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Anybody a mountaineering expert or astronaut?



brixtonA23

New member
Aug 5, 2011
376
I was watching a documentary about Mount Everest and the deadliest storm. I was informed that after 8000 metres you enter the death zone, where as humans we cannot function due to altitude. Mountaineers have overcome this by taking oxygen to maintain their walk to the summit. Even in real footage they walk, very slowly, and if recording their journey, pant like a dog asking for water.

My problem is that the moon isn't exactly kind to us, yet the brave Apollo astronauts jumped around, played golf and had a drive on an oxygen free satellite. Even their live feed never sounded as though they were in anyway suffering.

Can anybody tell me why the technology (and physiology) to visit an oxygen free environment is surmountable but not the death zone on the planet that we live in?
 


teaboy

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
1,840
My house
I was watching a documentary about Mount Everest and the deadliest storm. I was informed that after 8000 metres you enter the death zone, where as humans we cannot function due to altitude. Mountaineers have overcome this by taking oxygen to maintain their walk to the summit. Even in real footage they walk, very slowly, and if recording their journey, pant like a dog asking for water.

My problem is that the moon isn't exactly kind to us, yet the brave Apollo astronauts jumped around, played golf and had a drive on an oxygen free satellite. Even their live feed never sounded as though they were in anyway suffering.

Can anybody tell me why the technology (and physiology) to visit an oxygen free environment is surmountable but not the death zone on the planet that we live in?

Eh? That statement isn't true. I'd assume (IF this 'death zone' exists) it is meant that without oxygen it may be almost impossible. Try it in a space suit - you'll be fine.
 


brixtonA23

New member
Aug 5, 2011
376
Eh? That statement isn't true. I'd assume (IF this 'death zone' exists) it is meant that without oxygen it may be almost impossible. Try it in a space suit - you'll be fine.

I was hoping for a mountaineer to answer

Everest has been climbed by people without oxygen.
 


Gullflyinghigh

Registered User
Apr 23, 2012
4,279
I know very little of either but I'd have to assume that the ability to effectively control your conditions on the moon would help immensely.

You would control your temperature, levels of exertion and difficulty of route. Mountain climbing isn't likely to be as friendly (Wind, snow, gravity).
 
















brixtonA23

New member
Aug 5, 2011
376
I'm no expert but would imagine that gravity plays a part.

Mr Bolt. It's Monday morning but genuinely laughed when I noticed your footnote. I think it's Mark Twain and NSC can be a bear pit. To post a thread always fills me with trepidation.
 


teaboy

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
1,840
My house
I was watching a documentary about Mount Everest and the deadliest storm. I was informed that after 8000 metres you enter the death zone, where as humans we cannot function due to altitude. Mountaineers have overcome this by taking oxygen to maintain their walk to the summit. Even in real footage they walk, very slowly, and if recording their journey, pant like a dog asking for water.

My problem is that the moon isn't exactly kind to us, yet the brave Apollo astronauts jumped around, played golf and had a drive on an oxygen free satellite. Even their live feed never sounded as though they were in anyway suffering.

Can anybody tell me why the technology (and physiology) to visit an oxygen free environment is surmountable but not the death zone on the planet that we live in?

My last comment on this (probably!) - You do realise that you aren't comparing like with like? Astronauts were using oxygen and space-suits to enable them to survive on the moon. Mountaineers, as you say, have climbed to 8000m without that sort of support. I'm failing to see how (and why!) you're comparing the two things.
 








skipper734

Registered ruffian
Aug 9, 2008
9,189
Curdridge
hilary-step_09102012_fe.jpg This lot are queuing on the Hilary Step. Madness. index.php?rex_resize=186w__portrait_rm_001.jpg This Guy is a proper climber. Would rock up at base camp, pitch his tent, in which he left to wait for his return, his latest girlfriend. He then set out for the Summit, on his own. No oxygen.

An American has saved me a lot of typing, enjoy. http://www.badassoftheweek.com/messner.html
 




brixtonA23

New member
Aug 5, 2011
376
View attachment 44779 This lot are queuing on the Hilary Step. Madness. View attachment 44780 This Guy is a proper climber. Would rock up at base camp, pitch his tent, in which he left to wait for his return, his latest girlfriend. He then set out for the Summit, on his own. No oxygen.

An American has saved me a lot of typing, enjoy. http://www.badassoftheweek.com/messner.html

I've never noticed footnotes before and maybe just a bit tired on a quiet Monday so have some time to digest some posts. But I've laughed on one and I have to ask you if you preferred Rutger to Anthony on a most beautiful bit or writing.
 


skipper734

Registered ruffian
Aug 9, 2008
9,189
Curdridge
I've never noticed footnotes before and maybe just a bit tired on a quiet Monday so have some time to digest some posts. But I've laughed on one and I have to ask you if you preferred Rutger to Anthony on a most beautiful bit or writing.


Rutger of course.
 










sully

Dunscouting
Jul 7, 2003
7,824
Worthing
Activity at high altitude is certainly far harder than at sea level and there are potential health risks relating to "altitude sickness".
One of my friends died after going to high altitude. He was otherwise a fit and healthy human being, but some people adapt to the lack of oxygen and others don't so well. It is mostly to do with speed of ascent in my experience, but there are some mountaineers who seem to be able to ascend rapidly without too many dramas.
Bottom line for me is that you have to search out how your own body copes with these things before taking too many risks. I was lucky not to suffer too badly from altitude, but always put it down to being too slow to be able to ascend too quickly!
However, the photo posted earlier of the Hilary Step queue has made me feel much better about my choices of where to go in the mountains. I hated the summit of Mont Blanc because of the number of people up there who care little about their fellow human beings and just have a fixed focus on getting themselves to the top. I imagine the same sort of self-centredness exists on these big popular mountains, too. And that's before we get onto walking around dead bodies, discarded rubbish and human waste!
Death zone may be a strong description, but there are many humans for which it is a reality, as they cannot adapt to survive there.

By the way, I recommend high altitude mountaineering to anyone who wants to lose weight but has failed on every diet to date - so long as you don't mind a bit of muscle wastage along the way, too!
 



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