O/T PC, Laptop or Mac Book

wellquickwoody · Aug 18, 2016

To run alongside the other thread........

Starting a brand new business and need advice on what platform to use, and what kind of budget to expect. It will be a wholesale business so I will need accountancy software, office software, email stuff etc etc. It will probably be office based but I will be regularly visiting clients and so may need to take it, or something, with me. It will also be required to build and respond to a public website, and a private ecommerce store.

Not sure my £250 Acer is quite up to the requirements.........

StonehamPark · Aug 18, 2016

A Macbook Pro for around £1000 will last at least 5 years and won't break unless you throw it off a roof.
It won't really slow down.

Any other laptop will probably have severe issues within 5 years, will definitely slow down and will likely chuck itself of the roof just to end it all.

TWOCHOICEStom · Aug 18, 2016

As much as I love macs, for most business/accounting/admin needs, Windows is the better option.

Argartu · Aug 18, 2016

StonehamPark said:
A Macbook Pro for around £1000 will last at least 5 years and won't break unless you throw it off a roof.
It won't really slow down.

It also won't run 90% of the software you'll want to use to run a business. Apple make great products but the majority of the business world is still standing by Windows. (Unless they're a fancy schmancy design company)

I'd recommend running Windows 7, I've been working with a couple of PC's that have been upgraded to 10 and it's been an absolute mare.

For £4-500 you can pick up a decent laptop, if it's just for web design/accounts/word processing.

In anticipation of the Macboys flaming me for my opinion, yes, I know there's web based solutions for almost everything; but after working for a SASS company for two years, you're always much better off having the data with you rather than in a datacentre halfway around the world.

Mr Smggles · Aug 18, 2016

Don't use Mac for business, go Windows every time. Coming from someone who only has Mac at home.

beorhthelm · Aug 18, 2016

accountancy, business software, you'll probably want Windows. if doing website development work, probably a Mac is better.

on the other hand, with the online apps these days you could probably do alot of business related work on an iPad or other tablet.

so consider what software you need first then chose a platform that they support.

TWOCHOICEStom · Aug 18, 2016

Argartu said:
It also won't run 90% of the software you'll want to use to run a business. Apple make great products but the majority of the business world is still standing by Windows. (Unless they're a fancy schmancy design company)

I'd recommend running Windows 7, I've been working with a couple of PC's that have been upgraded to 10 and it's been an absolute mare.

For £4-500 you can pick up a decent laptop, if it's just for web design/accounts/word processing.

In anticipation of the Macboys flaming me for my opinion, yes, I know there's web based solutions for almost everything; but after working for a SASS company for two years, you're always much better off having the data with you rather than in a datacentre halfway around the world.

Although I can't speak for the transition between 7 and 10, I find it a pleasure to use and have had zero issues since day one.

If you're going to go cheap on the laptop front I'd really recommend OneDrive and Office 365. That way when you inevitably have to replace the damn thing after a year or so, you can at least skip the ballache of reinstalling everything.

wellquickwoody · Aug 18, 2016

TWOCHOICEStom said:
Although I can't speak for the transition between 7 and 10, I find it a pleasure to use and have had zero issues since day one.

If you're going to go cheap on the laptop front I'd really recommend OneDrive and Office 365. That way when you inevitably have to replace the damn thing after a year or so, you can at least skip the ballache of reinstalling everything.

This is why I love NSC, I am actually getting real answers from real people. When I tried to get reviews on web hosting I just got fake 'chatters' telling me how wonderful company x was to fulfill my requirements, when I chose the completely opposite criteria I still got the same reccomendation!

Thanks for all input guys and girls, love to here more.

TWOCHOICEStom · Aug 18, 2016

wellquickwoody said:
This is why I love NSC, I am actually getting real answers from real people. When I tried to get reviews on web hosting I just got fake 'chatters' telling me how wonderful company x was to fulfill my requirements, when I chose the completely opposite criteria I still got the same reccomendation!

Thanks for all input guys and girls, love to here more.

A pleasure!

Ok, so my setup at work which I'm very happy with is I have a big monitor, wireless keyboard and mouse, an HP Elitebook and a dock. It's an i7 something or other. So it's bloody fast, then at the end of the day I can just pop it out and take it home without pulling out a ton of wires and fiddling around.

All of my documents are stored on OneDrive, and my Office 365 account means I can access almost everything through a web browser if for some reason I don't have access to my computer. It's GREAT.

Gwylan · Aug 18, 2016

StonehamPark said:
A Macbook Pro for around £1000 will last at least 5 years and won't break unless you throw it off a roof.
It won't really slow down.

Any other laptop will probably have severe issues within 5 years, will definitely slow down and will likely chuck itself of the roof just to end it all.

I'd say the exact opposite: every Apple product I've had has broken down beyond repair just after its warranty ended. My Windows machines, on the other hand, seem to last forever.

I'm currently sitting here with four machines on my desk - one of them is eight years old and is still fine and I'm charging a six-year old laptop to take out with me tonight. Windows vendors build their machines to last (except Sony Vaios, mine had a hard drive pack up after 18 months and I worked at a place that wouldn't support Sony as they went wrong so frequently).

And the answer to OP's question is, as other people have pointed out, go Windows unless you're a designer. Adobe products run like a dog on Windows and like a dream on Apple

StonehamPark · Aug 18, 2016

Gwylan said:
I'd say the exact opposite: every Apple product I've had has broken down beyond repair just after its warranty ended. My Windows machines, on the other hand, seem to last forever.

I'm currently sitting here with four machines on my desk - one of them is eight years old and is still fine and I'm charging a six-year old laptop to take out with me tonight. Windows vendors build their machines to last (except Sony Vaios, mine had a hard drive pack up after 18 months and I worked at a place that wouldn't support Sony as they went wrong so frequently).

And the answer to OP's question is, as other people have pointed out, go Windows unless you're a designer. Adobe products run like a dog on Windows and like a dream on Apple

That's fair enough.
I've had nothing but trouble with Windows in the past.

All my gear now is Apple (past 5-6 years) and everything still going without a single issue. Might just be lucky?

I have no experience in which machine works best in an office environment, so OP should ignore my first post.

Icy Gull · Aug 18, 2016

You can run Windows on a Mac using Parallels which works perfectly in my experience

FatSuperman · Aug 18, 2016

I will echo what TWOCHOICEStom has said, get an Office 365 subscription which comes with OneDrive storage. It's a business expense and will cost you about £100 a year for the Office suite and all the online storage you need, you save everything to your device and it's automatically stored online. Miraculously, it actually works, you don't even know it's happening.

You can access those files via your mobile / tablet etc as well, but let's all be honest, those things are crap for actually doing any work.

The Mac vs PC argument is so tired, you should just pick whichever you are most comfortable using. You can get the relevant software for a business of this size on either platform so that shouldn't be a consideration, Office 365 has Mac or Windows options. Web design is no easier on a Mac than a Windows box. The only consideration is that the Mac is probably going to be a little bit more costly for everything, but that's it. The talk about reliability is anecdotal, I've had endless problems with my Mac, my mate's hasn't put a foot wrong in half a decade.

The only other advice I'd have is recognise your weaknesses and outsource those tasks. If you are no good at web design, then don't waste weeks and weeks trying to do it, in all likelihood you'll produce something sub standard. Outsource it instead.

Badger · Aug 18, 2016

FatSuperman said:
I will echo what TWOCHOICEStom has said, get an Office 365 subscription which comes with OneDrive storage. It's a business expense and will cost you about £100 a year for the Office suite and all the online storage you need, you save everything to your device and it's automatically stored online. Miraculously, it actually works, you don't even know it's happening.

You can access those files via your mobile / tablet etc as well, but let's all be honest, those things are crap for actually doing any work.

The Mac vs PC argument is so tired, you should just pick whichever you are most comfortable using. You can get the relevant software for a business of this size on either platform so that shouldn't be a consideration, Office 365 has Mac or Windows options. Web design is no easier on a Mac than a Windows box. The only consideration is that the Mac is probably going to be a little bit more costly for everything, but that's it. The talk about reliability is anecdotal, I've had endless problems with my Mac, my mate's hasn't put a foot wrong in half a decade.

The only other advice I'd have is recognise your weaknesses and outsource those tasks. If you are no good at web design, then don't waste weeks and weeks trying to do it, in all likelihood you'll produce something sub standard. Outsource it instead.

I agree with all this. I've used Office 365 / OneDrive for a couple of years now and it's great value. The only issue I've had is the Android OneDrive app eating up battery on my phone, but I can live without it on that.

As you say, the Mac vs PC argument is very tired. People go on about Windows laptops breaking and not lasting very long, but that's usually because they haven't spent money on a DECENT one. An £800 Windows laptop is likely to last just as long as a £1000 Macbook. Despite what people say, Macbooks do sometimes crash and break, in my experience just as much as Windows.

FatSuperman · Aug 18, 2016

Badger said:
I agree with all this. I've used Office 365 / OneDrive for a couple of years now and it's great value. The only issue I've had is the Android OneDrive app eating up battery on my phone, but I can live without it on that.

As you say, the Mac vs PC argument is very tired. People go on about Windows laptops breaking and not lasting very long, but that's usually because they haven't spent money on a DECENT one. An £800 Windows laptop is likely to last just as long as a £1000 Macbook. Despite what people say, Macbooks do sometimes crash and break, in my experience just as much as Windows.

I'm glad you used the term 'in my experience'. That's the key really. Like you, I've had a terrible time with my latest Mac, and it's really disappointed me. Had a wireless issue after about 10 months (must have been an update I guess) which meant the wireless would drop every minute or two - only affected this particular device. The thing I hate about this is that despite there being posts on the Apple forums with thousands of people complaining and offering half-baked solutions, there is NO response from Apple - just like the debacle with the iPhone signal issue, they just ignore the problems. The notion that their customer service is the best is a myth. In store, they are great to a point, but elsewhere they leave a LOT to be desired.
On my issue, it was finally resolved by another update, almost TWO years after the problem. In that time I had to use a network cable. Nice shiny MacBook, tethered to the router like a tramp's dog on a string.

If I buy a £300 laptop then I shouldn't be surprised the build quality is crap. If I spend £1,200 on one I expect it to be very good.

Best laptop I've used in many years:
https://www.microsoftstore.com/store/msuk/en_GB/pdp/Surface-Pro-4-Bundle/productID.332859400

perseus · Aug 18, 2016

TWOCHOICEStom said:
A pleasure!

Ok, so my setup at work which I'm very happy with is I have a big monitor, wireless keyboard and mouse, an HP Elitebook and a dock. It's an i7 something or other. So it's bloody fast, then at the end of the day I can just pop it out and take it home without pulling out a ton of wires and fiddling around.

All of my documents are stored on OneDrive, and my Office 365 account means I can access almost everything through a web browser if for some reason I don't have access to my computer. It's GREAT.

This through 30+ years experience. Although it is all changed now. The big screen helps. I'm thinking of a mini-computer if there is one that is any good? Spare monitor if it packs up. Laptops as well but use them less than once a week. Ideally, all the stuff is backed up to hard drive, but I expect Cloud is better? The real drag is if something goes wrong when an deadline needs to be met.

clippedgull · Aug 18, 2016

Let's get straight to the point.

Windows machines can be fantastic.
Apple machines can be fantastic.

Windows machines can give you grief.
Apple machines can give you grief.

One thing I will say about Apple (shops and online) is that they will let you try out at home and return for a no quibble refund if you wish within 14 days.

Dorset Seagull · Aug 19, 2016

Thanks for all the advice chaps but I managed to fix the Samsung eventually but will probably still look at a new laptop.

Thought you might like to know the fix which might be helpful to you sometime. My laptop froze just after boot up and even a Win7 disc was unable to boot in. I found a fantastic piece of freeware online called Hirens BootCD which has about 100 freeware progs on it which you can use to identify problems and fix them. You need to run it from a CD or USB stick and it also loads in a copy of Win XP into ram so you can at least rescue your files even if you dont fix the problem. I suspected my issue was a problem with stalling whilst reading the hard drive so I ran one of the progs and it started to repair bad sectors on the disc. After a day or so it had repaired 38 bad sectors so I decided to halt the process and see if it had fixed the problem. Sure enough I booted straight in and all is now well

So far so good.

happypig · Aug 19, 2016

Dorset Seagull said:
Thanks for all the advice chaps but I managed to fix the Samsung eventually but will probably still look at a new laptop.

Thought you might like to know the fix which might be helpful to you sometime. My laptop froze just after boot up and even a Win7 disc was unable to boot in. I found a fantastic piece of freeware online called Hirens BootCD which has about 100 freeware progs on it which you can use to identify problems and fix them. You need to run it from a CD or USB stick and it also loads in a copy of Win XP into ram so you can at least rescue your files even if you dont fix the problem. I suspected my issue was a problem with stalling whilst reading the hard drive so I ran one of the progs and it started to repair bad sectors on the disc. After a day or so it had repaired 38 bad sectors so I decided to halt the process and see if it had fixed the problem. Sure enough I booted straight in and all is now well

So far so good.

If you haven't already, back up all your data. Your disk might be about to fail.

Herr Tubthumper · Aug 19, 2016

wellquickwoody said:
To run alongside the other thread........

Starting a brand new business and need advice on what platform to use, and what kind of budget to expect. It will be a wholesale business so I will need accountancy software, office software, email stuff etc etc. It will probably be office based but I will be regularly visiting clients and so may need to take it, or something, with me. It will also be required to build and respond to a public website, and a private ecommerce store.

Not sure my £250 Acer is quite up to the requirements.........

Apple, obviously.

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