IPSA - Right or Wrong?

drew · Jul 11, 2013

So IPSA have now announced their proposals for the reform of parliamentary pay for our downtrodden MPs. The headline figure of a £6k pay rise seems on the face of it shocking, especially when taking into account the restraint imposed on the rest of the public sector by the coalition. The head of IPSA stated that the net cost of the changes to the public purse is only £500k and went on to try and justify this by claiming that, since they were introduced in 2010, they have saved about £35m on the expenses of MPs. Funny that because surely all they have done is stop MPs cheating the system!

There are some changes that seem overdue, in particular in relation to the resettlement packages when an MP gives up his seat, and also to the pensions which are overly generous and on a final salary basis rather than money purchase which most others seem to have had foisted upon them.

Love the fact that Gove has come out and said that they can stuff their pay rise because he doesn't want it. Nice bearing in mind he is on a ministerial salary and that in the expense scandal, he claimed £7k for kitting out his home before flipping it around and then claiming another £17k!!! Not exactly on the moral high ground.

If they want to compare them to overseas representatives then why don't they do the same for the likes of social workers who are probably underpaid compared to other countries. I would suspect that there are numerous examples of where public sector in the UK earn less than abroad but we don't see their pay being increased by nearly 10%.

Whole thing stinks.

Cheshire Cat · Jul 11, 2013

Really they should get a rise since their pay has been restricted for political reasons for some time - however the timing is appalling, and since my pay has also been severely restricted for political reasons for five years, they can get stuffed

DavidinSouthampton · Jul 11, 2013

I don't have a problem with the idea of MP's being very well paid, given the responsibility they have, and most genuinely work hard for their constituencies.

But expenses and allowances need to be kept under control, as does the amount of time they can spend earning money elsewhere. I genuinely don't know how big a problem the second of these is, but being an MP is a (more than?) full-time job, so how can you do something else and do it properly.

Herr Tubthumper · Jul 11, 2013

So, the public sector emloyees which have totally and utterly failed us and destroyed the UK get a 6k pay rise whilst they continue to demonise , sack or cut the pay of their public sector colleagues. In a word *****.

vegster · Jul 11, 2013

I've always liked IPA

Geriatric Seagull · Jul 11, 2013

What else would you expect from a bunch of largely public school cronies, many of them already millionaires, who have no idea of life in the real world! We're all in it together? Ho - ho!!

MissGull · Jul 11, 2013

I'm glad there are going to be some further caps on expenses. Surely though, the money saved in this is just going to be paid out to meet the salary increase?

Mellor 3 Ward 4 · Jul 11, 2013

So an MP earns in a year about half of Wayne Rooney's weekly wage.

I would probably double their salaries, halve their holidays, stop their golden goodbyes and final Salary pensions, stop them having any outside jobs/consultancies, scrap their expenses etc....

drew · Jul 11, 2013

Mellor 3 Ward 4 said:
So an MP earns in a year about half of Wayne Rooney's weekly wage.

I would probably double their salaries, halve their holidays, stop their golden goodbyes and final Salary pensions, stop them having any outside jobs/consultancies, scrap their expenses etc....

Seriously concerned if you base the salary of public sector servants on the salary of someone in a free market who is an exception rather than the average in terms of salary in his industry.

Of course, that could bring us on to the subject of a footballer paid £150k a week (roughly £4,250 per hour based on a generous 35 hour week although not sure any footballer works that many hours!) who then gets off 250 hours of community service by paying a £3k fine, ie an hourly rate of £85!!!!!!!!!!

Harry Wilson's tackle · Jul 12, 2013

Pay rise to compensate for loss of unfettered expenses and pension trough. A bit like being given free subscription to internet porn site as compensation for no longer having unrestricted access to the kids' nanny. It won't go down well with the electorate, but it won't affect the way we vote. So they will be able to do whatever they like. If the electorate really cared about this, they'd vote accordingly (there is always a single issue candidate on any ballot that would meet propriety requirements - but who votes for 'loonies'?)

Mind you, I heard today that Italian MPs 'earn' about three times as much as our lot . . . .

supaseagull · Jul 12, 2013

Mellor 3 Ward 4 said:
So an MP earns in a year about half of Wayne Rooney's weekly wage.

I would probably double their salaries, halve their holidays, stop their golden goodbyes and final Salary pensions, stop them having any outside jobs/consultancies, scrap their expenses etc....

on average backbench MP's earn on average £120k pa when taking into consideration 2nd jobs, expenses and second homes.

Many then become Life Peers and go on to work for either a "quango" or for large multi-national companies.

Quite simply, they don't NEED pay rises

somerset · Jul 12, 2013

Mellor 3 Ward 4 said:
So an MP earns in a year about half of Wayne Rooney's weekly wage.

I would probably double their salaries, halve their holidays, stop their golden goodbyes and final Salary pensions, stop them having any outside jobs/consultancies, scrap their expenses etc....

Why can't they have final salary pensions?.....I do, due to hard work and study, and getting a decent job that pays one.

MP's are underpaid when compared to a lot of countries representatives, the expenses debacle was tackled, and is continuing to be tackled, this being my only bone of contention.

Pay peanuts get monkeys. If the pay is right, you will in most cases get good calibre people to run the country properly, and at the same time eliminate the attraction of other interests diverting them from their primary role.

Tricky Dicky · Jul 12, 2013

Mellor 3 Ward 4 said:
So an MP earns in a year about half of Wayne Rooney's weekly wage.

I would probably double their salaries, halve their holidays, stop their golden goodbyes and final Salary pensions, stop them having any outside jobs/consultancies, scrap their expenses etc....

Absolutely, I've said this for ages. Give them a pay rise (although not at the moment while everyone else is suffering) - but stop them taking second paid jobs. They ought to be busy enough doing parliamentary and constituency work, without doing other stuff too.

drew · Jul 12, 2013

somerset said:
Why can't they have final salary pensions?.....I do, due to hard work and study, and getting a decent job that pays one.

MP's are underpaid when compared to a lot of countries representatives, the expenses debacle was tackled, and is continuing to be tackled, this being my only bone of contention.

Pay peanuts get monkeys. If the pay is right, you will in most cases get good calibre people to run the country properly, and at the same time eliminate the attraction of other interests diverting them from their primary role.

Do you honestly believe paying more would attract better candidates. A lot of tories have incomes far exceeding their MPs salaries, eg Cameron and Osborne so increases in salary wouldn't have made a difference to them. Same with many on the labour shadow bench.

somerset · Jul 12, 2013

supaseagull said:
on average backbench MP's earn on average £120k pa when taking into consideration 2nd jobs, expenses and second homes.

Many then become Life Peers and go on to work for either a "quango" or for large multi-national companies.

Quite simply, they don't NEED pay rises

http://m.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-13638310

somerset · Jul 12, 2013

drew said:
Do you honestly believe paying more would attract better candidates.

Yes

drew said:
Same with many on the labour shadow bench.

I bet that hurt for you to admit that?!

cloud · Jul 12, 2013

Pay has gone up (though it's not as high as 6% if you take into account inflation), but it has been offset by

- A reduction in pensions
- A reduction in the redundancy package when you lose your seat, plus you won't get the redundancy package if you quit your seat voluntarily
- Won't be able to claim for evening meals, or taxis if the tube system is still running

So the net effect is almost zero.

Plus, the pay deal is index linked, so each quarter their pay will be re-assessed and they will actually get a pay cut if the economy has not done well that quarter.

Remember though that this is not a done deal, but a consultation. Whatever is decided won't come into effect until the next Parliament. If you feel strongly about it then say so - go to http://www.snapsurveys.com/swh/surveylogin.asp?k=137338160315 or email them on mppayandpension@parliamentarystandards.org.uk

Kumquat · Jul 12, 2013

The problem is that when pay was frozen originally for MPs they were given the nod privately that expenses would be less monitored. Then came the economic crisis plus the expose of abuse of expenses and you had a catch 22 situation all of their own making.

The reality is that their pay should increase and their expense be rigorously monitored but the current situation makes that appallingly crass presentation wise. You could argue that presentation doesn't matter and that this is the situation and therefore that is what should happen.

I would personally favour an increase, but no MP should get it for two years and the money for those two years be spent in their constituencies on worthy causes, with the details published so everybody can see. I think that would be a pretty decent compromise.

edna krabappel · Jul 12, 2013

somerset said:
Why can't they have final salary pensions?.....I do, due to hard work and study, and getting a decent job that pays one.

Because they've spent the past four years trying to get rid of final salary pensions for the rest of the public sector, claiming the country can't afford it?

I also work hard, have studied for various qualifications, and have what I consider a "decent job" which promised me a final salary pension when I first joined. I, however, won't get that when I retire, however hard I work or how "decent" my job, because the same MPs who want a final salary pension for themselves, have voted that my pension and those of many other public sector colleagues should be changed to an average earnings pension.

So please, don't start equating earnings or pensionable income with attitude or ambition, because, quite simply, that's horseshit.

Westdene Seagull · Jul 12, 2013

The timing is awful BUT they are poorly paid. I wouldn't do the hours most of them do and give up many of weekends for £68k a year.

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IPSA - Right or Wrong?

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