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Record Employment.



Lenny Rider

Well-known member
Sep 15, 2010
5,373
When the vultures were circling round Osborne on the TV this morning, a fact was thrown in that we now apparently have record employment levels.

Obviously counting every job is probably a pre requisite, but do they include part time jobs and job shares?

Or a bit like Thatchers seasonally adjusted dole figures is it all open to interpretation?
 


spence

British and Proud
Oct 15, 2014
9,811
Crawley
I don't believe those figures for one moment.
 




Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
49,985
Goldstone
I don't believe the figures quoted by either side. Both the Chancellor and Shadow Chancellor are throughly dislikable characters.
Even if we ever have likeable ones, they still lie. They're stuck in the political web of lies; 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'.
 


severnside gull

Well-known member
May 16, 2007
24,540
By the seaside in West Somerset
When the vultures were circling round Osborne on the TV this morning, a fact was thrown in that we now apparently have record employment levels.

Obviously counting every job is probably a pre requisite, but do they include part time jobs and job shares?

Or a bit like Thatchers seasonally adjusted dole figures is it all open to interpretation?

Part timers and zero hour contracts :rolleyes:
 




darkwolf666

Well-known member
Nov 8, 2015
7,575
Sittingbourne, Kent
Even if we ever have likeable ones, they still lie. They're stuck in the political web of lies; 'if you can't beat 'em, join 'em'.

I worked in the world of crime analysis for a number of years. The figures were constantly manipulated to prove a point in your favour or against an opponents ideas. Politicians do exactly the same with their figures whatever they may be!
 


Arkwright

Arkwright
Oct 26, 2010
2,786
Caterham, Surrey
Part timers and zero hour contracts :rolleyes:

Tend to agree, loads of jobs being advertised on Part Time and set hour contracts. Don't see how this can benefit the government, two staff earning say £12k paying next to tax or one person earning £24k paying tax on the best part of £12k.

As mentioned yes lots of jobs but not a lot of Full Time work.
 


Gwylan

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
31,323
Uffern
Tend to agree, loads of jobs being advertised on Part Time and set hour contracts. Don't see how this can benefit the government, two staff earning say £12k paying next to tax or one person earning £24k paying tax on the best part of £12k.


And you can add on that lower-paid jobs will mean that there's more housing benefit paid out. So the government loses two ways: less tax revenue but more expenditure.
 




Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
49,985
Goldstone
I worked in the world of crime analysis for a number of years. The figures were constantly manipulated to prove a point in your favour or against an opponents ideas. Politicians do exactly the same with their figures whatever they may be!
Exactly. And they don't really have a choice. If your opponents do it and you don't, you look like idiots. It's seems we're more likely to vote for politicians that are disingenuous than those that appear to be useless.
 


beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,264
Tend to agree, loads of jobs being advertised on Part Time and set hour contracts. Don't see how this can benefit the government, two staff earning say £12k paying next to tax or one person earning £24k paying tax on the best part of £12k.

As mentioned yes lots of jobs but not a lot of Full Time work.

i dont know why you suppose that this would benefit an employer either. there might be some small saving in NI at very low hours, but for this sort of level it would be an extra administrative cost to employ two people at half the hours each.

anyone have actual numbers to back up the premise all these jobs are zero contract and none are full time? i'd venture there's a spread across the range. its sad that people want to talk down improved employment, even if it is a small part time jobs thats a improvement for each person and the economy.
 


darkwolf666

Well-known member
Nov 8, 2015
7,575
Sittingbourne, Kent
i dont know why you suppose that this would benefit an employer either. there might be some small saving in NI at very low hours, but for this sort of level it would be an extra administrative cost to employ two people at half the hours each.

anyone have actual numbers to back up the premise all these jobs are zero contract and none are full time? i'd venture there's a spread across the range. its sad that people want to talk down improved employment, even if it is a small part time jobs thats a improvement for each person and the economy.

Sorry, go on any supermarket or shop website and you will see the majority of the jobs are for between 14 and 24 hours. I dare see his is the case with many employers who want a "flexible" workforce...
 




sir albion

New member
Jan 6, 2007
13,055
SWINDON
They will cover many things up when debating figures and not to mention the government top ups for low earners.
The more people working is always a good thing,but families galore are far worse off now that's for sure.
 




sir albion

New member
Jan 6, 2007
13,055
SWINDON
Record employment levels, record unemployment figures so why aren't the taxmens coffers overflowing instead of stagnating ? Surely they are not fiddling these figures ?
Exactly Ernie...
We're told that we're basically booming and yet all we do is make cuts after cuts and don't build schools,hospitals and enough homes etc etc.
It's blatantly clear that our tax payers money is going elsewhere while the people of Britain get taken for complete mugs.
 




beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,264
Sorry, go on any supermarket or shop website and you will see the majority of the jobs are for between 14 and 24 hours. I dare see his is the case with many employers who want a "flexible" workforce...

so you're saying this representitive of all jobs available? you can provide the figures to support this, or using an example of a single visible group without any further research to back up the assertion?
 


beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,264
Record employment levels, record unemployment figures so why aren't the taxmens coffers overflowing instead of stagnating ?

income tax reciepts are going up, but so is cost of the outgoings. i though we all understood this, and many want the spending to be more?
 


Feb 14, 2010
4,932
When the vultures were circling round Osborne on the TV this morning, a fact was thrown in that we now apparently have record employment levels.

Obviously counting every job is probably a pre requisite, but do they include part time jobs and job shares?

Or a bit like Thatchers seasonally adjusted dole figures is it all open to interpretation?

The state does not create a single job, except jobs paid for by the private sector. The market and those who set up business's create employment. No chancellor creates work unless he is a socialist and thinks that the state should decide what people do for a living. Why people don't know this I find odd.
 


darkwolf666

Well-known member
Nov 8, 2015
7,575
Sittingbourne, Kent
so you're saying this representitive of all jobs available? you can provide the figures to support this, or using an example of a single visible group without any further research to back up the assertion?

No I am not saying these are the only jobs available, but for a certain demographic, the ones that the figures relate to when the politicians bleat they have created a million jobs or whatever figure they wish to pluck out of the air, then yes this is representative!
 




beorhthelm

A. Virgo, Football Genius
Jul 21, 2003
35,264
No I am not saying these are the only jobs available, but for a certain demographic, the ones that the figures relate to when the politicians bleat they have created a million jobs or whatever figure they wish to pluck out of the air, then yes this is representative!

when politicans talk about the employment and unemployment numbers, they are talking about the of the whole nation, not any demographical group. thats really point of my objection, those complaining are implying its only representive of a subset of data, without anything to back up or define what that is. i've never once seen someone show that the jobs are all low-paid, part time jobs, just an unfounded assumption thats the case.

here, i've looked it up:

ONS stats on changes in types of jobs 3mths to Jan 2016 year before.

and stats on changes in the number of jobs in the UK between December 2014 and December 2015,

in brief, the majority are not part time jobs at supermarkets.
 
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darkwolf666

Well-known member
Nov 8, 2015
7,575
Sittingbourne, Kent
when politicans talk about the employment and unemployment numbers, they are talking about the of the whole nation, not any demographical group. thats really point of my objection, those complaining are implying its only representive of a subset of data, without anything to back up or define what that is. i've never once seen someone show that the jobs are all low-paid, part time jobs, just an unfounded assumption thats the case.

here, i've looked it up:

ONS stats on changes in types of jobs 3mths to Jan 2016 year before.

and stats on changes in the number of jobs in the UK between December 2014 and December 2015,

in brief, the majority are not part time jobs at supermarkets.

Selective use of data there to back up your argument. The graphs quite clearly show that a third of all men and women are in part time employment. What they don't show is in what subset the part time jobs fall into, though I would care to wager it is the food and accommodation and other jobs categories! The very types of jobs I was alluding to.

Show me the data that's says the part time jobs are mainly in construction or scientific and I will concede you are right.
 



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