[Politics] Who was the best British Prime Minister of the last 60 or so years?

Harry Wilson's tackle · May 23, 2018

Behind Enemy Lines said:
Blair - yes, Iraq was a terrible mistake but otherwise he remains streets ahead of the vast majority of politicians.

Cameron the worst.

This.

(his mistake was managing the Iraq process not starting it IMO)

(Also, TB managed to fend off a vicious and sustained attack for many years without getting as pissy as I would have under the circs, until he was worn down by its relentlessness; thanks Gordon - good NCO but not officer material :angry:

)

Biscuit · May 23, 2018

SeagullinExile said:
And by the way, stop being so patronising. People are allowed differing views you know.

I'm sorry if you read it as patronising, sometimes tone of voice is tricky to gauge when a conversation isn't spoken. It wasn't my intention. I welcome differing views, as long as they're well argued.

Biscuit · May 23, 2018

symyjym said:
Wow, that's scary. 23.73% believe Blair was.

I'm one of them. Tell me why I'm wrong

Two Professors · May 23, 2018

Well,what do you know?Maggie gets more votes than all the Labour PM's added together,even with one of the candidates on the poll twice!

Perhaps it's just the noisy ones on NSC who are lefties?

beorhthelm · May 23, 2018

GT49er said:
Yes, of course mines were closed before Thatcher - natural progression; when a mine was worked out it was closed. The Thatcher assault wasn't so much an attack on the industry as such - although Thatcher clearly wasn't in favour of dirty, mucky heavy industry (with Trade Unions), not when people could get rich doing nice clean jobs like working in the City - but it certainly was a vicious political attack on the NUM, with the aim of smashing it once and for all, even if it did mean closing down a large number of mines (particularly in the Midlands) that were still viable - and probably would still be viable today, and a better alternative to importing all our coal.

fair enough, so why not say that in the first place. there certainly was an intent to break the unions, and lets be honest about this, played right into the game. coming from distant mining background, the miners werent too happy about the dirty industry and would rather have been in cleaner jobs too. trouble is too many towns had only the one industry with little else to supprt the economy. in the past people have always moved on for work or new industry/commerce comes into to make use of the workforce. for what ever reasons, that didnt happen. that is the short coming on not having central planning, theres often not a plan. in the same vein, i dont see there was a plan to destory industry, just a consequnce of calling time and not proping it up any longer. if pits were viable, they would have continued, as a few did.

Raleigh Chopper · May 23, 2018

The Clamp said:
I would genuinely love to be able to say Thatcher. But the more one examines her life, the more despicable she becomes.
For example, her supposedly strong stance on the Falklands was nothing of the sort. She wanted to leave well alone, saying "let the Argies have it" but was advised by her cabinet to take action and secure another term in power. And what she did to communities in the North of England is unforgivable and the way in which she did it should have seen her in court.

And she didn't even have anything to do with inventing Mr.Whippy :-(

And that is just a couple of examples.
Anyone that voted Thatcher must have not been there at the time or blind, deaf and unable to read.
Tories on here would vote Jimmy Saville if he had a blue rosette on.
She was a horrible peice of work.
Eventually hated by her cabinet and most Tory MP's.
She was lucky The Falklands came along, it rescued her for a while.
People need to read up on everything she did as PM.
Not surprised she got dementia, she had it long before as well.
I celebrated her death, good riddance, I hope she is still burning in hell for all the misery she caused.
Cameron tried and May is trying to replicate, but she was the master.
I am all for women PM's but I am afraid that both Thatcher and May have let their gender down very badly.

JC Footy Genius · May 23, 2018

Raleigh Chopper said:
And that is just a couple of examples.
Anyone that voted Thatcher must have not been there at the time or blind, deaf and unable to read.
Tories on here would vote Jimmy Saville if he had a blue rosette on.
She was a horrible peice of work.
Eventually hated by her cabinet and most Tory MP's.
She was lucky The Falklands came along, it rescued her for a while.
People need to read up on everything she did as PM.
Not surprised she got dementia, she had it long before as well.
I celebrated her death, good riddance, I hope she is still burning in hell for all the misery she caused.
Cameron tried and May is trying to replicate, but she was the master.
I am all for women PM's but I am afraid that both Thatcher and May have let their gender down very badly.

That should read 'I am all for women (any) PMs' as long as they conform to my narrow-minded, prejudiced worldview.

symyjym · May 23, 2018

Biscuit said:
I'm one of them. Tell me why I'm wrong

He took the Great out of Britain and led our soldiers to war using deception in our name. I always believed that Britain led the world by setting a good example but all we endorsed was ignoring the UN and world opinion. It wasn't a great advert for democracy and any moral high ground has been lost since.

Most if not all of the terrorism since has been a byproduct of the Iraq war and ISIL can happily ignore the UN too, because that is what we taught them.

I hope this helps you understand my view and it isn't the start of an NSC argument

looney · May 23, 2018

Brighton Lines said:
You're not really answering my question. Educate my ignorance.

Given this is basic stuff and has been posted about on numerous occasions, and you seem to be hanging around these politics threads for unhealthy amount of time its safe to say your ignorance is unmovable and wilful.

btnbelle · May 23, 2018

The only answer to this question is Margaret Thatcher.

Britain recovered from a 70's Labour government and BOOMED....
Our borders were secure even if you lived in the Falklands.
She stood up to the EU big time.
She had vision... Wealth cascading down the generations...
She stood up to the miners, ok some would not be happy about this, but remember the Paris climate change agreement...
A woman in her own right with a handbag to match.....

Bladders · May 23, 2018

KingKev said:
It was f&cking grim.....

......for Socialists :lolol:

Great times

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Weststander · May 23, 2018

Raleigh Chopper said:
And that is just a couple of examples.
Anyone that voted Thatcher must have not been there at the time or blind, deaf and unable to read.
Tories on here would vote Jimmy Saville if he had a blue rosette on.
She was a horrible peice of work.
Eventually hated by her cabinet and most Tory MP's.
She was lucky The Falklands came along, it rescued her for a while.
People need to read up on everything she did as PM.
Not surprised she got dementia, she had it long before as well.
I celebrated her death, good riddance, I hope she is still burning in hell for all the misery she caused.
Cameron tried and May is trying to replicate, but she was the master.
I am all for women PM's but I am afraid that both Thatcher and May have let their gender down very badly.

You carry so much hate and vindictiveness, it's not healthy.

Eeyore · May 23, 2018

btnbelle said:
The only answer to this question is Margaret Thatcher.

Britain recovered from a 70's Labour government and BOOMED....
Our borders were secure even if you lived in the Falklands.
She stood up to the EU big time.
She had vision... Wealth cascading down the generations...
She stood up to the miners, ok some would not be happy about this, but remember the Paris climate change agreement...
A woman in her own right with a handbag to match.....

Well, actually after the recession of 1980-1982 Britain only recovered to the position that it was in 1979 by the end of the Thatcher years.

Unemployment hit record levels and, even during periods of recovery, never kept in line with growth.

Interest rates reached record highs.

The gender pay gap actually widened.

Manufacturing declined (although it was already in decline, in fairness)

The number of strikes in 1987/88 almost reached the same amount as ten years previous.

Poverty (those below 60% of median income) rose by nearly 10%

Inequality (best use the recognised GINI index for this) rose by about 30%.

(You're talking to a former business and economics student BTW)

I think folk living in the south are in a Thatcherite bubble myself.

DavidinSouthampton · May 23, 2018

beorhthelm said:
people on the left always say this, dismissing that she delivered what people wanted. a politican doesnt destroy community or create selfishness, people make their communities, look after their neighbours. the failings to provide alternative industy went back to 60's when the mines, factories, dockyards first closed in large numbers. always overlooked.

Politicians should deliver what people need rather than what they want, which could be very different.

When any major problems in our country ae being highlighted on the News, in our household we often say "It's all Thatcher's fault."......... and when we think about it , we usually decide that it actually was. The "Right to Buy" and the aim of a property owning democracy lead to the current housing crisis? Over-simplification, perhaps, but..........

DavidinSouthampton · May 23, 2018

symyjym said:
Wow, that's scary. 23.73% believe Blair was.

Some of us think it is even more scary that 50% think that Thatcher was,

beorhthelm · May 23, 2018

DavidinSouthampton said:
The "Right to Buy" and the aim of a property owning democracy lead to the current housing crisis?

not really, population needs same amount of housing regardless who owns it, council, private landlord or owner occupied. we havent built enough for 3 decades. maybe indirectly right to buy suppressed demand for new properties so development scaled back? a related policy to prevent councils building is definatly part of the problem and needs to be removed as soon as possible.

DavidinSouthampton · May 23, 2018

beorhthelm said:
not really, population needs same amount of housing regardless who owns it, council, private landlord or owner occupied. we havent built enough for 3 decades. maybe indirectly right to buy suppressed demand for new properties so development scaled back? a related policy to prevent councils building is definatly part of the problem and needs to be removed as soon as possible.

Much of that is probably what I meant had I had the energy to think about it.......

looney · May 23, 2018

Brighton Lines said:
Well, actually after the recession of 1980-1982 Britain only recovered to the position that it was in 1979 by the end of the Thatcher years.

Unemployment hit record levels and, even during periods of recovery, never kept in line with growth.

Interest rates reached record highs.

The gender pay gap actually widened.

Manufacturing declined (although it was already in decline, in fairness)

The number of strikes in 1987/88 almost reached the same amount as ten years previous.

Poverty (those below 60% of median income) rose by nearly 10%

Inequality (best use the recognised GINI index for this) rose by about 30%.

(You're talking to a former business and economics student BTW)

I think folk living in the south are in a Thatcherite bubble myself.

Yea and you are talking to someone with an economics MA who could easilt trash your spin and cherry picking of details to bits, but I will surfice to point out the logical inconsistency in your post (in fact its present in most of your posts.)

If the 80s ended up being no better than the 70s why did people keep electing Thatcher then Major to the point that Labour had to reform to get elected? Again your missing vital stuff which means your numbers don't add up.

If you want I will go through your list and trash each part if you like, I can set aside some time for this. I just thought that pointing out its illogical premise would suffice.

I do hope you call me out on this, I cant wait to get my teeth into your poverty claim and the rowntree scandal for starters.

Eeyore · May 23, 2018

looney said:
Yea and you are talking to someone with an economics MA who could easilt trash your spin and cherry picking of details to bits, but I will surfice to point out the logical inconsistency in your post (in fact its present in most of your posts.)

If the 80s ended up being no better than the 70s why did people keep electing Thatcher then Major to the point that Labour had to reform to get elected? Again your missing vital stuff which means your numbers don't add up.

If you want I will go through your list and trash each part if you like, I can set aside some time for this. I just thought that pointing out its illogical premise would suffice.

I do hope you call me out on this, I cant wait to get my teeth into your poverty claim and the rowntree scandal for starters.

If you consider the standard of opposition it was hardly surprising.

You are welcome to trash my list- remember to answer my previous question too.

Are you not also spending an unhealthy amount of time on political threads too ? :lolol:

JC Footy Genius · May 23, 2018

Shirley a business and economics student .. 'btw' is the ultimate NSC smackdown

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[Politics] Who was the best British Prime Minister of the last 60 or so years?

Who was the best British Prime Minister of the last 60 or so years?

Theresa May

David Cameron

Gordon Brown

Tony Blair

John Major

Margaret Thatcher

James Callaghan

Harold Wilson

Edward Heath

Harold Wilson

Alec Douglas-Home

Harold Macmillan

Anthony Eden

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