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That is completely irrelevant. Players with good pedigree in other leagues have failed in the Premier League. Whatever pedigree Ryan has, to suggest he looks a dud after one league game is ridiculous. And there is no suggestion he was poor at Valencia, more that he never really was given a...

Absolutely. Have no doubt about Propper, I was more commenting on the hypocrisy of criticising some people for doubting one new signing after one game and then saying another new signing looks like a 'dud' after one league game.

Completely agree re Propper and giving him a chance but didn't I see you post somewhere that Ryan looks like a dud (on the give Maenpaa a chance thread)? You can't complain about some people doubting Propper when you are saying one of our other new signings looks like a dud after one league game...