EU and AstraZeneca

[RossyG]

What do people expect our government to do, though? Hand out vaccines for free to other countries before everyone here has had their jabs?

 

[Blue Valkyrie]

What do people expect our government to do, though? Hand out vaccines for free to other countries before everyone here has had their jabs?

I think once Novavax vaccination is started there is a strong case for giving excess AZ surplus to poor countries for free.

 

[RossyG]

I think once Novavax vaccination is started there is a strong case for giving excess AZ surplus to poor countries for free.

That’s fine when we’ve all been vaccinated, but some people seem to be feeling guilty that our government is prioritising it’s own citizens.

 

[DavidinSouthampton]

Thanks for your input David.


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You’re welcome

 

[WATFORD zero]

That’s fine when we’ve all been vaccinated, but some people seem to be feeling guilty that our government is prioritising it’s own citizens.

Not at all. It's our Government's job to prioritise our citizens. It's the EU's job to prioritise it's citizens.

It'll be the Lawyers job to go through the various contracts signed by each supplier and see who has what rights by law to the various vaccines that haven't been produced yet. I don't think it's right, but it's what will happen

 

[Chicken Run]

That’s fine when we’ve all been vaccinated, but some people seem to be feeling guilty that our government is prioritising it’s own citizens.

There’s a few on here that might feel guilty, out there in the real world I’ve yet to meet any [emoji23]


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[DavidinSouthampton]

View attachment 133153

Not particularly, no. I’m quite content. I just don’t much like the world we’re living in at the moment.

But I’ve got a lot to be thankful for. Retired and so cushioned from some of the worst realities of all the economic sh1t that’s going on at the moment, two daughters and their partners all in good and “essential” jobs, and three wonderful grandchildren. I realise millions of others are not so fortunate in this country alone, let alone further afield.

 

[Chicken Run]

Not particularly, no. I’m quite content. I just don’t much like the world we’re living in at the moment.

But I’ve got a lot to be thankful for. Retired and so cushioned from some of the worst realities of all the economic sh1t that’s going on at the moment, two daughters and their partners all in good and “essential” jobs, and three wonderful grandchildren. I realise millions of others are not so fortunate in this country alone, let alone further afield.

Always easier to be critical of others behaviour when one leads a comfortable experience, I’m pleased that all is good in your world [emoji106]


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[WATFORD zero]

Not particularly, no. I’m quite content. I just don’t much like the world we’re living in at the moment.

But I’ve got a lot to be thankful for. Retired and so cushioned from some of the worst realities of all the economic sh1t that’s going on at the moment, two daughters and their partners all in good and “essential” jobs, and three wonderful grandchildren. I realise millions of others are not so fortunate in this country alone, let alone further afield.

Once heard it said that if everyone in the world threw all their troubles in the air, you would be extremely grateful is you only caught your own

 

[swindonseagull]

I bet you’re a good laugh out on the razzle.



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I think you are correct
He just likes the sound of his own voice!! / post.

 

[Chicken Run]

Once heard it said that if everyone in the world threw all their troubles in the air, you would be extremely grateful is you only caught your own

The way my luck is i’d catch yours[emoji6]


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[Is it PotG?]

Once heard it said that if everyone in the world threw all their troubles in the air, you would be extremely grateful is you only caught your own

Things are never so bad that they couldn't get worse.

 

[Neville's Breakfast]

Your own entry puts itself on trial. It laments human society's standards but upholds them.

The vaccine is not a ticket to an away match with limited capacity in which a queue is to be formed and anyone who fails can listen on the radio. It is life and death for some. The poorer countries lose out the most- we get furloughed or claim benefits as well as accessible health care.

Sadly this thread has become all to predictable.

The [MENTION=11191]Pretty pink fairy[/MENTION] and [MENTION=35289]Baker lite[/MENTION] type members have inevitably resorted to Airfix patriotism. This, of course, is one situation where that could be set aside in reflection of a common good. But the vaccine is a useful addition to the two world wars and one World Cup. It's been a while.

[MENTION=22975]DavidinSouthampton[/MENTION] places the post worth most reflection. The one that anyone with reason or compassion would take most note of.

What we see in the AZ crisis is indeed a snapshot of vaccine nationalism. Like two aristocrats fighting over the last caviar portion in an upmarket shop whilst naked beggars, stripped of everything they have, huddle outside and peak in wishing.

The UK will probably be the first nation to complete the programme. An achievement in many different quarters of ingenuity. Proud science. But once we have our vaccines perhaps we should reflect on how fortunate we are. This pandemic has only served to highlight how the world does indeed work.

And many of us don't get brownie points for having seen it coming.

I agree with most of that but not your metaphor about two aristocrats fighting over caviar. The UK is not involved. Whilst a couple of posters on NSC may be indulging in vaccine nationalism our Government has simply placed orders and is now rolling out the programme. Journalists have tried to stir the pot at the daily press conference but the reality is this is an EU decision making issue, further complicated by their unseemly spat with a pharmaceutical company. Nothing more.

 

[blockhseagull]

I agree with most of that but not your metaphor about two aristocrats fighting over caviar. The UK is not involved. Whilst a couple of posters on NSC may be indulging in vaccine nationalism our Government has simply placed orders and is now rolling out the programme. Journalists have tried to stir the pot at the daily press conference but the reality is this is an EU supply chain and decision making issue. Nothing more.

This is how I see it.

The media are trying to play it out far differently than what is actually happening.

We’ve placed our orders and are saying we are carrying on the programme on that basis. Any other comment from Boris or Gove would mean involving themselves in something which is strictly between the EU and AZ.

No need for pitchforks and burning torches to protect ‘our vaccines’ .... just the normal media crap

 

[dsr-burnley]

I think once Novavax vaccination is started there is a strong case for giving excess AZ surplus to poor countries for free.

I agree. Considering all the billions that we have spent on ourselves, another billion or two vaccinating those who can't afford it would be relative peanuts.

Firstly, morally, if we're rich and they are poor then it would simply the right thing to do.

But also we can look at self interest.
Secondly, it will make us friends or better friends of the countries we help.
Thirdly we want the whole world to be vaccinated for our own safety.

Tell AstraZeneca that we will take their first billion, and then ask for more. We can do our own people first, then the poorer parts of the Commonwealth, and then anywhere else than can manage the infrastructure to use it. (Richer countries need not apply.)

 

[WATFORD zero]

I agree with most of that but not your metaphor about two aristocrats fighting over caviar. The UK is not involved. Whilst a couple of posters on NSC may be indulging in vaccine nationalism our Government has simply placed orders and is now rolling out the programme. Journalists have tried to stir the pot at the daily press conference but the reality is this is an EU supply chain and decision making issue. Nothing more.

But this is all based on one simple assumption.

Our government has guaranteed volumes in our contracts with the various suppliers for ongoing supplies and the EU does not. I'd like that to be true, but the simple fact is nobody knows

And that will be the crux of all the posturing from all sides over the next few weeks. I guess we will find out more in the weeks ahead.

 

[beorhthelm]

see the EU are not letting up on this, EU President says its crystal clear there are binding orders but also accepting these are conditional... hmmm.

meanwhile Pfizer delivery shortfall continues to go under the radar.

 

[Pretty pink fairy]

You see, this is your blind spot. The inability to put down your Lee Enfield. As if the thought of the war being over is more painful than the experience itself. There is nothing for you to go back to.

I'm not really a fan of the EU. I like the concept but not the practice. That may cause a bit of reflection for you but you need to pick that gun up again.

When a thread like this comes up for you its like a call to arms. The sergeant's whistle blows and over the top you go. Which means that rather than engaging in rational discourse you take a smelly dump on all prospects of that. And a couple of your buddys join in.

You've spent years doing it. Offered nothing constructive to anything. 99% would concur.

Anyway, your original statement is incorrect. I think the EU is a bloated institution that can cause division as well as good. I could spend an hour giving my reasoning for this, rather than an inflamed two lines with an odd message of plastic regard. But I fear it would change nothing, nor warrant consideration without the Pelabon shells being fired.

I don't need a lecture off you thank you , you have a proven track record of support for the EU a bit pot calling the kettle black I think and yeah I'll be backing the UK before the EU all day long , they're but a bunch of bully boys and this issue proves that in bucket loads
Regards
DF

 

[WATFORD zero]

see the EU are not letting up on this, EU President says its crystal clear there are binding orders but also accepting these are conditional... hmmm.

meanwhile Pfizer delivery shortfall continues to go under the radar.

I saw a report this morning that AstraZeneca have reduced the volumes to the EU further, down to 25%. This isn't going to go away.

Do you have a link to the Pfizer shortfalls ? Thanks

 

[PILTDOWN MAN]

That’s fine when we’ve all been vaccinated, but some people seem to be feeling guilty that our government is prioritising it’s own citizens.

Due to circumstances, some definitely the governments handling of the crisis, some joe public's fault for not adhering to the rules and finally some because we are some of the most unhealthy people in the Weston World. These combined has caused us to be at the top of the league for covid deaths.

Moving forwards I believe there are three issues around the vaccines.

Firstly the government actually got it's act together concerning the vaccine. Not only placing orders but also targeting money into the development. We are now in the best place to vaccinate ourselves first. We need to for the reason above, our death rate.

Secondly our near neighbours have screwed up and as usual for all politicians they want to blame everyone else for their ineptitude. Also as anyone knows who goes to Europe their idea of queueing is to barge to the front. This time they can't and frankly they can wait their turn. They need to sort their own shit out.

Thirdly and far far more important than Europe the fact the AZ vaccine is going to be produced for free to the Third World countries. Once we have fulfilled our need all our resources should go into this. the UK has hedged its bets and ordered loads from all the vaccine producers to spread the chance of getting enough, again the complete failure of Europe to do so isn't our fault. This extra whatever one it is should be sent to Africa etc to ramp up their vaccine programmes.

Though I never wanted to leave the EU unfortunately they have shown the reason so many voted to. If they threaten us as a nation as it appears they want to in a trade war they will again show their true colours. You can be sure there will be huge arguments about who gets it first and most within the EU. If France and the Germans get more per head than the others I can see a stampede to leave.

This could escalate and end the EU in its current form.