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Newcastle v Man City
- Thread starter Ernest
- Start date
Albumen
Don't wait for me!
There's going to be a big score at Stoke today. Liverpool look up for it.
Gullflyinghigh
Registered User
- Apr 23, 2012
- 4,279
Regardless of decision being right or wrong I dislike Pardew for saying after the game;
"I'm not thrilled with the referee's answer when I've asked for an explanation as I don't quite get how he can disallow a goal of that quality on the technical point he is using."
That's right Alan, the referee's decisions shouldn't be based on the rules of the game if there's a pretty goal at the end of it. Tit.
"I'm not thrilled with the referee's answer when I've asked for an explanation as I don't quite get how he can disallow a goal of that quality on the technical point he is using."
That's right Alan, the referee's decisions shouldn't be based on the rules of the game if there's a pretty goal at the end of it. Tit.
Chicken Runner61
We stand where we want!
- May 20, 2007
- 4,609
2-2 HT but the dippers were given a 2 goal start
wakeytom
New member
By moving out of the way he has become active by the fact that the keeper and possibly defenders will have been distracted by him
Bladders
Twats everywhere
Clearly then you haven't even seen the incident have you
wakeytom
New member
Seen it a few times, although I would suspect nothing more than an attack from you
No, he hasn't, as that isn't the rule.
The only way he can be offside without touching the ball is if he is clearly obstructing Joe Hart's line of sight, which he isn't in the slightest. It was the wrong decision. Another one of the numerous rules which is misinterpreted by the majority (bloody annoying when trying to referee 'em).
Beach Hut
Brighton Bhuna Boy
2-4 Suarez yet again
Kuipers Supporters Club
Well-known member
If in the referees opinion Newcastle have gained an advantage by the players in an offside posistion then the decision is 100% correct.
But, the laws of the game define gaining an advantage thusly: "“gaining an advantage by being in that position” means playing a ball i. that rebounds or is deflected to him off the goalpost, crossbar or an opponent having been in an offside position ii. that rebounds, is deflected or is played to him from a deliberate save by an opponent having been in an offside position"
That didn't happen. So by the definition given in the laws of the game, he didn't gain an advantage and the referee has not applied the law correctly.
Kuipers Supporters Club
Well-known member
That's only part of the law though:
If an opponent prevents the goalkeeper from playing the ball through obstructing the goalkeepers line of vision or movement he is offside.
Also if an opponent makes a gesture or movement 'reasonably close' to the play so that the blocking, deceiving or distracting makes a difference - as in today's game, the referee is correct.
It's the part of the law that was most important to your point about the ref considering if the player gained an advantage. The second line has been addressed, the Newcastle players were not clearly obstructing the Joe Hart's line of vision.
Your third line is something that does not appear in the laws of the game.
The Law, in it's entirety:
Offside position
It is not an offence in itself to be in an offside position.
A player is in an offside position if:
• he is nearer to his opponents’ goal line than both the ball and the
second-last opponent
A player is not in an offside position if:
• he is in his own half of the fi eld of play or
• he is level with the second-last opponent or
• he is level with the last two opponents
Offence
A player in an offside position is only penalised if, at the moment the ball
touches or is played by one of his team, he is, in the opinion of the referee,
involved in active play by:
• interfering with play or
• interfering with an opponent or
• gaining an advantage by being in that position
No offence
There is no offside offence if a player receives the ball directly from:
• a goal kick
• a throw-in
• a corner kick
Infringements and sanctions
In the event of an offside offence, the referee awards an indirect free kick
to the opposing team to be taken from the place where the infringement
occurred (see Law 13 – Position of free kick).
It is not an offence in itself to be in an offside position.
A player is in an offside position if:
• he is nearer to his opponents’ goal line than both the ball and the
second-last opponent
A player is not in an offside position if:
• he is in his own half of the fi eld of play or
• he is level with the second-last opponent or
• he is level with the last two opponents
Offence
A player in an offside position is only penalised if, at the moment the ball
touches or is played by one of his team, he is, in the opinion of the referee,
involved in active play by:
• interfering with play or
• interfering with an opponent or
• gaining an advantage by being in that position
No offence
There is no offside offence if a player receives the ball directly from:
• a goal kick
• a throw-in
• a corner kick
Infringements and sanctions
In the event of an offside offence, the referee awards an indirect free kick
to the opposing team to be taken from the place where the infringement
occurred (see Law 13 – Position of free kick).
The entirety of the interpretation of the Law is:
Defi nitions
In the context of Law 11 – Offside, the following defi nitions apply:
• “nearer to his opponents’ goal line” means that any part of a player’s head,
body or feet is nearer to his opponents’ goal line than both the ball and the
second-last opponent. The arms are not included in this defi nition
• “interfering with play” means playing or touching the ball passed or
touched by a team-mate
• “interfering with an opponent” means preventing an opponent from
playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s
line of vision or challenging an opponent for the ball
• “gaining an advantage by being in that position” means playing a ball
i. that rebounds or is defl ected to him off the goalpost, crossbar or an
opponent having been in an offside position
ii. that rebounds, is defl ected or is played to him from a deliberate save
by an opponent having been in an offside position
A player in an offside position receiving the ball from an opponent, who
deliberately plays the ball (except from a deliberate save), is not considered
to have gained an advantage.
Infringements
When an offside offence occurs, the referee awards an indirect free kick to be
taken from the position of the offending player when the ball was last played
to him by one of his team-mates.
Any defending player leaving the fi eld of play for any reason without the
referee’s permission shall be considered to be on his own goal line or touch line
for the purposes of offside until the next stoppage in play. If the player leaves
the fi eld of play deliberately, he must be cautioned when the ball is next out of
play.
It is not an offence in itself for a player who is in an offside position to step
off the fi eld of play to show the referee that he is not involved in active play.
However, if the referee considers that he has left the fi eld of play for tactical
reasons and has gained an unfair advantage by re-entering the fi eld of play, the
player must be cautioned for unsporting behaviour. The player needs to ask for
the referee’s permission to re-enter the fi eld of play.
If an attacking player remains stationary between the goalposts and inside the
goal net as the ball enters the goal, a goal must be awarded. However, if the
attacking player distracts an opponent, the goal must be disallowed, the player
cautioned for unsporting behaviour and play restarted with a dropped ball
from the position of the ball when play was stopped, unless play was stopped
inside the goal area, in which case the referee drops the ball on the goal area
line parallel to the goal line at the point nearest to where the ball was located
when play was stopped.
In the context of Law 11 – Offside, the following defi nitions apply:
• “nearer to his opponents’ goal line” means that any part of a player’s head,
body or feet is nearer to his opponents’ goal line than both the ball and the
second-last opponent. The arms are not included in this defi nition
• “interfering with play” means playing or touching the ball passed or
touched by a team-mate
• “interfering with an opponent” means preventing an opponent from
playing or being able to play the ball by clearly obstructing the opponent’s
line of vision or challenging an opponent for the ball
• “gaining an advantage by being in that position” means playing a ball
i. that rebounds or is defl ected to him off the goalpost, crossbar or an
opponent having been in an offside position
ii. that rebounds, is defl ected or is played to him from a deliberate save
by an opponent having been in an offside position
A player in an offside position receiving the ball from an opponent, who
deliberately plays the ball (except from a deliberate save), is not considered
to have gained an advantage.
Infringements
When an offside offence occurs, the referee awards an indirect free kick to be
taken from the position of the offending player when the ball was last played
to him by one of his team-mates.
Any defending player leaving the fi eld of play for any reason without the
referee’s permission shall be considered to be on his own goal line or touch line
for the purposes of offside until the next stoppage in play. If the player leaves
the fi eld of play deliberately, he must be cautioned when the ball is next out of
play.
It is not an offence in itself for a player who is in an offside position to step
off the fi eld of play to show the referee that he is not involved in active play.
However, if the referee considers that he has left the fi eld of play for tactical
reasons and has gained an unfair advantage by re-entering the fi eld of play, the
player must be cautioned for unsporting behaviour. The player needs to ask for
the referee’s permission to re-enter the fi eld of play.
If an attacking player remains stationary between the goalposts and inside the
goal net as the ball enters the goal, a goal must be awarded. However, if the
attacking player distracts an opponent, the goal must be disallowed, the player
cautioned for unsporting behaviour and play restarted with a dropped ball
from the position of the ball when play was stopped, unless play was stopped
inside the goal area, in which case the referee drops the ball on the goal area
line parallel to the goal line at the point nearest to where the ball was located
when play was stopped.
There are then a bunch of graphics to give examples. I've only copied in the relevant ones.
[pic1]
An attacker in an offside position (A), not interfering with an opponent,
touches the ball.
The assistant referee must raise the fl ag when the player touches the ball.
An attacker in an offside position (A), not interfering with an opponent,
does not touch the ball.
The player cannot be penalised because he did not touch the ball.
[pic3]
An attacker in an offside position (A) runs towards the ball and a team-mate
in an onside position (B) also runs towards the ball and plays it.
(A) cannot be penalised because he did not touch the ball.
[pic4]
A player in an offside position (A) may be penalised before playing or
touching the ball, if, in the opinion of the referee, no other team-mate in an
onside position has the opportunity to play the ball.
[pic5]
An attacker in an offside position (1) runs towards the ball and does not
touch the ball.
The assistant referee must signal “goal kick”.
An attacker in an offside position (A) is obstructing the goalkeeper’s line of
vision. He must be penalised because he prevents an opponent from playing or
being able to play the ball.
An attacker in an offside position (A) is not obstructing the goalkeeper’s line
of vision or challenging an opponent for the ball.
An attacker in an offside position (A) runs towards the ball but he does not
prevent the opponent from playing or being able to play the ball.
(A) is not challenging an opponent (B) for the ball.
[pic9]
An attacker in an offside position (A) runs towards the ball preventing the
opponent (B) from playing or being able to play the ball by challenging the
opponent for the ball.
(A) is challenging an opponent (B) for the ball.
[pic10]
An attacker in an offside position (B) is penalised for playing or touching
the ball that rebounds, is defl ected or is played to him from a deliberate save
by the goalkeeper having been in an offside position when the ball was last
touched or is played by a team-mate.
[pic11]
The shot by a team-mate (A) rebounds from the goalkeeper. (B) is in an onside
position and plays the ball.
(C) in an offside position is not penalised because he did not gain an
advantage from being in that position because he did not touch the ball.
[pic12]
An attacker in an offside position (B) is penalised for playing or touching
the ball that rebounds, is defl ected or is played to him from a deliberate save
by a player from the defending team (C) having been in an offside position
when the ball was last touched or is played by a team-mate.
[pic13]
An attacker (C) is in an offside position, not interfering with an opponent,
when a team-mate (A) passes the ball to player (B1) in an onside position who
runs towards the opponents’ goal and passes the ball (B2) to team-mate (C).
Attacker (C) cannot be penalised because when the ball was passed to him, he
was in an onside position.
All the pictures, and laws of the game can be found here: http://www.fifa.com/mm/document/footballdevelopment/refereeing/81/42/36/log2013en_neutral.pdf
No it isn't. See Ackers post above, what you've quoted isn't the laws of the game. The decision was wrong.
Pavilionaire
Well-known member
- Jul 7, 2003
- 30,647
Those sort of goals were disallowed week in week out twenty or thirty years ago. The law was rightfully changed for exactly this reason. The linesman should have set the ref straight.
I think the ref got it right originally, it was the linesman that set him wrong. At least without paying much attention at the time it seemed the ref gave it and was convinced to talk to the linesman, then it was disallowed.
Pavilionaire
Well-known member
- Jul 7, 2003
- 30,647
Linesman never put his flag up so judged the Newcastle trio not to be interfering with play. Ref went over, lino did all the talking and yet ref began to walk away and told him to put his flag up for offside. Would love to know what was said as it doesn't make any sense.
BensGrandad
New member
ACKER79
If an attacking player remains stationary between the goalposts and inside the
goal net as the ball enters the goal, a goal must be awarded. However, if the
attacking player distracts an opponent, the goal must be disallowed, the player
cautioned for unsporting behaviour and play restarted with a dropped ball
from the position of the ball when play was stopped, unless play was stopped
inside the goal area, in which case the referee drops the ball on the goal area
line parallel to the goal line at the point nearest to where the ball was located
when play was stopped.
[/QUOTE]
Does this part not cover the incident if you extend the wording from between the goal post to near the keeper? Had he stayed still a goal would have been given, but as he moved to allow the ball to go past him. There is also the point that he stabbed at the ball so did the ref or lino think that he had touched it to help it on its way, he didnt but not for the want of trying. So I think that the ref made the right call to disallow the goal.
If an attacking player remains stationary between the goalposts and inside the
goal net as the ball enters the goal, a goal must be awarded. However, if the
attacking player distracts an opponent, the goal must be disallowed, the player
cautioned for unsporting behaviour and play restarted with a dropped ball
from the position of the ball when play was stopped, unless play was stopped
inside the goal area, in which case the referee drops the ball on the goal area
line parallel to the goal line at the point nearest to where the ball was located
when play was stopped.
[/QUOTE]
Does this part not cover the incident if you extend the wording from between the goal post to near the keeper? Had he stayed still a goal would have been given, but as he moved to allow the ball to go past him. There is also the point that he stabbed at the ball so did the ref or lino think that he had touched it to help it on its way, he didnt but not for the want of trying. So I think that the ref made the right call to disallow the goal.
hitony
Administrator
Exactly this!