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English football considers league restructure



The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
A new competition for Premier League and Championship clubs to field B teams will be considered by the Football Association on Wednesday.

It has been proposed that the teams could play in a league sandwiched between League Two and the Conference. Another option is to merge League Two and the Conference with the B teams to form two regional leagues.

The proposals are part of FA chairman Greg Dyke's commission on the future of the national team.

It is understood that the Premier League and Football League clubs are broadly in favour of the B team concept, which would be predominantly made up of homegrown players, but have reservations about how it might fit into the pyramid and the knock-on effects to other leagues and competitions.

One question is whether current League Two clubs would be relegated into the Conference or the new B team league if they went down. The other difficult issue is how far could B teams be promoted?

Despite those worries, one source told the BBC that following more than 300 interviews with clubs and other stakeholders in the game, led by research consultant Peter Beverley, there was a universal acceptance that a major overhaul was needed to ensure big clubs' reserve teams and younger English talent were being given more regular, competitive football.

Commission members point to the fact that clubs in Spain, France and Germany all play B teams in competitive leagues - thought to be a big factor in those countries developing talent.

Dyke is believed to be keen to open the debate about the state of the national game ahead of the World Cup finals in Brazil which kick off on 12 June.

There is a determination to get on the front foot ahead of the tournament to pre-empt the inevitable debate which will follow if Roy Hodgson's England team put in a disappointing performance in Brazil.

Ironically the emergence of players like Raheem Sterling at Liverpool and Adam Lallana at Southampton have taken some of the heat out of that debate in recent months.

And some senior figures inside the FA are urging Dyke to hold fire until after the competition and until all the finer details of the commission's proposals are ironed out.

The Dyke commission was set up last autumn to try and address ongoing concerns about the strength of the English national team and the lack of top-class English talent forcing its way through into Premier League first teams.

The commission, which includes former England manager Glenn Hoddle, former Leeds boss Howard Wilkinson and ex-Crewe manager Dario Gradi, is aiming to deal with two major questions - the pathway for players aged between 17 and 21 and grassroots facilities.

While it is thought the commission has done extensive work on the first question, the issue of grassroots football is not yet complete.

Other proposals expected to go before the FA board on Wednesday include a shake-up of the loan system and changes to the homegrown player quotas operated by Premier League and Football League clubs.

But it is the B team proposal that promises to be the most controversial.
 




hybrid_x

Banned
Jun 28, 2011
2,225
Horrible idea.....obviously being pushed by the likes of Manu and Chelsea.

Look at the state of Spanish and Italian football below the top divisions.

At the moment in England, a local park team can pretty much end up in the league......if the B teams come in - this will cease.
 




KZNSeagull

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
19,792
Wolsingham, County Durham
We would not have to consider this if the young English talent were good enough to get in the first teams in the first place and it is this that the FA must address.

Having said that, we are where we are so something has to be done. The idea of having competitive B team matches is a reasonable idea, but I would go for something like having their own league and the winners get a place in the League Cup or something, rather than disrupting the current league setup.
 


Triggaaar

Well-known member
Oct 24, 2005
50,156
Goldstone
The idea of having competitive B team matches is a reasonable idea, but I would go for something like having their own league and the winners get a place in the League Cup or something, rather than disrupting the current league setup.
I agree with that. I don't care if it's always the top few teams that win it, if it's English/Welsh players only, then we're giving the talent match practice.
 




Westdene Seagull

aka Cap'n Carl Firecrotch
NSC Patron
Oct 27, 2003
20,994
The arse end of Hangleton
I guess it depends on priorities - is having a strong England team more important than a strong league system ?

Given how good this season has been across all the leagues - tight at top and bottom of each with much not decided until the last few games - I as a football supporter would rather they left well alone. If England can't compete so be it, I'm very much used to being disappointed by them.
 


The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
We would not have to consider this if the young English talent were good enough to get in the first teams in the first place and it is this that the FA must address.

Having said that, we are where we are so something has to be done. The idea of having competitive B team matches is a reasonable idea, but I would go for something like having their own league and the winners get a place in the League Cup or something, rather than disrupting the current league setup.

We do currently have a form of that - the Development Squads are highly thought of.

A place in a senior tournament could be interesting, though.
 


Not Andy Naylor

Well-known member
Dec 12, 2007
8,797
Seven Dials
I thought we already had a competitions for B teams - the Capital One Cup.
 




Superphil

Dismember
Jul 7, 2003
25,416
In a pile of football shirts
This happens extensively in Germany, where their league system is consistently held up as an example of a positive way to run football. :shrug:
 


KZNSeagull

Well-known member
Nov 26, 2007
19,792
Wolsingham, County Durham
I guess it depends on priorities - is having a strong England team more important than a strong league system ?

Given how good this season has been across all the leagues - tight at top and bottom of each with much not decided until the last few games - I as a football supporter would rather they left well alone. If England can't compete so be it, I'm very much used to being disappointed by them.

But would it not be even more exciting if the top teams were predominantly English/British, without having a loss of quality? That is what the FA should be aiming for in my opinion. If you have a strong league of homegrown talent, supplemented by foreign stars, then the home nations will benefit as a result.

I am not against foreign players at all, but I find it disappointing that the Premier League is now full of average foreign players because the young English/British players are not good enough and it is this that the FA have to address.
 


severnside gull

Well-known member
May 16, 2007
24,540
By the seaside in West Somerset
"Homegrown" players does not mean "English".....it means academy players currently culled from junior football across the world (ie. currently qualified as DS squad players).
it will not exclusively target English players (or any other nationality) nor can it without challenge in the courts under Human Rights etc legislation.
 




ElectricNaz

Well-known member
Jan 23, 2013
838
Hampshire
My inital thoughts are this would destroy lower league football. A number of league 1 and 2 clubs rely on loan signings to put out a first 11 each week without being crippled by players who want big money on long contracts (relative to what the club can afford).

If there was a B Team in one of the lower divisions, i.e. Championship / L1 level similar to Spain, Germany, the loan system would be destroyed. Could you see clubs like Arsenal, City and Chelsea loaning their top young prospects out to a team who have rubbish training facilities and a lower standard of coaching, as opposed to staying at the club, recieving a good level of football and high quality training?

Obviously it will improve the national squad (assuming English players actually play in the B teams) but it could destory several clubs. Is that really what we want?

Could also be farcical where if United, Chelsea, Liverpool, Arsenal, City all have B teams in League 1 for instance, but can't be promoted. You'd end up with the 6th place team effectively 'winning' the league. Shambles.
 


The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
With this plan does highlight is an admission that the great 1992 shake-up has failed in at least one respect - the improvement of the English national side. In fact, it has regressed while others have progressed.
 






MarioOrlandi

New member
Jun 4, 2013
580
Er mmm "B team" well er yes hrumph any idea what they are? Personally I like the term "reserves" Because that is what they are and if their leagues are not good enough then it is down to the FA who allowed the Premier League to have their own reserve division. If you play with or against better players your game improves, there was not a lot wrong with the football combination leagues
 






Vegas Seagull

New member
Jul 10, 2009
7,782
What happens when the 'B' teams from the PL Big 6 end up at the top of The Championship but are not allowed to get promoted. Do they 'win' the division to they oh into the playoffs, if we are scheduled to play Arsenal B at Wembley play off final do we get a bye...shambles all round and will ruin lower league footy
 




father_and_son

Well-known member
Jan 23, 2012
4,646
Under the Police Box
So when most clubs in FL/PL have a wages to turnover ratio in excess of 100% let propose that all the clubs can create another team of players (because so many teams have enough fit/uninjured players that the loan system is massively under used) and play them in the leagues too. What a wonderful plan that plays perfectly with FFP! (FFS Greg!)
 


Black Rod

Well-known member
Jan 19, 2013
945
how is it progress for a long standing club with tradition (e.g) Grimsby to get promoted back to the league only to get beat 0-5 by Chelsea's B team of international superstars?

Are Grimsby ever likely to produce six or seven young English players who could represent their country in 3-5 years time compared to Man United B?
 


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