The Tax Man

Official Old Man · Nov 13, 2014

Thought I'd share this with you to cheer up those with a 9 to 5 job.
I'm self employed and have 4 staff on PAYE. I have to send weekly reports to the HMRC about their earnings. Then every quarter I have to pay HMRC all tax & N.I. due. Unfortunately I took a well deserved holiday in October and missed filing two pay slips plus I was late paying the tax due (by late I mean 16 days and £1146 was due). Well how could I do this as I'm on holiday? Another beer please and sun cream my back. I've been fined and told not to do it again or the fine will be higher. I asked the girl what I could do and she replied, in all seriousness, don't go on holiday when payments are due!
I wonder if the tax man, or girl in this case, live in the real world?

drew · Nov 13, 2014

I remember the good times said:
Thought I'd share this with you to cheer up those with a 9 to 5 job.
I'm self employed and have 4 staff on PAYE. I have to send weekly reports to the HMRC about their earnings. Then every quarter I have to pay HMRC all tax & N.I. due. Unfortunately I took a well deserved holiday in October and missed filing two pay slips plus I was late paying the tax due (by late I mean 16 days and £1146 was due). Well how could I do this as I'm on holiday? Another beer please and sun cream my back. I've been fined and told not to do it again or the fine will be higher. I asked the girl what I could do and she replied, in all seriousness, don't go on holiday when payments are due!
I wonder if the tax man, or girl in this case, live in the real world?

Would they not accept a payment earlier than the due date, ie before you went on holiday?

Worthingite · Nov 13, 2014

Could you not have left the stuff for one of your staff to submit?

surrey jim · Nov 13, 2014

Eit: misread

Grapes of Wrath · Nov 13, 2014

The due dates and the penalty for missing them are quite clear, so no excuses really and no sympathy I am afraid.

Maybe not the best analogy, but if you are late getting back to your car and the time on the ticket has expired, you should not be surprised to find yourself with a parking ticket. Whether you like them or not, rules are rules.

soistes · Nov 13, 2014

Don't really understand the issue here. If you know the due date, and the payment amount, even if you don't want to pay in advance it's a trivial matter to set up an electronic payment which will go automatically on the required date. Failing that, you could have logged on to your account while on holiday and made the payment.

Don't see what being on holiday has to do with it. If you run a business, you set up systems (human or electronic) to deal with this kind of thing, and you can still go on holiday. Presumably your staff still get paid while you're on holiday, so why not the tax man?

Alex Alex Dawson oo! oo! · Nov 13, 2014

Have you looked at the comparative cost to the business of what you do currently and:

1) Contracting out the payroll function.
2) Switching to a monthly payroll.
3) Both 1 & 2.

Dick Knights Mumm · Nov 13, 2014

I know David Gill - when he joined Man U he had to break the news to the players they were moving from weekly to a monthly payroll.

Gazwag · Nov 13, 2014

1. Why on earth do you run your payroll on a weekly basis, since the start of RTI anybody who didn't convert to monthly is silly.

2. Why didn't you run your payroll early, you can file RTI reports in advance.

3. You know when your liabilities are due no excuse for not paying on time, its easy to set up a bank payment a month in advance.

4. You wonder if the tax man live in the real world, I wonder if you do

Herr Tubthumper · Nov 13, 2014

I'm in Team Tax Man on this one I think. I'm struggling to see the OP's point.

Official Old Man · Nov 13, 2014

Gazwag said:
1. Why on earth do you run your payroll on a weekly basis, since the start of RTI anybody who didn't convert to monthly is silly.

2. Why didn't you run your payroll early, you can file RTI reports in advance.

3. You know when your liabilities are due no excuse for not paying on time, its easy to set up a bank payment a month in advance.

4. You wonder if the tax man live in the real world, I wonder if you do

WOW!
1. My staff want to be paid weekly and that is how it is.
2. They work different hours each week and so I do not know there hours in advance. On a Sunday they tell me how many hours they worked and get paid. I cant file early if I did not know the wages.
3. I did not know my liabilities. As the staff had not been paid I did not know how much was due.
I would imagine 1000's of small businesses are like me.

mac04 · Nov 13, 2014

How did you pay your staff while you were on holiday?

mac04 · Nov 13, 2014

If you insist on retaining a weekly payroll, you could process the payroll before you go on holiday, paying your staff estimated payments that leave your account while you are away, so that you could submit the FPS return for RTI in advance.

Then pay them an correction to your estimates the week after you return.

One Love · Nov 13, 2014

Pretty sure the RTI penalties were deferred until 6 March 2015 so you shouldn't be charged but they should have told you this over the phone!

Alex Alex Dawson oo! oo! · Nov 13, 2014

One Love said:
Pretty sure the RTI penalties were deferred until 6 March 2015 so you shouldn't be charged but they should have told you this over the phone!

RTI penalties don't apply until 6 March 2015 for employers with less than 50 employees. Anyone else think there's something not quite right about this thread/OP?

https://www.gov.uk/what-happens-if-you-dont-report-payroll-information-on-time

nwgull · Nov 13, 2014

I remember the good times said:
WOW!
1. My staff want to be paid weekly and that is how it is.
2. They work different hours each week and so I do not know there hours in advance. On a Sunday they tell me how many hours they worked and get paid. I cant file early if I did not know the wages.
3. I did not know my liabilities. As the staff had not been paid I did not know how much was due.
I would imagine 1000's of small businesses are like me.

I have a solution that may (or may not) work for you based on how we pay our staff. Pay them a basic weekly amount based on their core hours, and any extra they work in that week gets paid a week in arrears.

You're also making life hard by paying weekly, but that's up to you.

I have sympathy for the admin side of things that you have to go through, but you have to accept that running a small business and employing people is a responsibility that doesn't disappear when you go on holiday. I'm going to guess that you earn a fair bit more than you would by being self-employed and having staff than you would if you were on someone eels payroll.

Gazwag · Nov 13, 2014

I remember the good times said:
WOW!
1. My staff want to be paid weekly and that is how it is.
2. They work different hours each week and so I do not know there hours in advance. On a Sunday they tell me how many hours they worked and get paid. I cant file early if I did not know the wages.
3. I did not know my liabilities. As the staff had not been paid I did not know how much was due.
I would imagine 1000's of small businesses are like me.

Ok (sensible post) how did the staff get paid while you were on holiday?

Gazwag · Nov 13, 2014

One Love said:
Pretty sure the RTI penalties were deferred until 6 March 2015 so you shouldn't be charged but they should have told you this over the phone!

There are no penalties for late RTI submission for small employers until after that date BUT there is interest on late payment of tax, which is probably the issue here.

Official Old Man · Nov 13, 2014

I paid the staff by working out their average pay per hour based on 50 hours (as I was away they were more than happy to work extra) and allowed them to multiply by their hours and take the cash. Say £6.78 per hour AFTER deductions. On my return they gave me their work sheets and I did an exact figure. If I recall I owed them on average a few £'s each. My staff are VERY reliable and I trust them all.
In future I will look into paying them 'in advance', or at least doing their payslips and sending off to HMRC. Can I send an RTI in advance though?
And yes nwgull, I earn a heck of a lot more being self employed, hence I can go away on expensive holidays. Doing it again in three weeks (landing at Gatwick two hours before Millwall KO).

Gazwag · Nov 13, 2014

Prepare payslips for the period you are away based on what you expect to pay them. You can file as many RTI submissions in advance as you want to. When you get back adjust their next payslip to take into account any over/under hours. If you will be away when the paye/nic payment is due set up a bank payment in advance so it is automatically paid on the correct date.

Got something to say or just want fewer pesky ads? Join us... 😊

The Tax Man

Uckfield Seagull

Drew

Sexy Pete... :D

Not in Surrey

Active member

Well-known member

Primary data is fact

Take me Home Falmer Road

5 millionth post poster

Well-known member

Uckfield Seagull

Active member

Active member

Well-known member

Primary data is fact

Well-known member

5 millionth post poster

5 millionth post poster

Uckfield Seagull

5 millionth post poster

Share this page