M25 Jcts 10&11

goldstone · May 21, 2013

I drive the M25 clockwise most weekday mornings from the M23 to the M3. It is always backed up to the pinch-points at Jct 10 (A3) and Jct 11 (Chertsey) where it narrows to 3 lanes from 4.

My question. There is a hard shoulder through the junctions ... why not make this into a 4th lane so that there are four lanes all the way north?

It appears to me (and I'm no traffic management expert) that the reduction from 4 lanes to 3 at these junctions is the main reason for the awful traffic queues.

So I have the solution!! Common sense really.

Krusty · May 21, 2013

Fascinating. The best thing on NSC today :yawn:

Notters · May 21, 2013

I may be wrong but aren't there a few points where there is no hard shoulder due to bridges etc.?

essbee · May 21, 2013

I'm sure the ambulances/police cars which BY NECESSITY need to pile through hard shoulders
when there is an accident in the area for access would think it was fantastic common sense
as well. That's the main function of hard shoulders.

HawkTheSeagull · May 21, 2013

Notters said:
I may be wrong but aren't there a few points where there is no hard shoulder due to bridges etc.?

There is and you cant actually move them, using the hard shoulder could cause more traffic and possible crashes where people need to get off the hard shoulder.....or risk smashing into a bridge.

Cant exactly make it fully 4 lanes either.

Herr Tubthumper · May 21, 2013

goldstone said:
It appears to me (and I'm no traffic management expert) that the reduction from 4 lanes to 3 at these junctions is the main reason for the awful traffic queues.

It appears to me the reason is too many car drivers.

Notters · May 21, 2013

essbee said:
I'm sure the ambulances/police cars which BY NECESSITY need to pile through hard shoulders
when there is an accident in the area for access would think it was fantastic common sense
as well. That's the main function of hard shoulders.

Not at various points it isn't, e.g. the middle section of the M42.

Superphil · May 21, 2013

Notters said:
Not at various points it isn't, e.g. the middle section of the M42.

I believe there are plans afoot to make parts of the M25 4 lane in the same way they do on the M42 during peak times. No doubt it will mean 7 years of road works, and countless thousands of hours of queueing traffic for them to effect such a simple solution though.

essbee · May 21, 2013

Notters,

Generally speaking, hard shoulders are for the emergency services
(and of course emergencies we have - breakdowns etc).

Ok - there might be exceptions, but that's why cars that drive on a
hard shoulder when there's a jam will be fined/prosecuted
generally sh*t on by the authorities.

Since1982 · May 21, 2013

Speaking of which - I need to drive from Hassocks to Plymouth next week to arrive around lunchtime. I was thinking about how to avoid exactly these pinch points by going A3 to Guildford, Hogs Back and to the M3 or even along the coast. What is the collective wisdom of NSC?

hybrid_x · May 21, 2013

so glad i dont live in england anymore - used to get stuck on the m25 alot.........biggest waste of life on the planet.

hybrid_x · May 21, 2013

Since1982 said:
Speaking of which - I need to drive from Hassocks to Plymouth next week to arrive around lunchtime. I was thinking about how to avoid exactly these pinch points by going A3 to Guildford, Hogs Back and to the M3 or even along the coast. What is the collective wisdom of NSC?

go along the coast to southamptom - up near newbury to the the long road to the south west.

dougdeep · May 21, 2013

Since1982 said:
Speaking of which - I need to drive from Hassocks to Plymouth next week to arrive around lunchtime. I was thinking about how to avoid exactly these pinch points by going A3 to Guildford, Hogs Back and to the M3 or even along the coast. What is the collective wisdom of NSC?

Coast route. A31, A35. Ringwood, Dorchester, Honiton, Exeter.

Thunder Bolt · May 21, 2013

dougdeep said:
Coast route. A31, A35. Ringwood, Dorchester, Honiton, Exeter.

That would be my choice.

Cosmic Joker · May 21, 2013

goldstone said:
I drive the M25 clockwise most weekday mornings from the M23 to the M3. It is always backed up to the pinch-points at Jct 10 (A3) and Jct 11 (Chertsey) where it narrows to 3 lanes from 4.

My question. There is a hard shoulder through the junctions ... why not make this into a 4th lane so that there are four lanes all the way north?

It appears to me (and I'm no traffic management expert) that the reduction from 4 lanes to 3 at these junctions is the main reason for the awful traffic queues.

So I have the solution!! Common sense really.

Apart from the various legitimate comments about the hard shoulder through the junction, there's a hell of a lot of traffic with interchanges between the M25 and the A3 at that junction. This needs the dedicated lane off and lane gain joining to gain access to the motorway without creating (even more) massive queues up the slip roads and through the middle of the junction locking the whole thing up, also bunching in the nearside M25 lane appraoching the junction to get access to the slip road, which would leave almost no traffic using the extra lane created under the junction as straight ahead traffic would weave out to avoid this exit queue. If you had four lanes on the main motorway under the junction, you would need five lanes to either side to cater for the joining and leaving traffic.

Since1982 · May 21, 2013

Thunder Bolt said:
That would be my choice.

Thanks all. Sounds a good idea

Superphil · May 21, 2013

Since1982 said:
Speaking of which - I need to drive from Hassocks to Plymouth next week to arrive around lunchtime. I was thinking about how to avoid exactly these pinch points by going A3 to Guildford, Hogs Back and to the M3 or even along the coast. What is the collective wisdom of NSC?

My office is in Exeter, from Pulborough I use the A27/M27 to the Salisbury exit, go up to Salisbury, then out via Wilton for a few miles then get the A303. Follow that till the Taunton turn off, head towards Taunton then get the M5 to Exeter. Of all the routes I've tried, this is consistently the least congested, most pleasant and quickest.

Since1982 · May 21, 2013

Superphil said:
My office is in Exeter, from Pulborough I use the A27/M27 to the Salisbury exit, go up to Salisbury, then out via Wilton for a few miles then get the A303. Follow that till the Taunton turn off, head towards Taunton then get the M5 to Exeter. Of all the routes I've tried, this is consistently the least congested, most pleasant and quickest.

Interesting! I assumed getting up to and around Salisbury would likely be busy and slow. But will give this a try. Thanks

Superphil · May 21, 2013

Since1982 said:
Interesting! I assumed getting up to and around Salisbury would likely be busy and slow. But will give this a try. Thanks

It's only bad around morning rush, 8-9. Also, when you get to the ring road roundabout bit, turn left, then left at the next roundabout, then right at the lights, takes you round the south of Salisbury, towards and past the hospital and Quidhampton. That then brings you out on the A36, follow that north for 7 or 8 miles then onto the A303.

Brovion · May 22, 2013

Herr Tubthumper said:
It appears to me the reason is too many car drivers.

Too many people in South East England full stop. I'm glad they drive, I don't want any more on the trains.

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