[Football] Disparity in earnings

[beorhthelm]

i think now might be a good time to point out 40% of footballer's earnings goes to the government coffers to pay for services provided.

 

[Herr Tubthumper]

i think now might be a good time to point out 40% of footballer's earnings goes to the government coffers to pay for services provided.

Two things.

1). Has that image rights thing been shut down?
2) 40% - ish goes to the taxman as PAYE on the wages from their playing contract. This probably isn’t the case on any endorsements they have.

 

[drew]

I am not. I am genuinely amazed at the amount of people on here who defend the under-funding and woeful pay of the NHS and workers. To suggest footballers are more important, add more value money wise, and are more highly skilled is utter nonsense and just not backed up by fact!
I am sickened by the tory sycophants who refuse to lay any blame on the deaths and woeful health conditions on their beloved paty.

Nobody is defending the underfunding of NHS and it's workers. We're just explaining to you why it is the way it currently is. Nobody has said footballers are more important, you're just misreading comments because it suits your agenda.

 

[beorhthelm]

I am not. I am genuinely amazed at the amount of people on here who defend the under-funding and woeful pay of the NHS and workers. To suggest footballers are more important, add more value money wise, and are more highly skilled is utter nonsense and just not backed up by fact!

no one has said any of this. its just been accepted markets drive footballers and nursing differently.

 

[drew]

Two things.

1). Has that image rights thing been shut down?
2) 40% - ish goes to the taxman as PAYE on the wages from their playing contract. This probably isn’t the case on any endorsements they have.

They would still pay tax on any other earnings, but agree, due to creativity of their accountants, probably less than 40%!!!

 

[Baldseagull]

Exactly. So to get 287k nurses is bloody hard work as we don't let any old person in to do the job. If we did, unlike simply crap football, we would all die.

Plooks, I love ya, but you have to see, nursing, even though it requires a lot of study, is open to a large proportion of the population, so long as they are willing to put the effort in and study. With top level footballers, despite lads being signed to clubs before they have hair on their balls, and receiving good professional coaching for years, the academies are not a production line for the premier league, and this is despite clubs only working with kids that they feel do have that potential.

We all want nurses to be well rewarded for their work, but you can't compare the wages of elite sportsmen with them. No one deserves those sorts of wages.

 

[beorhthelm]

Two things.

1). Has that image rights thing been shut down?
2) 40% - ish goes to the taxman as PAYE on the wages from their playing contract. This probably isn’t the case on any endorsements they have.

i was omiting that for brevity.

 

[beorhthelm]

Yes. We CHOOSE the market value of NHS workers. So lets actually do something and pay them properly. It is within our POWER!

what are you supposing the market rate should be and we can go from there. without a least a notion of that target this is navel gazing.

 

[drew]

Not at all. All I have seen people put is:
"footballers are more skilled" - false
"there are more people wanting to be nurses" - false
"footballers contribute to more profits" - false
"there are more foreigners wanting to be nurses" - false

Just admit it. We underpay them because we have CHOSEN to vote in party that CHOOSES to pay them badly. We CHOSE their low wages and funding. It is not some other thing external to us.

If this is the case then I suggest you start at the beginning and read the whole thread again.

The only thing I will agree on is that they are underpaid but don't accuse me of choosing to pay them badly because I don't vote for the party that follows that path.

 

[Weststander]

The pay issue is about the obscenity linked to private businesses. Those who work for a government organisation have a standardised wage across the board for the level or grade you are at and very few will be outside of that structure.

CEO's and managing directors of private companies often earn bucket loads of cash because someone decided they should. Look at the recent situation with Virgin, Richard Branson earns millions every year and has recently made plenty of people jobless.

Nurses, teachers, police officers should all get a better wage but that doesn't link to business shouldn't pay anyone lots more than nurses so they don't feel bad

Don’t fall into the trap of making it a purely public compared to private sector debate.

There are millions of private sector workers on very modest pay, with no final salary pension scheme, working for bullying bosses, without union cover. No one on NSC is championing their cause.

 

[Weststander]

i think now might be a good time to point out 40% of footballer's earnings goes to the government coffers to pay for services provided.

Not necessarily.

Clubs and players are being investigated for diverting a large proportion of players income to offshore tax shelters (0% tax or a little bit more), as ‘image rights’. A landmark decided last year against Hull City and a former player.

 

[giveusfalmerplease]

nobody can doubt nurses and doctors should be paid more..but seeing that the country would equally grind to a halt if the delivery drivers and shop assistants werent working. In fact there would be street rioting and people forced to strip the countryside bare of fruit to survive. next time you bump into a delivery driver who is refreshing your local corner shop with their fresh bread and milk, remember to thank them...oh and the shop keeper of course.

 

[Weststander]

Two things.

1). Has that image rights thing been shut down?
2) 40% - ish goes to the taxman as PAYE on the wages from their playing contract. This probably isn’t the case on any endorsements they have.

Sorry, just seen your post, after posting mine.

No, the image rights saga carries on.

True about sponsorship income, players have legit UK companies set up, and only pay 19% tax on that, if they don’t draw out the post corporation tax profits.

 

[giveusfalmerplease]

They would still pay tax on any other earnings, but agree, due to creativity of their accountants, probably less than 40%!!!

i know someone who i used to work with in tech. Left our company to go contracting. In his first year his wages TREBLED compared to mine but due to a clever accountant was only paying about 10% tax...you can guarantee many of these footballers are the same......Pay their wages into trust funds for example. I'm sure i read of people setting themselves up as a business and having there gross salary paid direct to the business. They then pay themselves a nominal wage, pay a dividend which attracts basic rate tax only and the remaining profit they pay corporation tax on instead, this saving thousands (and in footballers cases tens of thousands)

 

[Weststander]

i know someone who i used to work with in tech. Left our company to go contracting. In his first year his wages TREBLED compared to mine but due to a clever accountant was only paying about 10% tax...you can guarantee many of these footballers are the same......Pay their wages into trust funds for example. I'm sure i read of people setting themselves up as a business and having there gross salary paid direct to the business. They then pay themselves a nominal wage, pay a dividend which attracts basic rate tax only and the remaining profit they pay corporation tax on instead, this saving thousands (and in footballers cases tens of thousands)

He lied about the 10% tax btw. Exaggerating to boast?

It was very advantageous, BUT corp tax for starters takes a 1/5 and used to be more (post negligible expenses in his profession as tax deductible and the nominal tax/NI free salary which would’ve been lower at that time).

Was his turnover very high? Into higher rate tax, his wife and him would also paid significant sums in personal tax on dividends.

Your layman’s summary of how it works for tax now, is wrong in several ways.

 

[giveusfalmerplease]

Yes! Am I the only one who finds it weird that the jobs marked as essential at the moment are some of the worst paid!? WTF is that!?

Trouble is for the owners of these little corner shops it really can be a case of if they pay a decent wage then they suffer themselves. This minimum wage raising means weve reached a point where someone serving in macdonalds earns the same hourly rate as a care worker or someone like my sister in law who works in a private nursery looking after 3-4 year olds. When the call came out to close the schools she was asked to use up her whole annual holiday entitlement and "might" eventually get paid the 80% government furlough payment when they pay the owner which could be in three months time.

 

[giveusfalmerplease]

He lied about the 10% tax btw. Exaggerating to boast?

It was very advantageous, BUT corp tax for starters takes a 1/5 and used to be more (post negligible expenses in his profession as tax deductible and the nominal tax/NI free salary which would’ve been lower at that time).

Was his turnover very high? Into higher rate tax, his wife and him would also paid significant sums in personal tax on dividends.

Your layman’s summary of how it works for tax now, is wrong in several ways.

well being self employed (as contractors are) they get loads of allowances - room in the home for business means they can claim back some personal gas/electric/water etc, pension contributions are tax free so that would be a big chunk of it, employing his girlfriend as his part time secretary i seem to recall so he could use her tax allowance (despite her only real "duty" being to stay at home and feed him when he came in!) the list goes on...

also i cant remember the exact details -it was 5 years ago - but he reckoned that even if he wasn't employed all the time, he likely had enough "allowances" or "offset" (i.e tax avoidances) not to pay anything other than national insurance contributions until he was earning 80k+

 

[Weststander]

well being self employed (as contractors are) they get loads of allowances - room in the home for business means they can claim back some personal gas/electric/water etc, pension contributions are tax free so that would be a big chunk of it, employing his girlfriend as his part time secretary i seem to recall so he could use her tax allowance (despite her only real "duty" being to stay at home and feed him when he came in!) the list goes on...

also i cant remember the exact details -it was 5 years ago - but he reckoned that even if he wasn't employed all the time, he likely had enough "allowances" or "offset" (i.e tax avoidances) not to pay anything other than national insurance contributions until he was earning 80k+

If we stick to the numbers and tax, give me a rough estimate of his IT turnover once he was minting it and whether his girlfriend had outside employment, and I’ll tell the true tax that Porkie was paying.

You are right, he had several tax advantages.

 

[giveusfalmerplease]

i'll add a footnote to the above by saying of course - in the case of footballers, even modest ones like the albion players earning 2m+ a year, they would find it a lot harder to avoid THAT much tax!...Maybe they can claim
100k ish for full time accountant
100k ish for personal massuse (for injuries of course!)
150k ish for personal dietitian
250k mortgage payments for their villas in the south of france or spain
100k travelling expenses to work (personal chaffeur as cant drive - due to being banned for drunk driving!?)
500k into pension fund so they can retire at 35
There thats over a million in taxable income theyve avoided already..

 

[giveusfalmerplease]

If we stick to the numbers and tax, give me a rough estimate of his IT turnover once he was minting it and whether his girlfriend had outside employment, and I’ll tell the true tax that Porkie was paying.

You are right, he had several tax advantages.

who are you the internet police - will you go knocking at his door for tax evasion?? i dont know mate it was a conversation in passing for someone i used to work with...