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[Politics] Tory meltdown finally arrived [was: incoming]...



nicko31

Well-known member
Jan 7, 2010
17,611
Gods country fortnightly
We've just had a whole load of 'average-speed' cameras installed o the A590 up our way.
When I say spot I mean "spot", ie one fixed spot. Average speed stuff I think will continue to be rolled out. Some of the new cameras don't even need a van, just a panda car and put up a mobile tripod
 






Bob!

Coffee Buyer
Jul 5, 2003
11,138
20240424_172808.jpg
 








Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,200
Faversham
Just thought I'd look up Angie's diabolical tax fraud debacle....

f*** me. The most she owes is £3,500, but the most likely amount she owes is faaaaark all. Nothing.

And does this mean that Labour are hypocrites, unfit to govern, and that the conservatives should continue their rightful role of running the country and massively enriching themselves and their friends? Yes. Yes it does. Of course it does.


:facepalm: :shootself
 


Pevenseagull

Anti-greed coalition
Jul 20, 2003
19,649
Just thought I'd look up Angie's diabolical tax fraud debacle....

f*** me. The most she owes is £3,500, but the most likely amount she owes is faaaaark all. Nothing.

And does this mean that Labour are hypocrites, unfit to govern, and that the conservatives should continue their rightful role of running the country and massively enriching themselves and their friends? Yes. Yes it does. Of course it does.


:facepalm: :shootself

It's like the curry story. That got 11 (eleven) consecutive front pages in The Mail on the lead up to local elections.
 


Bodian

Well-known member
May 3, 2012
11,860
Cumbria
Just thought I'd look up Angie's diabolical tax fraud debacle....

f*** me. The most she owes is £3,500, but the most likely amount she owes is faaaaark all. Nothing.

And does this mean that Labour are hypocrites, unfit to govern, and that the conservatives should continue their rightful role of running the country and massively enriching themselves and their friends? Yes. Yes it does. Of course it does.


:facepalm: :shootself
The Police don't even seem to know what it is they are actually investigating. CGT avoidance is an HMRC issue - so it can only be electoral fraud or council-tax evasion.
 




JBizzle

Well-known member
Apr 18, 2010
5,833
Seaford
The Police don't even seem to know what it is they are actually investigating. CGT avoidance is an HMRC issue - so it can only be electoral fraud or council-tax evasion.
In this instance, the police are simply a tool being used by the Tory government (again) to pursue a minor misdemeanor (at best). The police don't need to know WHAT they're investigating, the Tories just need people to believe that they ARE investigating.

Over the next 6 months, there will be more and more red herrings thrown to the masses in the hope that'll be enough for some to draw the necessary false equivalences to vote blue in the next GE.
 


Nobby

Well-known member
Sep 29, 2007
2,622
There was a song about hiding your true colours wasn’t there.
Local PC election leaflet arrived 🤣🤣
 

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Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,200
Faversham
It's like the curry story. That got 11 (eleven) consecutive front pages in The Mail on the lead up to local elections.
I don't even know what the curry story is!

That's because I probably exist an a realm far far away from the reaches of the Hitler Apologists and their wives-of-bankers* readership

*Including euphemistic ones.
 




Pevenseagull

Anti-greed coalition
Jul 20, 2003
19,649
I don't even know what the curry story is!

That's because I probably exist an a realm far far away from the reaches of the Hitler Apologists and their wives-of-bankers* readership

*Including euphemistic ones.


That was the one were Starmer and some colleagues took half an hour off work to eat a curry. James Dellingpole's son just happened to be out for an evening stroll in the area and got a picture of Starmer drinking a bottle of beer.

This as THE biggest story in the Daily Mail when the details of the endemic Bacchanelean excess at number 10 started to filter through.
 


rippleman

Well-known member
Oct 18, 2011
4,578
Just thought I'd look up Angie's diabolical tax fraud debacle....

f*** me. The most she owes is £3,500, but the most likely amount she owes is faaaaark all. Nothing.

And does this mean that Labour are hypocrites, unfit to govern, and that the conservatives should continue their rightful role of running the country and massively enriching themselves and their friends? Yes. Yes it does. Of course it does.


:facepalm: :shootself
But it isn't as straightforward as you imply.

A married couple (and you are deemed to be a married couple unless you have formally separated) can only have one property which qualifies for "main residence relief" ie qualifies for CGT exemption.

If, upon marriage, both spouses own a property they have 2 years to elect which of those properties qualifies for relief. If no election is made during that two year period HMRC will decide "on the facts" which property is the main residence.

There is no doubt that Ms Rayner's Stockport property will have qualified as her main residence up until she married. That period would be exempt on a time-apportioned basis (as would the last 9 months of ownership).

Ms Rayner says she has "legal advice" that there is no tax to pay. Fair enough then she and her husband have either elected on marriage (or within 2 years of marriage) for the Stockport property to be their main residence. This would expose the London property to CGT from the date the election became effective. (The alternative where hmrc has determined that the Stockport property was their main residence seems unlikely).


So there you have it! If there is nothing to hide, then I don't understand why she is so reluctant to publish her "legal advice". Even more so if, as you assert, she owes "faaaark all". If it is at the other end and she has fiddled £3,500 then where do you draw the line with tax evasion? £3.5K? £350K? £3.5m?


I do not understand why she is putting herself, and the Labour Party, through all this grief and aggro for want of publishing Counsel's Opinion that she has properly complied with tax law.
 


Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,200
Faversham
But it isn't as straightforward as you imply.

A married couple (and you are deemed to be a married couple unless you have formally separated) can only have one property which qualifies for "main residence relief" ie qualifies for CGT exemption.

If, upon marriage, both spouses own a property they have 2 years to elect which of those properties qualifies for relief. If no election is made during that two year period HMRC will decide "on the facts" which property is the main residence.

There is no doubt that Ms Rayner's Stockport property will have qualified as her main residence up until she married. That period would be exempt on a time-apportioned basis (as would the last 9 months of ownership).

Ms Rayner says she has "legal advice" that there is no tax to pay. Fair enough then she and her husband have either elected on marriage (or within 2 years of marriage) for the Stockport property to be their main residence. This would expose the London property to CGT from the date the election became effective. (The alternative where hmrc has determined that the Stockport property was their main residence seems unlikely).


So there you have it! If there is nothing to hide, then I don't understand why she is so reluctant to publish her "legal advice". Even more so if, as you assert, she owes "faaaark all". If it is at the other end and she has fiddled £3,500 then where do you draw the line with tax evasion? £3.5K? £350K? £3.5m?


I do not understand why she is putting herself, and the Labour Party, through all this grief and aggro for want of publishing Counsel's Opinion that she has properly complied with tax law.
TL-DR :shrug:
 




Bodian

Well-known member
May 3, 2012
11,860
Cumbria
But it isn't as straightforward as you imply.

A married couple (and you are deemed to be a married couple unless you have formally separated) can only have one property which qualifies for "main residence relief" ie qualifies for CGT exemption.

If, upon marriage, both spouses own a property they have 2 years to elect which of those properties qualifies for relief. If no election is made during that two year period HMRC will decide "on the facts" which property is the main residence.

There is no doubt that Ms Rayner's Stockport property will have qualified as her main residence up until she married. That period would be exempt on a time-apportioned basis (as would the last 9 months of ownership).

Ms Rayner says she has "legal advice" that there is no tax to pay. Fair enough then she and her husband have either elected on marriage (or within 2 years of marriage) for the Stockport property to be their main residence. This would expose the London property to CGT from the date the election became effective. (The alternative where hmrc has determined that the Stockport property was their main residence seems unlikely).


So there you have it! If there is nothing to hide, then I don't understand why she is so reluctant to publish her "legal advice". Even more so if, as you assert, she owes "faaaark all". If it is at the other end and she has fiddled £3,500 then where do you draw the line with tax evasion? £3.5K? £350K? £3.5m?


I do not understand why she is putting herself, and the Labour Party, through all this grief and aggro for want of publishing Counsel's Opinion that she has properly complied with tax law.
Her husband's house was about a mile away in Stockport - not in London.

Also - CGT is reduced if refurbishments are done, which seems to have happened. So, it would be unlikely to be £3.5k anyway.

She has quite openly said that she did not know of the tax rules re main residences when she sold her house - which is fair enough. I didn't know about them either. So, she didn't make any 'residency declarations' at the time, and wasn't seemingly deliberately 'fiddling the tax man' (and yes, I know ignorance of the law is no defence). And her tax advice is not from then, when she wasn't even an MP - but from now.

That is - she didn't take tax advice then 'fiddle' the system - she is basically saying she didn't know at the time, and has only since found out when the row broke out - so she sought advice to see if she needed to do anything or was in the wrong - and that the advice she has had said she didn't/hadn't. I'm sure it will be published at some time.
 




Harry Wilson's tackle

Harry Wilson's Tackle
NSC Patron
Oct 8, 2003
50,200
Faversham
Her husband's house was about a mile away in Stockport - not in London.

Also - CGT is reduced if refurbishments are done, which seems to have happened. So, it would be unlikely to be £3.5k anyway.

She has quite openly said that she did not know of the tax rules re main residences when she sold her house - which is fair enough. I didn't know about them either. So, she didn't make any 'residency declarations' at the time, and wasn't seemingly deliberately 'fiddling the tax man' (and yes, I know ignorance of the law is no defence). And her tax advice is not from then, when she wasn't even an MP - but from now.

That is - she didn't take tax advice then 'fiddle' the system - she is basically saying she didn't know at the time, and has only since found out when the row broke out - so she sought advice to see if she needed to do anything or was in the wrong - and that the advice she has had said she didn't/hadn't. I'm sure it will be published at some time.
But not in the Daily Fail, though :shrug:
 






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