Geoff Boycott and The Ashes.

joeinbrighton · Jan 6, 2014

vegster said:
Yes, because they went TOO negative. you don't have to stand there just blocking for hours, whatever happened to nudging singles and rotating the strike.

As I said a few posts up, England miss a good old fashioned single nurdler who is quick between the wickets. Collingwood and Thorpe both did this to great effect. Don't seem to have someone who fulfils this role now, but Joe Root could be the player suited to playing that role.

Leekbrookgull · Jan 6, 2014

joeinbrighton said:
Yes that modern day mind set of hitting the ball out of the ground at every opportunity that in the Melbourne test saw Ian Bell score 2 runs off 32 balls in 55 minutes and Michael Carberry score 12 runs off 80 balls either side of the lunch interval.

and if they are pinned down by decent bowling then that is part of the game.

keaton · Jan 7, 2014

vegster said:
Yes, because they went TOO negative. you don't have to stand there just blocking for hours, whatever happened to nudging singles and rotating the strike. This is his point, the mind set is all wrong, they gave away their wickets by playing the wrong strokes then realised that then thought dropping anchor completely was the solution. Thats what started the rot in the 5th test when Cook was lbw not playing a shot because his mindset was occupancy rather than building an innings.

So basically Boycott is saying they needed to play silly shots but keep scoring.
I imagine the coaches may have been telling them already

vegster · Jan 7, 2014

keaton said:
So basically Boycott is saying they needed to play silly shots but keep scoring.
I imagine the coaches may have been telling them already

No, stop playing silly shots but keep scoring.
I remember a long while back an England v Australia one day game when we posted a very good score that needed the convicts to score at 6 an over almost to win. They lost 2-3 quick wickets and then one or maybe both of the Waughs got in and dropped anchor. The scoring rate dropped well below what was needed but they hung about, picked up some singles and then started scoring 2's. The scoring rate was now near to 9 an over so England dropped the field back to prevent the 4's Australia needed to score to win the match.
The Australian response ? they worked the ball for 2's and 3's and came through to win by 6 wickets rarely scoring a 4 with a partnership of about 180 in 25 overs.

Guinness Boy · Jan 7, 2014

vegster said:
No, stop playing silly shots but keep scoring.
I remember a long while back an England v Australia one day game when we posted a very good score that needed the convicts to score at 6 an over almost to win. They lost 2-3 quick wickets and then one or maybe both of the Waughs got in and dropped anchor. The scoring rate dropped well below what was needed but they hung about, picked up some singles and then started scoring 2's. The scoring rate was now near to 9 an over so England dropped the field back to prevent the 4's Australia needed to score to win the match.
The Australian response ? they worked the ball for 2's and 3's and came through to win by 6 wickets rarely scoring a 4 with a partnership of about 180 in 25 overs.

Exactly. There's nothing wrong with keeping the scoreboard ticking over with proper shots. In Tests it has to be desirable.

I haven't played Sunday cricket in a while but towards the end of my involvement you could really see how bad 20/20 is for the game. Sundays are the time to blood youngsters against adults. Ten years ago they would come and play straight and call correctly. Two years or so ago and they were trying to wahoo every ball or play scoops and getting bowled or easily caught. I worry for the standard of test batting in five years from now.

Hotchilidog · Jan 7, 2014

keaton said:
As per usual there's a lot of complaining from Boycott and not a lot of answers.
Except for we should get rid of some players (helpful)
and we should be playing Broad and Finn all next summer. So Finn (who's failed in two Ashes series in a good England team v average Aussie team) should be guaranteed a start as opposed to the players who've only failed in one series (for a miserable England team v A pretty good Aussie one).

Why should be involved in the England team? He's got no coaching experience at all and was a poor captain.

I disagree, he did offer a suggestion as to how to improve the play of key Test Match players. His analysis of the poor shot selection was spot on and he offered a good reason as to why this is the case. An excellent response to the omnishambles that was the Ashes this winter.

keaton · Jan 7, 2014

Guinness Boy said:
Exactly. There's nothing wrong with keeping the scoreboard ticking over with proper shots. In Tests it has to be desirable.

I haven't played Sunday cricket in a while but towards the end of my involvement you could really see how bad 20/20 is for the game. Sundays are the time to blood youngsters against adults. Ten years ago they would come and play straight and call correctly. Two years or so ago and they were trying to wahoo every ball or play scoops and getting bowled or easily caught. I worry for the standard of test batting in five years from now.

I played last year and the youngsters we had playing, played perfectly properly pretty much every time. Me and the old and less fit players heaved at everything though.
I wouldn't pay too much attention to Sunday cricket anyway as that's when the better players cut loose a bit more

Bold Seagull · Jan 7, 2014

keaton said:
So basically Boycott is saying they needed to play silly shots but keep scoring.
I imagine the coaches may have been telling them already

Vegster is correct in saying no silly shots, but essentially look to get yourself in and stay there. We seemed to get to 30 runs or so, think we were in and start attacking their bowling - then get out. Sometimes, whether you are on 40 or 60, you have to play as if you're still facing that first over. Sometimes it's not all about attacking a bowler off the park.

The Vegster anecdote is a good one in that actually since the debacle away to Pakistan in the UAE, we've had a real issue in the top order of effectively rotating the strike when under pressure. It's all very well an in form Cook, Bell and KP being able to attack when in great nick, but we've got ourselves bogged down so many times in recent series. There is a choice between outright blocking, and outright going after the bowling. This is where our batting has seemed directionless. We seem unable to realise what the match situation has called for.

keaton · Jan 7, 2014

Bold Seagull said:
Vegster is correct in saying no silly shots, but essentially look to get yourself in and stay there. We seemed to get to 30 runs or so, think we were in and start attacking their bowling - then get out. Sometimes, whether you are on 40 or 60, you have to play as if you're still facing that first over. Sometimes it's not all about attacking a bowler off the park.

The Vegster anecdote is a good one in that actually since the debacle away to Pakistan in the UAE, we've had a real issue in the top order of effectively rotating the strike when under pressure. It's all very well an in form Cook, Bell and KP being able to attack when in great nick, but we've got ourselves bogged down so many times in recent series. There is a choice between outright blocking, and outright going after the bowling. This is where our batting has seemed directionless. We seem unable to realise what the match situation has called for.

I don't disagree our shot selections is poor. We have got worse if anything under Gooch and i'd certainly get rid off him.
I just don't think the players haven't been told this a hundred times already and don't regard this as evidence that Boycott has anything worthwhile to add to the debate. Improve your shot selection is not an action plan

Shropshire Seagull · Jan 7, 2014

I can't believe that "Buck", who was playing club cricket at my club (Wellington in Shropshire) 10 years ago is now the leading run-scorer in an Ashes series.

Fair play to Chris Rogers I say .....

vegster · Jan 7, 2014

keaton said:
I don't disagree our shot selections is poor. We have got worse if anything under Gooch and i'd certainly get rid off him.
I just don't think the players haven't been told this a hundred times already and don't regard this as evidence that Boycott has anything worthwhile to add to the debate. Improve your shot selection is not an action plan

There is a solution at hand, Joe Root was dropped for the 5th and final Test as he was needed for fine tuning a top secret and unique way of transferring knowledge from one person to another. All Yorkshire born people have a unique neural net structure which convinces them that they are right at all times, however, sometimes there is the odd mutant that does not acquire the neurons in the correct sequence.

A technique pioneered in the 1960's has been upgraded to cope with this and Joe's brain has been re-modulated with that of a master of his craft. The summer of 2014 will see a new England team built around Joe Root the reborn run machine, it is projected his average will be 60.65 after this summer but there may be some collateral damage in the form of the odd run-out.

Ladies and gentlemen, here is the first photograph of Joe 2014 receiving Geoffrey Boycott's batting skills.

vegster · Jan 7, 2014

Just read some of the first autopsy's in The Times today, I would not know where to begin, we effectively start 2014 with Anderson,Broad, Root, and, KP and Bell with reservations.

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Geoff Boycott and The Ashes.

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