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German Transport disaster









strings

strings

Moving further North...
Feb 19, 2006
9,965
Barnsley
That is bizarre. I spent my 18th in Munich. There was 2 foot of snow, and everything carried on as usual. I also remember going to Berlin during the snow and the locals barely batted an eyelid.
 




M

Muzzy

Well-known member
Jan 25, 2011
4,786
Lewes
Many people fail to realise that when the snow is falling, everyone struggles throughout Europe. I travel regularly and extensively all over The Alps during the winter and have come across many problems in very bad conditions whilst driving. One night I spent five hours to get from Tignes to Borg in the french alps, a journey that should usually take about 30 minutes!

The difference is that these countries are geared up to clear the snow once it stops falling. We cannot justify having this equipment available that will hardly ever get used. Trains, planes and automobiles will all come to a standstill at times every winter anywhere that the weather takes a turn for the worse. I've seen it many times. Salting/gritting the roads also makes little difference when the snow falls heavily too.

We just make more of a meal of it because we all like to moan and bitch at our authorities. I admit, they are slow to react at times but it's likely that our council workers are not trained to deal with these conditions that are few and far between.

It's not all a bed of roses abroad you know! We live in one of the best countries in the world and things could be a lot worse IMHO. :thumbsup:
 




Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
59,465
The Fatherland
Common as Mook said:
Seems like it isn't just an English problem. Trains ****ed in Berlin too.
Click to expand...

Are they? The trams were working fine 30 mins ago and there is only about 6 inches of snow here which is no where near enough to cause problems.
 


Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
59,465
The Fatherland
Herr Tubthumper said:
Are they? The trams were working fine 30 mins ago and there is only about 6 inches of snow here.
Click to expand...

And both airports are open and nothing being reported on the trains as far as I can see.
 


The Fifth Column

The Fifth Column

Retired ex-cop
Nov 30, 2010
4,015
Escaped from Corruption
Muzzy said:
Many people fail to realise that when the snow is falling, everyone struggles throughout Europe. I travel regularly and extensively all over The Alps during the winter and have come across many problems in very bad conditions whilst driving. One night I spent five hours to get from Tignes to Borg in the french alps, a journey that should usually take about 30 minutes!

The difference is that these countries are geared up to clear the snow once it stops falling. We cannot justify having this equipment available that will hardly ever get used. Trains, planes and automobiles will all come to a standstill at times every winter anywhere that the weather takes a turn for the worse. I've seen it many times. Salting/gritting the roads also makes little difference when the snow falls heavily too.

We just make more of a meal of it because we all like to moan and bitch at our authorities. I admit, they are slow to react at times but it's likely that our council workers are not trained to deal with these conditions that are few and far between.

It's not all a bed of roses abroad you know! We live in one of the best countries in the world and things could be a lot worse IMHO. :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

Totally agree, I also despair at ignorant moaners complaining about "where were the gritter lorries blah blah etc". Gritting roads won't stop the bloody snow falling and settling especially when it is sustained snow and blowing a gale and drifting etc, a sprinkling of salty grit isn't going to make the slightest difference in these circumstances, it's just called weather and you have to deal with it as best you can instead of blaming all and sundry because you can't get to the shops to buy stuff you don't particularly need and could have waited till conditions were better.
 




Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
59,465
The Fatherland
The Fifth Column said:
Totally agree, I also despair at ignorant moaners complaining about "where were the gritter lorries blah blah etc". Gritting roads won't stop the bloody snow falling and settling especially when it is sustained snow and blowing a gale and drifting etc, a sprinkling of salty grit isn't going to make the slightest difference in these circumstances, it's just called weather and you have to deal with it as best you can instead of blaming all and sundry because you can't get to the shops to buy stuff you don't particularly need and could have waited till conditions were better.
Click to expand...

We have had snow for the past three days, and the temperature has been below zero all this time and the gritting has made a huge difference. The grit lowers the freezing point of the ice/snow as far as I know and explains why all the roads around here are covered in dirty water but open yet the pavements are frozen solid with inches thick snow. Ignorant moaners?

Oh, and the football went ahead in the snow on Sunday.
 


Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
59,465
The Fatherland
strings said:
That is bizarre. I spent my 18th in Munich. There was 2 foot of snow, and everything carried on as usual. I also remember going to Berlin during the snow and the locals barely batted an eyelid.
Click to expand...

I think the OP was fishing because what you have said is pretty much correct. Foolishly I bit.
 


The Fifth Column

The Fifth Column

Retired ex-cop
Nov 30, 2010
4,015
Escaped from Corruption
Herr Tubthumper said:
We have had snow for the past three days, and the temperature has been below zero all this time and the gritting has made a huge difference. The grit lowers the freezing point of the ice/snow as far as I know and explains why all the roads around here are covered in dirty water but open yet the pavements are frozen solid with inches thick snow. Ignorant moaners?

Oh, and the football went ahead in the snow on Sunday.
Click to expand...

I'm not saying gritters don't work, they do, however they generally don't keep roads open when the snow is falling and drifting and laying so quickly, particularly when there are not so many of them because we can't justify spending the huge sums of money of fleets of gritters we may not use from year to year. Other countries that get regular and sustained wintry conditions have more resources to cope than we do, that's a fact. What annoys me are the moaners that seem to think we should have a gritter around every corner and that their mere presence will keep every road passable and snow and ice free.
 






C

Common as Mook

Not Posh as Fook
Jul 26, 2004
5,630
Herr Tubthumper said:
nothing being reported on the trains as far as I can see.
Click to expand...

Read the article - only going on what I read because thankfully, I don't live in Berlin.

Also, I know Frankfurt is shut because my boss can't get out. I've had lots of problems at Frankfurt previously with miniscule amounts snow falling.
 


Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
59,465
The Fatherland
The Fifth Column said:
Totally agree, I also despair at ignorant moaners complaining about "where were the gritter lorries blah blah etc". Gritting roads won't stop the bloody snow falling and settling especially when it is sustained snow and blowing a gale and drifting etc, a sprinkling of salty grit isn't going to make the slightest difference in these circumstances, it's just called weather and you have to deal with it as best you can instead of blaming all and sundry because you can't get to the shops to buy stuff you don't particularly need and could have waited till conditions were better.
Click to expand...

You're entitled to your view but in my mind people being stuck on the a23 over night in freezing conditions is totally and utterly unacceptable and also totally preventable. It should not happen.
 




Mackenzie

Mackenzie

Old Brightonian
Nov 7, 2003
33,532
East Wales
Herr Tubthumper said:
You're entitled to your view but in my mind people being stuck on the a23 over night in freezing conditions is totally and utterly unacceptable and also totally preventable.
Click to expand...
And vould not have happened.........:wink:
 


P

Pogue Mahone

Well-known member
Apr 30, 2011
10,732
The Fifth Column said:
Totally agree, I also despair at ignorant moaners complaining about "where were the gritter lorries blah blah etc". Gritting roads won't stop the bloody snow falling and settling especially when it is sustained snow and blowing a gale and drifting etc, a sprinkling of salty grit isn't going to make the slightest difference in these circumstances, it's just called weather and you have to deal with it as best you can instead of blaming all and sundry because you can't get to the shops to buy stuff you don't particularly need and could have waited till conditions were better.
Click to expand...

The salt in the grit lowers the freezing point of water to about -20 degrees as HT alluded to. Why do you think the sea doesn't freeze?

The lack of gritters yesterday afternoon was the MAIN cause of the carnage that I, amongst others, was stuck in. And I wasn't going shopping, I was going home from work. 20 minutes to drive from Hove to the pier (3 miles) and then 6 hours from the pier to Ovingdean.

I'm not the ignorant moaner in this thread.
 


P

Pogue Mahone

Well-known member
Apr 30, 2011
10,732
The Fifth Column said:
I'm not saying gritters don't work, they do, however they generally don't keep roads open when the snow is falling and drifting and laying so quickly, particularly when there are not so many of them because we can't justify spending the huge sums of money of fleets of gritters we may not use from year to year. Other countries that get regular and sustained wintry conditions have more resources to cope than we do, that's a fact. What annoys me are the moaners that seem to think we should have a gritter around every corner and that their mere presence will keep every road passable and snow and ice free.
Click to expand...

It's about preparation. The heavy snowfall was forecast days in advance. The A23 and A259 should have been repeatedly and thoroughly gritted all afternoon.
 


The Fifth Column

The Fifth Column

Retired ex-cop
Nov 30, 2010
4,015
Escaped from Corruption
Pogue Mahone said:
The salt in the grit lowers the freezing point of water to about -20 degrees as HT alluded to. Why do you think the sea doesn't freeze?

The lack of gritters yesterday afternoon was the MAIN cause of the carnage that I, amongst others, was stuck in. And I wasn't going shopping, I was going home from work. 20 minutes to drive from Hove to the pier (3 miles) and then 6 hours from the pier to Ovingdean.

I'm not the ignorant moaner in this thread.
Click to expand...

Thanks for the science lesson, get over it.
 






Weststander

Weststander

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Aug 25, 2011
63,875
Withdean area
Muzzy said:
Many people fail to realise that when the snow is falling, everyone struggles throughout Europe. I travel regularly and extensively all over The Alps during the winter and have come across many problems in very bad conditions whilst driving. One night I spent five hours to get from Tignes to Borg in the french alps, a journey that should usually take about 30 minutes!

The difference is that these countries are geared up to clear the snow once it stops falling. We cannot justify having this equipment available that will hardly ever get used. Trains, planes and automobiles will all come to a standstill at times every winter anywhere that the weather takes a turn for the worse. I've seen it many times. Salting/gritting the roads also makes little difference when the snow falls heavily too.

We just make more of a meal of it because we all like to moan and bitch at our authorities. I admit, they are slow to react at times but it's likely that our council workers are not trained to deal with these conditions that are few and far between.

It's not all a bed of roses abroad you know! We live in one of the best countries in the world and things could be a lot worse IMHO. :thumbsup:
Click to expand...

This.

We will never spend the billions the Austrian, Swiss, Finns, and so on spend, because of that still rare event of snow in southern England.

Similarly I've done a lot of driving in the Alps, and it does grind to a halt during snowfall, but as you say it's cleared as quickly as possible due to a mass of specialist and very expensive equipment.
 


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