, old son, I don’t believe you have some kind of super secret involving Corbyn, McDonnell, and the Provos, because if you did, I’m pretty sure that one of the right wing cabal of newspapers in this country would have”spilt the beans” already. The Mail, Sun etc would pay a kings ransom for information like that, you only have to look at the farce that was Corbyn was a Czechoslovakian spy, they’d don’t even need any evidence.

As for me stopping Brexit, you flatter me. I only wish I could because I don’t believe that the second referendum was in essence democracy in action, as, to repeat myself, democracy is not only dependent on the amount of votes garnered, but how those votes were garnered. The two Leave campaigns seemed to compete with each other to see who could get voters to believe the biggest porkies, unfortunately a lot of very naive voters fell for it.

As for Austin having king size cojones, I’d like to hear him repeat has more wild accusations outside of Parliamentary privilege, and even then he’d only get sued, hardly risking life and limb, is it?

Believe what you want Lawro, I would not sell to papers and get involved in that, there is a risk factor and it would be off the scale.

Again a remainer, implying that we didn't know what we were doing, you're so far out of touch, get out of the Brighton bubble there is more to learn about society rather than spending a few hours debating when is our next demonstration and shall we take a blow-up of Boris with a nappy on.

lawros left foot · Sep 11, 2019

Chicken Run said:
A second referendum means leave voters would have to get a majority TWICE to get the result they wanted which makes their vote half the value of a remain vote, unless there is a third referendum?

It would be a 3rd referendum, we had the first one in 1975.

Ernest · Sep 11, 2019

Mouldy Boots said:
The answer to your question of which I would have thought obvious is NO, of course, I don't trust a man like Corbyn with his background as I said before he is a dangerous man, I have moral standards, even if I do want to leave, I certainly would not want him anywhere near our government.

Now can you answer my question?
Do you trust Jeremy Corbyn?

Believe what you want Lawro, I would not sell to papers and get involved in that, there is a risk factor and it would be off the scale.

Again a remainer, implying that we didn't know what we were doing, you're so far out of touch, get out of the Brighton bubble there is more to learn about society rather than spending a few hours debating when is our next demonstration and shall we take a blow-up of Boris with a nappy on.

Have you got your FREE shirt yet

CHAPPERS · Sep 11, 2019

Leadsom

I actually do not think that it serves people well to see what is the absolutely worst thing that could happen. The worst thing that could happen to me is I could walk out of here and get run over. It is not a prediction, but it is something that could happen. And simply putting out there all of the possible permutations of what could happen actually just serves to concern people.

What a load of bollocks.

hans kraay fan club · Sep 11, 2019

Leadsom said:
The worst thing that could happen... is I could walk out of here and get run over.

Matter of opinion.

Westdene Seagull · Sep 11, 2019

Blue3 said:
Your post for the first time shines a light for me on what leavers saw as the threat of belonging to the EU, the reason I say that is as a Remainer who accepted the referendum result I am feed up as others probably are with the tribe like groups and polarised views posted on here, I really want to understand what drove those who voted leave.

Out of the list you gave in what order would you rate those that have personally caused you anxiety, financial, physical, emotional harm?

Flag
Anthem
Council
Foreign Minister
Courts
Currency

I think the phrase "have personally caused you anxiety, financial, physical, emotional harm" is slightly dramatic. For me, it's the move to a super state ( and that is the aim ) that is the issue. I've mentioned it before - here in the UK we've moved democratic accountability closer to the people - devolved government ( NI excepted at the moment ) and mayors in many places. Even councils are being bestowed extra powers gradually. An EU super state takes that in completely an opposite direction. I believe power should be with the people and for the people ( and I'm right wing …. ish …. before you start accusing me of being a communist ). I accept our system isn't perfect - for starters the House of Lords but the EU adds another layer. A layer the person in the street has barely any say in - say I don't agree with the actions of the Council of Europe for example, how do I remove any member from it ? Answer, I can't. The published aim of the EU is ever greater political and fiscal union - fine if that's what they want to do but I don't think that is in the best interests of the UK nor indeed the voters of the UK.

daveinplzen said:
Emotional is the main one from what I can gather.
The main emotional reason was 'foreigners'.
Of course, it is now different, and EVERY leaver talks of the EU, and not immigration. Its been enlightening to watch.

Wrong as you often are. This thread is nearly 2500 pages long. I now challenge you to provide one single post in all those pages that even implies I voted leave because of immigration ? You won't be able to because I have NEVER said immigration was my reason for voting leave ….. not once.

lawros left foot · Sep 11, 2019

Mouldy Boots said:
The answer to your question of which I would have thought obvious is NO, of course, I don't trust a man like Corbyn with his background as I said before he is a dangerous man, I have moral standards, even if I do want to leave, I certainly would not want him anywhere near our government.

Now can you answer my question?
Do you trust Jeremy Corbyn?

Believe what you want Lawro, I would not sell to papers and get involved in that, there is a risk factor and it would be off the scale.

Again a remainer, implying that we didn't know what we were doing, you're so far out of touch, get out of the Brighton bubble there is more to learn about society rather than spending a few hours debating when is our next demonstration and shall we take a blow-up of Boris with a nappy on.

You know something so inflammatory that it risks your family’s safety, you wouldn’t tell the red tops, but, you’re quite happy to hint that you know something no one else knows on a football forum?

Okay mate.

No Leaver leader was advocating a no deal Brexit, there is masses of evidence to say they all, to a man , discounted no deal.
Easiest trade deal in the World , remember?
Don’t tell me. you were always voting for no deal, because it was never mentioned as a viable option during the referendum campaign.

hans kraay fan club · Sep 11, 2019

Westdene Seagull said:
Wrong as you often are. This thread is nearly 2500 pages long. I now challenge you to provide one single post in all those pages that even implies I voted leave because of immigration ? You won't be able to because I have NEVER said immigration was my reason for voting leave ….. not once.

He isn't 'wrong' at all. You don't speak for 17 million people*.

If immigration was not a factor for you, that's fair enough. If you're going to pretend that it wasn't for a very significant proportion of leave voters, then you're either stupid or being disingenuous.

(*Not that they would ADMIT that it was about immigration, either, obviously)

Westdene Seagull · Sep 11, 2019

Thunder Bolt said:
The EU tax avoidance laws come into effect in January 2020. Yes, the hard right wing of the Tory party, most of whom are very rich.

Come on TB, never had you down as one of those tin foil hat people. As has being pointed out a number of times, UK legislation ALREADY, that means NOW, covers the new tax avoidance laws the EU is introducing. So it's already in place. The UK were actually ahead of the game.

wellquickwoody · Sep 11, 2019

The Clamp said:
I don’t think you can really keep pulling the “firm remainer” card. You are clearly now a leaver. Reluctantly maybe but you’re no remainer anymore.

If the referendum was rerun tomorrow I would vote remain. No ifs, no buts, no maybes. But if it was rerun it would mean that democracy is worthless. Advisory or not, the result has stood for over three years, it should be respected. Not least just to end the uncertainty. You are Corbynesque in your view of democracy, only when it suits you.

lawros left foot · Sep 11, 2019

Westdene Seagull said:
Come on TB, never had you down as one of those tin foil hat people. As has being pointed out a number of times, UK legislation ALREADY, that means NOW, covers the new tax avoidance laws the EU is introducing. So it's already in place. The UK were actually ahead of the game.

They are more worried the EU will actually enforce a tax avoidance law, as they know a Tory Government won’t.

wellquickwoody · Sep 11, 2019

daveinplzen said:
No deal exit means years, possibly decades of harm. Leaving without a deal won't be an 'ending'

I didn’t want to leave, but the vote still stands. Unable to agree a deal in over three years, it will be best for all parties if France uses its veto.

Westdene Seagull · Sep 11, 2019

hans kraay fan club said:
He isn't 'wrong' at all. You don't speak for 17 million people*.

If immigration was not a factor for you, that's fair enough. If you're going to pretend that it wasn't for a very significant proportion of leave voters, then you're either stupid or being disingenuous.

(*Not that they would ADMIT that it was about immigration, either, obviously)

Maybe Dave should learn what words mean then - he said 'every', even typed it in caps to highlight it, hardly the same as 'some'.

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[Politics] Brexit

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