[Other Sport] Saxons OUT

[KeegansHairPiece]

I suppose just because the Saxons were quite hard and violent.

I thought recent historical theory was that the anglo-saxon invasion of Briton wasn't actually an invasion, but a slow exchange of trade and culture. There have been finds where pagan and saxon artifacts have been found together indicating that the Saxons landed and perhaps traded rather than fought. Mass graves of supposed Saxon battles have never really been found.

 

[Iggle Piggle]

Amazed this hasn't been discussed on here yet. Surely worth a Crodo thread? (Yeah, Yeah, It's the Current Bun)

https://www.thesun.co.uk/sport/14880379/england-football-badge-changed-three-lions/

 

[blue-shifted]

I thought recent historical theory was that the anglo-saxon invasion of Briton wasn't actually an invasion, but a slow exchange of trade and culture. There have been finds where pagan and saxon artifacts have been found together indicating that the Saxons landed and perhaps traded rather than fought. Mass graves of supposed Saxon battles have never really been found.

So you think the RFU eschewed detailed archaeological evidence and the latest historical understanding when inventing a name, in favour of one which just made the sound scary? Possible I suppose.

 

[strings]

The England women's team are the Red Roses.

For all the joking about this, it's actually a serious issue in rugby. Clubs in England are very concerned that they're seen as a white, middle class sport and are looking to make inroads outside the private schools. This has been a concern for some time, so it beggars belief that the RFU chose the name 'Saxons' in the first place.

Ugo Monye made some very interesting comments about this recently. By not finding talent in state schools, rugby is really missing a trick. Monye himself was considered one of the fastest players in the World Seven series when he was a youngster, yet (by his own admission) he wasn't even the fastest at his school. His point was that there is lots of untapped talent out there.

Rugby is getting better at this, but if you look at recent England squads, there is still a disproportionately high number of former private school pupils.

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

So you think the RFU eschewed detailed archaeological evidence and the latest historical understanding when inventing a name, in favour of one which just made the sound scary? Possible I suppose.

Quite the reverse, they all went to private school these rugger types, likely they knew full well the Saxons were effectively the instigators of the EU, back in 500 AD. Given we're now out of the EU, the term Saxon is out of date for them and not in keeping with the present landscape.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Oh Dear, I guess we should think about changing the countys name then, Northumberland and the others with connections to their past will soon follow suit.

I am sorry, I think of myself as progressive, but I really do not get why we cannot reach back in history and be proud of our roots, christ sake Saxons were immigrants.

Couldn’t agree more from every point of view.

If I were living in France and supporting French Rugby and they called their team “Les Normands” (the Normans), would I be offended? Absolutely not.

 

[Gwylan]

Ugo Monye made some very interesting comments about this recently. By not finding talent in state schools, rugby is really missing a trick. Monye himself was considered one of the fastest players in the World Seven series when he was a youngster, yet (by his own admission) he wasn't even the fastest at his school. His point was that there is lots of untapped talent out there.

Rugby is getting better at this, but if you look at recent England squads, there is still a disproportionately high number of former private school pupils.

TBF, the RFU is fully aware of this issue and is doing its best to improve the situation. There's an issue with state schools themselves. They're very reluctant to let strangers in to run coaching courses - although our club is happy to send in volunteers to do it.

 

[Tyrone Biggums]

If someone of non-Saxon heritage won't play a sport because of a team name i'd think they are the problem, not the name.

 

[dsr-burnley]

The Angles and Saxons invaded at about the same time. The name England Saxons was derived from both - England (Angles) and Saxons (Saxons). If the name Saxons is so outrageous that it can't be used, then surely the name England is equally wrong? Perhaps the name "Southern Britain" might be better?

 

[KeegansHairPiece]

The Angles and Saxons invaded at about the same time. The name England Saxons was derived from both - England (Angles) and Saxons (Saxons). If the name Saxons is so outrageous that it can't be used, then surely the name England is equally wrong? Perhaps the name "Southern Britain" might be better?

I’d hazard a guess they’re thinking Saxon or Anglo-Saxon suggests a race. England does not suggest a race as it’s a place.

 

[Psychobilly freakout]

The Angles and Saxons invaded at about the same time. The name England Saxons was derived from both - England (Angles) and Saxons (Saxons). If the name Saxons is so outrageous that it can't be used, then surely the name England is equally wrong? Perhaps the name "Southern Britain" might be better?

or Albion

 

[faoileán]

These days if you say you're a Saxon, you get arrested and thrown in jail.

I doubt you would be thrown in jail but you would certainly be told you were inaccurate.

On average, people in southern England are only likely to be somewhere between 10 - 40% genetically Saxon. The rest of your genes coming from the Celtic Britons, Norse/Normans, maybe some French and certainly a good dash of Irish/Welsh/Scots.

 

[Eeyore]

It used to be called England 'B', Emerging England, England XV. It took the RFU 6 years from 2000 in deciding the reserve side needed a separate, distinct identity before overwhelmingly going for Saxons over England Aces and England Bloods in 2006.

It begs the question if they needed an identity then why do they not need one now? I reckon they didn't have the imagination to try and come up with anything better.

If you are looking for an indigenous creature that bridges the white and black colour divide then maybe the England Grey Squirrels is a goer?

Yeah, but they're AMERICAN

 

[Eeyore]

The Angles and Saxons invaded at about the same time. The name England Saxons was derived from both - England (Angles) and Saxons (Saxons). If the name Saxons is so outrageous that it can't be used, then surely the name England is equally wrong? Perhaps the name "Southern Britain" might be better?

Nobody is outraged. But the design of the reporting is to cause outrage against those who were not outraged by those who didn't give a shit but now are.

You're an intelligent chap, you know how the media works. NSC's gang of five have already began turning up on this thread. PPF will pop in if he can get time off from the bear pit. Larry Boyd needs to get his VPN set up to arrive back undetected.

 

[faoileán]

Couldn’t agree more from every point of view.

If I were living in France and supporting French Rugby and they called their team “Les Normands” (the Normans), would I be offended? Absolutely not.

Surely that would be just as inaccurate as calling an England team "Saxons"?

 

[TugWilson]

It was a terrible name: it was a terrible name in 2016 and I'm still shocked it was chosen in the first place. I suspect it was chosen to wind up the Welsh but (to use the current jargon) the optics were awful.

Typical thug response

 

[TugWilson]

I wonder if the name 'Roses' was available whether the RFU would have had the balls to go for it.

South Africa are The Proteas and Japan are The Cherry Blossoms - both named after flowers.

Maybe the Hyacinths ( Bucket ) as there seems to be a lot of pc and self aggrandizing behind this change .

 

[Comrade Sam]

Always thought if English nationalists harped on about being Jutie-Fresians instead of Anglo-Saxons I'd find them less annoying.

 

[Comrade Sam]

Also in the time since the last Saxon kings of England you have approximately 40 generations of ancestors. That's 2 to the power of 40 mums and dads. Roughly 12,000,000,000,000. That's more people than have existed. And if you go back another generation you double it again. So basically if you think you're Anglo-Saxon, everyone is and Arab, African, Berber, Gaul etc, etc.

 

[Questions]

I have to be honest, I am enraged by this. It isn't the first team is it, so why call it "England A"? Should be "England B". There, I feel better for getting that off my chest.

So now we have alphabetism creeping in.