[Politics] Are Labour going to turn this country around?

Chicken Run · Sunday at 1:23 PM

TomandJerry said:
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news...below-graduate-level-under-new-migration-plan

Is it any wonder working class people are angry!!!

The use of hotels isn't just costly – projected recently to be £15bn, triple the amount the Conservatives reckoned when they signed the contracts back in 2019 – they can also create unease and resentment in communities.

A Labour MP with an asylum hotel in their constituency tells me a big part of the problem is that constituents link spending on hotels with the government squeezing cash elsewhere.

"It is impossible to make the case we need to do some form of austerity while we are spending so much money on putting people up here – whether it's winter fuel and PIP (welfare payments) – you haven't got money for this, but you have money for that."
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/articles/cdxkl01qjzwo

Edit

I should go on record to say i’m pleased the Government seems to be listening to the folk and taking steps to deal with this situation!!

rogersix · Sunday at 1:30 PM

Bodian said:
I asked the same question - and got this response.

Not entirely coherent!

Is it PotG? · Sunday at 1:34 PM

rogersix said:
Not entirely coherent!

Not ENTIRELY, no.

rogersix · Sunday at 1:35 PM

Is it PotG? said:
Not ENTIRELY, no.

Wot?

Berty23 · Sunday at 2:22 PM

pocketseagull said:
I see that Labour are continuing their approach of being the caretaker government for Reform.

It is an interesting approach so when we don’t have enough carers who will be filling the gap? My guess is people on benefits (including older people) will be strongly encouraged to take these jobs and I would love to see a Venn diagram with voting intention. I would suggest those strongest against migrants doing jobs others don’t want will be those encouraged to do them.

Bodian · Sunday at 4:27 PM

rogersix said:
Not entirely coherent!

You can't say something like that - other posters will be on to tell you to get over yourself....

Bodian said:
That's not really a sound answer. Surely if you are going to comment on this thread and mention tangible measurements of success, you must have, in your own mind, what you would see as success?

Just those two alone can't really constitute 'success' I wouldn't have thought. Or do they for you?

n1 gull said:
Totally sound answer get over yourself

rogersix · Sunday at 4:52 PM

Bodian said:
You can't say something like that - other posters will be on to tell you to get over yourself....

not the full shilling!

dsr-burnley · Sunday at 6:10 PM

Machiavelli said:
While I have some sympathy for your previous accountant-relayed post as it demonstrates the difficulty of the 'tax the rich' position, this is just wrong. And it's the kind of propaganda (I'm using that word advisedly) that the IEA and all the others at Tufton St want you to pump out. The richest 1% pay 29% of income tax. Income tax amounted to c26% of tax revenue, which would indicate that the richest 1% pay about 7% of total taxation. I'm quite confident in this because they pay very little of the other taxes -- all of which have increased substantially over the past five decades, which means that the rich are paying a lower proportion of tax in 2025 than they were in, for instance, 1975 ...
... and this, despite the fact, that their earnings have increased substantially, and the price of their assets have gone through the roof.

According to this lot, the top 1% of rich people zre paying 12.8% of the tax.

UK Tax: A Brief Overview Of Taxation In The United Kingdom

What are the different kinds of taxes that are applicable on earnings through jobs, self-employment and businesses? Let us have a look.

chacc.co.uk

It makes more sense than your 7%, because to get that you must be assuming that the rich don't pay VAT - in which, why would they pay income tax? If they were spending nothing in the UK, they would arrange that their earnings were taxed abroad as well.

The Clamp · Sunday at 6:54 PM

Resident doctors, nurses, teachers, more bin men, and even rumblings of rail staff, all gearing up for ballots over strike action.

Could we be heading towards a winter of discontent?

How much more of a kicking can the British public take?

Give nurses and doctors the pay rise they deserve. The only possible reason this never happens is lobbyists trying to break the NHS so they can buy it in a fire sale.

Tell rail workers and bin men to get back to work or lose their jobs. They provide an invaluable service but anyone can do their job after an induction and 30 mins on a HASAW e-learning lesson.

The Clamp: I’ve Got Answers.

Harry Wilson's tackle · Sunday at 7:01 PM

The Clamp said:
Resident doctors, nurses, teachers, more bin men, and even rumblings of rail staff, all gearing up for ballots over strike action.

Could we be heading towards a winter of discontent?

How much more of a kicking can the British public take?

Give nurses and doctors the pay rise they deserve. The only possible reason this never happens is lobbyists trying to break the NHS so they can buy it in a fire sale.

Tell rail workers and bin men to get back to work or lose their jobs. They provide an invaluable service but anyone can do their job after an induction and 30 mins on a HASAW e-learning lesson.

The Clamp: I’ve Got Answers.

I was interviewed for a job as a bus conductor 45 years ago (between degree and what the f*** next).

I did some multiplication and was told to start tomorrow and be a 'good laddie'.

I decided against. Couple of days later got a job at the Pav Tav.

Incidentally, Badenough and Farridge would love a winter of discontent.
So I'm not in favour.

jcdenton08 · 2025-05-12T06:38:35+0100

PM promises tougher visa rules to fix 'broken' migration system

Sir Keir Starmer promises new migration rules will "create a system that is controlled, selective and fair".

www.bbc.co.uk

Right, this isn’t party political, so let’s nip that in the bud right now. This is an ongoing issue under successive political parties, but it’s coming to a head. UKIP was the warning, Reform are the real deal.

Blair had a policy of actively encouraging broader immigration for study and work, and lauded multiculturalism as the future of Britain.

(https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/immigration-legacy-tony-blair)

Since the door was opened under New Labour, immigration both controlled and uncontrolled has spiralled under successive governments. Brexit, supported by the Tories and the collective right, has caused immigration to reach a nadir whereby the government is largely toothless to act in the interests of Britain, without being labelled with the “far right” brush. The ECHR regulates our actions.

Starmer’s new proposals are just performative pandering, reacting off the back of a very poor election performance. This is the stock “we’re listening” response we’ve seen from successive governments on this issue. Tories had the mental Rwanda plan, Labour are going after care-workers (rather than, say, the criminal operations which use care-work as a front to attract vulnerable people to Britain for a life of modern slavery).

Blustering and paying little attention to what some people are (rightly or wrongly, depending on your viewpoint) actually upset about, is playing into Reform’s hands.

Just by listening to what people are actually saying, I’ve learned what people in affected communities are angry about.

They’re not angry about care-workers being essentially trafficked here from poor countries with a promise of a better life (but they should be).

They’re angry because

Having the net equivalent of the entire population of Northumberland or Dorset immigrate to the UK year on year is unsustainable.

Natives don’t understand why they can’t get appointments with their overburdened NHS services, why crime rates and poverty rates are rising in their towns, and yes, in some towns and cities why communities are so racially segregated. Ask the people of Blackburn what it’s like being an Asian person entering certain areas, or a white person entering others.

Add the ever-present threat of Islamist terror as we’ve seen in Europe, particularly Germany, people are bubbling.

If Starmer thinks this will win votes from Reform voters, he is sorely mistaken.

(I shouldn’t need to say this, but it’s NSC so I’m obliged, f*** the Tories, f*** Reform, f*** Farage, f*** Tommy Robinson, f*** racists - this isn’t a race issue, it’s an immigration thing - and if you can’t tell the difference or lump them all in together, then I won’t be wasting my time on you).

TomandJerry · 2025-05-12T07:08:12+0100

"Judges’ powers to block deportations are to be curbed as part of Sir Keir Starmer’s bid to bring immigration under control.

On Monday, the Prime Minister will unveil plans to tighten legislation that allows courts to grant asylum to foreign criminals and illegal migrants under the European Convention on Human Rights (ECHR) in “exceptional circumstances"

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/politics/2025/05/11/starmer-to-close-echr-migrant-loophole/

DJ NOBO · 2025-05-12T07:53:10+0100

jcdenton08 said:
PM promises tougher visa rules to fix 'broken' migration system

Sir Keir Starmer promises new migration rules will "create a system that is controlled, selective and fair".

www.bbc.co.uk

Right, this isn’t party political, so let’s nip that in the bud right now. This is an ongoing issue under successive political parties, but it’s coming to a head. UKIP was the warning, Reform are the real deal.

Blair had a policy of actively encouraging broader immigration for study and work, and lauded multiculturalism as the future of Britain.

(https://www.migrationpolicy.org/article/immigration-legacy-tony-blair)

View attachment 201658

Since the door was opened under New Labour, immigration both controlled and uncontrolled has spiralled under successive governments. Brexit, supported by the Tories and the collective right, has caused immigration to reach a nadir whereby the government is largely toothless to act in the interests of Britain, without being labelled with the “far right” brush. The ECHR regulates our actions.

Starmer’s new proposals are just performative pandering, reacting off the back of a very poor election performance. This is the stock “we’re listening” response we’ve seen from successive governments on this issue. Tories had the mental Rwanda plan, Labour are going after care-workers (rather than, say, the criminal operations which use care-work as a front to attract vulnerable people to Britain for a life of modern slavery).

Blustering and paying little attention to what some people are (rightly or wrongly, depending on your viewpoint) actually upset about, is playing into Reform’s hands.

Just by listening to what people are actually saying, I’ve learned what people in affected communities are angry about.

They’re not angry about care-workers being essentially trafficked here from poor countries with a promise of a better life (but they should be).

They’re angry because

View attachment 201659

Having the net equivalent of the entire population of Northumberland or Dorset immigrate to the UK year on year is unsustainable.

Natives don’t understand why they can’t get appointments with their overburdened NHS services, why crime rates and poverty rates are rising in their towns, and yes, in some towns and cities why communities are so racially segregated. Ask the people of Blackburn what it’s like being an Asian person entering certain areas, or a white person entering others.

Add the ever-present threat of Islamist terror as we’ve seen in Europe, particularly Germany, people are bubbling.

If Starmer thinks this will win votes from Reform voters, he is sorely mistaken.

(I shouldn’t need to say this, but it’s NSC so I’m obliged, f*** the Tories, f*** Reform, f*** Farage, f*** Tommy Robinson, f*** racists - this isn’t a race issue, it’s an immigration thing - and if you can’t tell the difference or lump them all in together, then I won’t be wasting my time on you).

It is understandable you distance yourself from Reform, on this board. But you come across as a classic new reform voter. Politically, where else would you go?

Which is not good news for those that more or less still view reform voters as the cartoon character in that magazine cover thing that is doing the rounds and is posted above.

More and more Reform voters are middle class, working, intelligent people. “Normal people”. Not “far right” thugs.

Not saying this is a good or bad thing, it is merely an observation.

Is it PotG? · 2025-05-12T09:00:23+0100

So will you put a figure on migration?

No.

Why not?

Because previous Prime Ministers have, and you can see they've failed.

Can't fault his logic though!

Perfidious Albion · 2025-05-12T09:09:51+0100

I thankfully have not lived in a care home but my spell in hospital showed me that , from a patient’s view, the HCAs. (nursing assistants who do most of the hard work) from the Philippines and India were by far the best .
These women had a way about them that made you feel important, they showed empathy and always smiled. Far from being “ trafficked “ they wanted to be here .

The care system and NHS would be the poorer without them.

BadFish · 2025-05-12T09:34:09+0100

The Clamp said:
I heard in the radio someone claiming that if they taxes everyone who has £20m or more (assets, cash? Dunno) an extra 2% on their wealth, this would raise £21bn.

Is this feasible? Accurate? Possible?

I read recently that if people paid the taxes they are supposed pay then the UK would be up £40bn a year.

abc · 2025-05-12T10:01:32+0100

BadFish said:
I read recently that if people paid the taxes they are supposed pay then the UK would be up £40bn a year.

I suspect that’s true and that applies to us all. However, like the mantra the wealthy should pay more provided that doesn’t include ‘me’, it’s ok for ‘me’ to take a bit of cash in hand but everyone earning more than ‘me’ should pay the tax they are supposed to

BadFish · 2025-05-12T10:06:48+0100

abc said:
I suspect that’s true and that applies to us all. However, like the mantra the wealthy should pay more provided that doesn’t include ‘me’, it’s ok for ‘me’ to take a bit of cash in hand but everyone earning more than ‘me’ should pay the tax they are supposed to

Ideally I would like everyone to pay the tax they should (as I do). But yes, I absolutely would, given the choice prefer a billionaire to pay the tax they are supposed to over an electrician doing cash in hand work.

Surely you would too?

abc · 2025-05-12T10:14:31+0100

BadFish said:
Ideally I would like everyone to pay the tax they should (as I do). But yes, I absolutely would, given the choice prefer a billionaire to pay the tax they are supposed to over an electrician doing cash in hand work.

Surely you would too?

Oh absolutely but that make me a hypocrite in the sense that the rules should apply equally to everyone but also highlights the problems that all gov’s have in raising tax - everyone is in favour provided it doesn’t apply to them.

BadFish · 2025-05-12T10:20:00+0100

abc said:
Oh absolutely but that make me a hypocrite in the sense that the rules should apply equally to everyone but also highlights the problems that all gov’s have in raising tax - everyone is in favour provided it doesn’t apply to them.

I don't think you are speaking for 'everyone' you may not pay the tax you are supposed to but lots of people do, including me. I am in favour of taxes, even though I they apply to me.

I am going to go out on a limb here and assume you are not a billionaire to make the point that for me a billionaire not paying the taxes they should is far more consequential that you not paying yours.

To me you and the billionaire are both immoral and selfish and you should both pay up. The only difference is that one has far wider consequences than the other.

I am not sure how this is hypocritical l, although it does explain why you are why you don't feel that people should pay their taxes.

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