[News] Say your goodbyes to free health care...

[Is it PotG?]

the two are directly linked , the NHS is getting another £350m a week once we leave.

If you say so.

I thought they said it would free up cash that could possibly used that way, amongst other things.

Ah well.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

If you say so.

I thought they said it would free up cash that could possibly used that way, amongst other things.

Ah well.

It's strange how many people don't understand the word 'could' isn't the same as 'will'. I blame our poor education system ( [MENTION=15363]Plooks[/MENTION] will be proud of me ).

 

[Randy McNob]

Take back control = put the country up for sale to foreign ownership

 

[Simster]

It's strange how many people don't understand the word 'could' isn't the same as 'will'. I blame our poor education system ( [MENTION=15363]Plooks[/MENTION] will be proud of me ).

OK, that's fine - we shouldn't be too literal with where this £350m is going to be spent.

But that works both ways. If our economy hits the skids to a far worse extent than Germany, France or any other comparable EU economy, will you be dismissing it purely as a problem caused by covid, or will we be allowed to point out that previously similarly performing economies in the EU have coped better?

Because if that happens (as I believe it will) and pro-Brexit refuse to accept it, I won't be blaming "our poor education system" for their ignorance.

 

[Westdene Seagull]

OK, that's fine - we shouldn't be too literal with where this £350m is going to be spent.

But that works both ways. If our economy hits the skids to a far worse extent than Germany, France or any other comparable EU economy, will you be dismissing it purely as a problem caused by covid, or will we be allowed to point out that previously similarly performing economies in the EU have coped better?

Because if that happens (as I believe it will) and pro-Brexit refuse to accept it, I won't be blaming "our poor education system" for their ignorance.

I've never once denied that the decision to leave the EU will have a negative impact on our economy - of course it will. I just believe it a price worth paying. Awaits the ridiculous questions of how much ? etc etc etc ( not from you ! ).

 

[Simster]

I've never once denied that the decision to leave the EU will have a negative impact on our economy - of course it will. I just believe it a price worth paying. Awaits the ridiculous questions of how much ? etc etc etc ( not from you ! ).

It isn't a ridiculous question at all. What is more ridiculous is to state that a negative impact on our economy is worth paying without quantifying the sacrifice we're supposed to accept.

Your position is like walking into a shop and saying you'll buy something without knowing its price. Ridiculous.

 

[Hampster Gull]

Perhaps there should be a solo thread pertaining to 'Football'.

Person A Thought Lamptey played poorly, subbed at half time. Rubbish, get rid

Person B But he was played out of position, he’s a right back. It was Potters decision, not really Lampteys fault

Person A This is a Lamptey thread not a Potter thread, don’t post

Anyway, whatever, will leave you to it,

 

[NooBHA]

Vallance and others on SAGE advocated that position. i dont care for Johnson, lets at least be accurate in our criticism.

OK so they loaded the bullets

Johnson just pulled the trigger

 

[WATFORD zero]

I've never once denied that the decision to leave the EU will have a negative impact on our economy - of course it will. I just believe it a price worth paying. Awaits the ridiculous questions of how much ? etc etc etc ( not from you ! ).

I'm struggling to see what would be called ridiculous about quantifying the effect of various outcomes before making decisions ? Surely it would be utterly ridiculous to make a decision without any idea of the scale of the various outcomes ?

Although the fact that 4 years on, we still have no detail whatsoever as to what the outcome looks like, I can see does make it more difficult. But then who would make a decision without actually having a defined outcome, let alone the size and implications of any outcome ? Now that would be ridiculous

 

[dingodan]

I'm struggling to see what would be called ridiculous about quantifying the effect of various outcomes before making decisions ? Surely it would be utterly ridiculous to make a decision without any idea of the scale of the various outcomes ?

Cost of leaving the EU = Possibly high.

Value of being self governing and independant = Priceless.

 

[Simster]

Cost of leaving the EU = Possibly high.

Value of being self governing and independant = Priceless.

When you say priceless, you mean of course that it isn't of any value at all. We're already seeing the "benefits" of being self-governing - an antequated first past the post electoral system allows an incompetent, populist government overwhelming power and they then ride roughshod over procedure and are barely held to account for all manner of dodgy dealings. And of course in practice, we're not independent. We are instead at the behest of foreign powers, we are about to be royally screwed on a trade deal with the US, and do we really want closer ties with Russia and China? And all this ignores the reality that we used to elect MEPs and thus helped steer EU policy, something we can't do anymore. I reckon we'll have another referendum within a decade. I just hope the EU aren't fed up with us by then and let us back in.

 

[sydney]

Bear Pit here we come....

From those who have already posted here, this thread is obviously in the wrong place.

 

[dingodan]

When you say priceless, you mean of course that it isn't of any value at all. We're already seeing the "benefits" of being self-governing - an antequated first past the post electoral system allows an incompetent, populist government overwhelming power and they then ride roughshod over procedure and are barely held to account for all manner of dodgy dealings. And of course in practice, we're not independent. We are instead at the behest of foreign powers, we are about to be royally screwed on a trade deal with the US, and do we really want closer ties with Russia and China? And all this ignores the reality that we used to elect MEPs and thus helped steer EU policy, something we can't do anymore. I reckon we'll have another referendum within a decade. I just hope the EU aren't fed up with us by then and let us back in.

You are confusing not having the ability to make decisions for ourselves with us making decisions you don't like. We are free to deal with the U.S, China and Russia however we (the government we elected) decide. If the EU have a block policy and we were a memeber, we would have no choice but to go along with it.

How you can say that being a self governing and independant nation has no value is beyond me. independance and autonomy/self government is the oldest and most precious aspiriation of mankind.

Another refurendum within a decade? Dream on. There is zero chance of us ever being in the EU again, and by the time you could reasonably ask for another vote (30-40 years) there won't be an EU to join anymore anyway.

 

[Baker lite]

You are confusing not having the ability to make decisions for ourselves with us making decisions you don't like. We are free to deal with the U.S, China and Russia however we (the government we elected) decide. If the EU have a block policy and we were a memeber, we would have no choice but to go along with it.

How you can say that being a self governing and independant nation has no value is beyond me. independance and autonomy/self government is the oldest and most precious aspiriation of mankind.

Another refurendum within a decade? Dream on. There is zero chance of us ever being in the EU again, and by the time you could reasonably ask for another vote (30-40 years) there won't be an EU to join anymore anyway.

You’re being generous there, the EU will implode within 10 years.



Let’s get going.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

You’re being generous there, the EU will implode within 10 years.



Let’s get going.

You started on those books yet?

 

[Bakero]

If you say so.

I thought they said it would free up cash that could possibly used that way, amongst other things.

Ah well.

The bus didn't mention "could".

 

[nicko31]

You are confusing not having the ability to make decisions for ourselves with us making decisions you don't like. We are free to deal with the U.S, China and Russia however we (the government we elected) decide. If the EU have a block policy and we were a memeber, we would have no choice but to go along with it.

How you can say that being a self governing and independant nation has no value is beyond me. independance and autonomy/self government is the oldest and most precious aspiriation of mankind.

Another refurendum within a decade? Dream on. There is zero chance of us ever being in the EU again, and by the time you could reasonably ask for another vote (30-40 years) there won't be an EU to join anymore anyway.

Anything we will be able to sell to non-EU on 1st Jan to we couldn't sell on 31st Dec?

What is the single biggest new trade opportunity?

I guess after "Vote Leave" point 1 of the Brexit contract with the British people is honoured we will all be quids in, right...

 

[Simster]

You are confusing not having the ability to make decisions for ourselves with us making decisions you don't like. We are free to deal with the U.S, China and Russia however we (the government we elected) decide. If the EU have a block policy and we were a memeber, we would have no choice but to go along with it.

How you can say that being a self governing and independant nation has no value is beyond me. independance and autonomy/self government is the oldest and most precious aspiriation of mankind.

No, if anyone is confused it's you if you think leaving the EU has genuinely given us "independence". Of course it hasn't.

Another refurendum within a decade? Dream on. There is zero chance of us ever being in the EU again, and by the time you could reasonably ask for another vote (30-40 years) there won't be an EU to join anymore anyway.

No need to dream - the numbers are against you. If a referendum isn't on the agenda within a decade and actually called within 5 years of that, I will be staggered. This government will make such of mess of Brexit that people will soon question what on earth we were thinking of. As I say, give it 10 years (it won't be 30, that's for sure).

This drivel that the EU is imploding always make me chuckle though. It's literally based on zero evidence and nothing but wishful thinking from deluded xenophobes who really really want to believe they're not in massive minority being small-minded enough to insist on leaving.

 

[Is it PotG?]

The bus didn't mention "could".

Well if we're playing silly beggars, where does it say that the NHS would be funded to the tune of £350m?

 

[Simster]

Well if we're playing silly beggars, where does it say that the NHS would be funded to the tune of £350m?

The bus slogan was "We send £350m to the EU every week, let's fund our NHS instead"


Are you seriously suggesting that doesn't broadly imply we would redirect most of that £350m to the NHS?

I guess it sounds more catchy to the gammon than "We send £350m to the EU every week, but that unlocks billions of pounds in tariff-free trade. We could spend it on the NHS instead if you want, we'll need it to treat increased food-poisoning from all that shit American chlorinated chicken we'll be forced to allow in when we're 'independent'"