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Paul Barber on "Customers" vs "Fans"



Goldstone1976

We Got Calde in!!
Helpful Moderator
NSC Patreon
Apr 30, 2013
13,765
Herts
I have received an unsolicited email from PB following an email from a fan making him aware of the recent discussion on a NSC thread about him using the term "customer" to describe us. I reproduce it below unedited:

"I'm out of the office today but I've just been e-mailed by a fan who asked me to clarify why I describe Albion fans as "customers".

Apparently this came up at the chairman's fans forum in London last night, which unfortunately I was not at, and according to the email is now a debate on North Stand Chat too, so, through you if I may, I'm happy to clarify for everyone's benefit:

- firstly, I've never described Albion fans as "customers" (instead of fans/supporters). This seems to be something of a myth that one or two people like to perpetuate for whatever reason!

- from memory, my exact words were that "it's very important for football clubs to treat and think of their fans/supporters as customers...". And we absolutely should when it comes to service and communication.

- secondly, the reason/context this point was ever made was, I think, in response to a question I answered at an early fans forum about why the club had a " customer service department".

- it's worth noting that the Albion's customer service department, led superbly by Sally Townsend, who retired last year, was in place well before I arrived at the club - and I think dates back to Withdean years.

- I suspect the Albion would have originally established this department as part of a Football League mandate for ALL club's to publish a customer charter and to establish such a department (the Premier League has a similar charter and requirements for clubs).

- ironically, I re-named Albion's " customer service department" as " supporter services" as it covers a broader remit and I think it better describes what our team does in this area and the title of the department resonates more with fans.

- finally, I'm old enough to remember the time football clubs were NOT required or expected to think or treat supporters as customers - and, indeed, didn't: stadium conditions were terrible, letters went unanswered, phone calls went unreturned etc.

I therefore think the change in football club mindset towards its supporters is a good thing not a bad thing. I hope this helps."
 




Blue Valkyrie

Not seen such Bravery!
Sep 1, 2012
32,165
Valhalla
We are fans of the club, and also customers.

Not sure why it is portrayed as an either/or situation.
 




Jan 30, 2008
31,981
I have received an unsolicited email from PB following an email from a fan making him aware of the recent discussion on a NSC thread about him using the term "customer" to describe us. I reproduce it below unedited:

"I'm out of the office today but I've just been e-mailed by a fan who asked me to clarify why I describe Albion fans as "customers".

Apparently this came up at the chairman's fans forum in London last night, which unfortunately I was not at, and according to the email is now a debate on North Stand Chat too, so, through you if I may, I'm happy to clarify for everyone's benefit:

- firstly, I've never described Albion fans as "customers" (instead of fans/supporters). This seems to be something of a myth that one or two people like to perpetuate for whatever reason!

- from memory, my exact words were that "it's very important for football clubs to treat and think of their fans/supporters as customers...". And we absolutely should when it comes to service and communication.

- secondly, the reason/context this point was ever made was, I think, in response to a question I answered at an early fans forum about why the club had a " customer service department".

- it's worth noting that the Albion's customer service department, led superbly by Sally Townsend, who retired last year, was in place well before I arrived at the club - and I think dates back to Withdean years.

- I suspect the Albion would have originally established this department as part of a Football League mandate for ALL club's to publish a customer charter and to establish such a department (the Premier League has a similar charter and requirements for clubs).

- ironically, I re-named Albion's " customer service department" as " supporter services" as it covers a broader remit and I think it better describes what our team does in this area and the title of the department resonates more with fans.

- finally, I'm old enough to remember the time football clubs were NOT required or expected to think or treat supporters as customers - and, indeed, didn't: stadium conditions were terrible, letters went unanswered, phone calls went unreturned etc.

I therefore think the change in football club mindset towards its supporters is a good thing not a bad thing. I hope this helps."
sounds like a lot of spin still quoting fans and supporters as customers when it suits the club
regards
DR
 








Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patreon
Jul 11, 2003
59,199
The Fatherland
Fair reply.
 




Goldstone1976

We Got Calde in!!
Helpful Moderator
NSC Patreon
Apr 30, 2013
13,765
Herts
I don't think this is a subject I've ever offered an opinion on, but for what it's worth, I consider myself a fan of the BHAFC team and a customer of the various peripheral stuff that goes around that - I do expect phone calls to be answered promptly and the staff to be polite, knowledgeable and helpful; I want to be able to buy my beer promptly; I want admin issues to be resolved swiftly, etc.

PB says that he's never actually referred to us as "customers" per se; fair enough. Even if he had - I wouldn't care - honestly.
 


Notters

Well-known member
Oct 20, 2003
24,865
Guiseley
Can see why anyone is bothered about it but I would say, using strict definitions:

Fan - anyone that follows the club's results
Supporter - anyone that provides a benefit to the club in any way, either through giving them money, cheering the team on, etc.
Customer - anyone who buys anything from the club, be that tickets or merchandise.

Most of us will be all three.
 


The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
PB says that he's never actually referred to us as "customers" per se; fair enough. Even if he had - I wouldn't care - honestly.

'Customers', to some, appears to have changed its meaning from 'person offering his or her custom' to the far more sinister 'cash cows'.

I think it all started from when the tannoy announcer after a game in WSL concourse said something along the lines of 'would customer please note this bar will be closing in 10 minutes...' From there, it snowballed into the mock-outrage of 'this is something new that Paul Barber has introduced, and he doesn't want to treat us like fans...', notwithstanding the fact that these announcements were being made when the stadium opened.

As with most others, I am a fan of the club and a customer at the bar. I could hardly call myself a West Stand Upper concourse bar 'fan'.
 




Monsieur Le Plonk

Lethargy in motion
Apr 22, 2009
1,858
By a lake
The fact that our CEO has to spend even a second writing about this sort of thing is one of the reasons why I despair of some of our idiotic fans.

Agree totally.

In one hand I have huge respect for his willingness to work with the fans via NSC but my other hand wants to give him a friendly slap and tell him to take a look at the message board of our friends up the road and see where it can all lead.

There's a fair few on here with Barber agendas' and no amount of explanatory emails will pacify them. Best ignored.
 


Tom Hark Preston Park

Will Post For Cash
Jul 6, 2003
69,880
- ironically, I re-named Albion's " customer service department" as " supporter services" as it covers a broader remit and I think it better describes what our team does in this area and the title of the department resonates more with fans.

Is it just me that finds this downright odd? Just about every company in the land has a customer services department. It's about the sole aspect of the club where you would expect them to use the word 'customer'.
 


Moshe Gariani

Well-known member
Mar 10, 2005
12,068
Typically reasonable and well explained stuff from Paul Barber.

Utterly disingenuous (to use the word of the moment) of NSC to collectively try and pretend nobody has been bothered about the "customers" v "fans" issue. It is potentially symbolic of something important and those looking to beat the club have been quick to use it as a stick.
 




ozzygull

Well-known member
Oct 6, 2003
3,775
Reading
Blimey. How anyone has got in a tizz, that requires the CEO to respond about this is beyond me. They really can't have a lot going on in their lives.
 




SAC

Well-known member
May 21, 2014
2,534
The fact that our CEO has to spend even a second writing about this sort of thing is one of the reasons why I despair of some of our idiotic fans.

The fact that the CEO feels the need to spend even a second writing about this sort of thing is one of the reasons why I despair of him.
 


Worthingite

Sexy Pete... :D
Sep 16, 2011
4,959
Worthing
I think from the tone of the email, that PB is starting to get a little bit pig sick of being held under such constant scrutiny. Every syllable that he comes out with is pored over and every possible slant is applied to what he says. I trust that he has the best interests of the club as a whole - staff, fans, facilities, the whole lot- and the goldfish like bowl of accountability must be draining. He might not get everything right, and there are always improvements to be made, but if he was to finally decide that he's had enough of the mudslinging and he disappeared, we'd be a weaker club for it. Sometimes I look at posts on here and think "seriously?!?". How needy are we as fans to constantly have our egos stroked by someone who is working hard to ensure that we have a club that can compete long term. Let him get on with his job!!!!
 




kevtherev

Well-known member
Feb 28, 2008
10,443
Tunbridge Wells
We will all be fans again now. Because customers can ask for refunds, if they are not happy with the product they pay for and the "customer" is always right...Except in this instance it would appear.
 





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