[Politics] Brexit

Two Professors · May 10, 2018

The Clamp said:
Fairly easy. These are just from people I know so you can be certain there are many more .
One works for the BBC selling content across Europe, easily three flights a week not including flights out and home.
Another works in procurement for an e-learning platform. Flies out on a Sunday night and then easily spends the week taking at least one flight every 24 hours before flying home on Friday.
I have a friend of a friend who's a location scout. He flies at least 4 times a week.
I myself worked for an International events company. One typical week's example:
Fly into Rome on Monday morning, event in the afternoon, stay overnight in Rome, fly to Switzerland on Tuesday morning do the event , across to Germany in evening for morning event the next day, back to UK for a days rest and back to Switzerland for Friday.
See how it works?
Many companies employ a person specifically for the role of sorting travel and flight arrangements. Mott Macdonald for example have their own in house travel agency, John Proctor travel.
You are also focussing on an individual employees flights. Take a company like Mott Macdonald, I woul estimate that collective flights across their employees, per week, must run into the high hundreds.

Companies booking loads of flights a week for different people,no problem.People flying four or five times a week would surely run into insurance problems from the health risks,which have been well known since the mid-2000's.Did Bond work for Mott Macdonald then?Thought he worked for International Exports.The International Events company you worked for must have been mega-busy to have events every week!

daveinprague · May 10, 2018

melias shoes said:
No not at all. I'm just sick of remainers telling us that we wanted democracy. Then do the undemocratic task of trying to stop Brexit. I voted leave not for democracy that they bleat on about but to actually leave the EU. Why can't the remainers accept that piece of democracy. After all they love democracy all of a sudden. You're right the world changes and it changed massively 2 years ago. Accept it and move on.

A second referendum wouldnt stop Brexit would it?

Two Professors · May 10, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
I've asked lots of them and on here, which sort of Brexit they want. I've given them the options but they still don't give me the definitive answer. Even the Brexit MPs don't understand the difference with EEA, Shengen and other such nuances, nor can they supply answers to the Irisih border and Gibraltar.

As for handing powers to Brussels, they really don't understand how democracy works.

So come on Brexiteers Norway, Swiss, Canada, Hard Brexit, Soft Brexit, Customs Union, Free Movement etc etc. Please tell us your preferences.

Don't need any of the silly labels.We are not Norway,Switzerland,Canada,Turkey etc.,we are Great Britain and want a Great British deal,that's why the negotiations are taking place.

pastafarian · May 10, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
I've asked lots of them and on here, which sort of Brexit they want. I've given them the options but they still don't give me the definitive answer. Even the Brexit MPs don't understand the difference with EEA, Shengen and other such nuances, nor can they supply answers to the Irisih border and Gibraltar.

As for handing powers to Brussels, they really don't understand how democracy works.

So come on Brexiteers Norway, Swiss, Canada, Hard Brexit, Soft Brexit, Customs Union, Free Movement etc etc. Please tell us your preferences.

You give us your options........like any good weasel would.Why are you still banging on about Switzerland and Norway, are you stuck in a time loop?
No membership of the Single Market, out of The Customs Union, End the primacy of ECJ, return more law making powers to Westminster, end Free Movement, a new comprehensive bespoke free trade agreement. its not rocket science

daveinprague · May 10, 2018

Silly labels? Bespoke? :lol:

Westdene Seagull · May 10, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
I've asked lots of them and on here, which sort of Brexit they want. I've given them the options but they still don't give me the definitive answer. Even the Brexit MPs don't understand the difference with EEA, Shengen and other such nuances, nor can they supply answers to the Irisih border and Gibraltar.

As for handing powers to Brussels, they really don't understand how democracy works.

So come on Brexiteers Norway, Swiss, Canada, Hard Brexit, Soft Brexit, Customs Union, Free Movement etc etc. Please tell us your preferences.

Hard Brexit if it becomes necessary but at the very minimum no customs union, no freedom of movement and no jurisdiction for the European Court.

daveinprague said:
I didnt say it would unite the country. I said, the divisions it has caused. Divisions that have been made by in some cases with downright lies. What scares you about a 2nd Referendum?

It doesn't particularly just as long as it's a referendum based on us still leaving but choosing between the deal and no deal. EDIT - although I will add I don't think one will be held and I do believe we will leave.

The Clamp · May 10, 2018

Two Professors said:
Companies booking loads of flights a week for different people,no problem.People flying four or five times a week would surely run into insurance problems from the health risks,which have been well known since the mid-2000's.Did Bond work for Mott Macdonald then?Thought he worked for International Exports.The International Events company you worked for must have been mega-busy to have events every week!

I was talking about companies in the first place. I don't know people that go on separate holidays 5 times a week unfortunately! As for health risks I assume they take the job knowing the schedule and probably sign a waiver. In my current role I had to sign a waiver as I do many hours in short periods of time, which brings health risks. I imagine it's a similar setup.
The events company, in some crazy scheme to turn a profit did book events every week, most days in fact. Multiple ones across Europe. They have contracts with Google, Vodaphone, Nestle etc so were busy all year round when I worked for them.
That's really not unusual for large events companies. And there's only about 4 in the U.K that work on that scale so there was plenty of work.
But that's off topic. Your question was answered. Lots of people take lots of flights for lots of reasons.
With that, I'm off to work. Enjoy the evening sun!

pastafarian · May 10, 2018

daveinprague said:
A second referendum wouldnt stop Brexit would it?

Oddly enough when one of the proposed options is reject the withdrawal agreement and therefore simply remain in the EU then yes that second referendum options function is to stop brexit.

daveinprague · May 10, 2018

pastafarian said:
Oddly enough when one of the proposed options is reject the withdrawal agreement and therefore simply remain in the EU then yes that second referendum options function is to stop brexit.

But people who want Brexit would win the vote, surely?

Ernest · May 10, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
I've asked lots of them and on here, which sort of Brexit they want. I've given them the options but they still don't give me the definitive answer. Even the Brexit MPs don't understand the difference with EEA, Shengen and other such nuances, nor can they supply answers to the Irisih border and Gibraltar.

As for handing powers to Brussels, they really don't understand how democracy works.

So come on Brexiteers Norway, Swiss, Canada, Hard Brexit, Soft Brexit, Customs Union, Free Movement etc etc. Please tell us your preferences.

I want a RED , white and BLUE Brexit

#Brexitmeansbrexit

pastafarian · May 10, 2018

daveinprague said:
But people who want Brexit would win the vote, surely?

We already won the vote.

daveinprague · May 10, 2018

pastafarian said:
We already won the vote.

Why backtrack. You know thats not the answer. Brexiteers would surely win a 2nd Referendum despite downright lies that have been fed to 'the people' wouldnt they? Like I said. Youre scared of a second vote.

pastafarian · May 10, 2018

daveinprague said:
Why backtrack. You know thats not the answer. Brexiteers would surely win a 2nd Referendum despite downright lies that have been fed to 'the people' wouldnt they? Like I said. Youre scared of a second vote.

Not backtracking, it is the answer, we already won and the decision was to Leave.
Give me your rough wording of your proposed second referendum, the one that apparently respects the original vote to leave and still has us leaving the EU after it, considering you are saying a second referendum wont stop Brexit.

daveinprague said:
A second referendum wouldnt stop Brexit would it?

Why are you scared of respecting democracy and having the next referendum(to rejoin) after we have left?

melias shoes · May 10, 2018

daveinprague said:
A second referendum wouldnt stop Brexit would it?

Keep clutching those straws Dave.

Thunder Bolt · May 10, 2018

melias shoes said:
No not at all. I'm just sick of remainers telling us that we wanted democracy. Then do the undemocratic task of trying to stop Brexit. I voted leave not for democracy that they bleat on about but to actually leave the EU. Why can't the remainers accept that piece of democracy. After all they love democracy all of a sudden. You're right the world changes and it changed massively 2 years ago. Accept it and move on.

A classic example of not understanding democracy. It is constant and applied to MEPs, and the European Commission just as much as our local districts councils, Parliament and any other public services.
Democracy is not like winning a raffle, and you lost so get over it.

Simster · May 10, 2018

melias shoes said:
No not at all. I'm just sick of remainers telling us that we wanted democracy. Then do the undemocratic task of trying to stop Brexit. I voted leave not for democracy that they bleat on about but to actually leave the EU. Why can't the remainers accept that piece of democracy. After all they love democracy all of a sudden. You're right the world changes and it changed massively 2 years ago. Accept it and move on.

You should really try and understand why remainers can't accept it. We are a parliamentary democracy and yet the Tory party were spooked into a hastily arranged referendum by an ex-stockbroking chancer with a pathological hatred for the EU. The rules of the referendum were not agreed upon, it was in or out. Only a simple majority required to undo 40 years of status quo. I can't think of another democracy where such fundamental decisions are taken based on a simple majority like this. In Switzerland, where referendum are common, they require a double majority for major decisions. There are loads of examples here actually: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_majority I don't think much of the simple majority referendum determining Scottish independence either for exactly the same reasons.

Had a more concrete majority been required, I'd have had more time for Farage when he said "if it's 52-48 then it's far from over". How come it's over when it's close the other way? Based on a campaign of lies from both sides? And where it is possible that a majority would actually no longer want Brexit?

I don't think I'll ever forgive the conservatives for the way they mishandled this. We now have a divided country fighting among ourselves, and it has caused problems even inside the constituent parts of the UK.

Meanwhile I do hope the UK find a way to avoid Brexit and I am living in hope that this happens.

Thunder Bolt · May 10, 2018

pastafarian said:
You give us your options........like any good weasel would.Why are you still banging on about Switzerland and Norway, are you stuck in a time loop?
No membership of the Single Market, out of The Customs Union, End the primacy of ECJ, return more law making powers to Westminster, end Free Movement, a new comprehensive bespoke free trade agreement. its not rocket science

Westdene Seagull said:
Hard Brexit if it becomes necessary but at the very minimum no customs union, no freedom of movement and no jurisdiction for the European Court.

It doesn't particularly just as long as it's a referendum based on us still leaving but choosing between the deal and no deal. EDIT - although I will add I don't think one will be held and I do believe we will leave.

The European Court of Justice is nothing to do with the EU. It was started in 1952, based in Luxembourg, and one of the signatories was Winston Churchill.

It seems some of you see the word European and have a hissy fit.

It is not the European Court of Human Rights.

Thunder Bolt · May 10, 2018

Simster said:
You should really try and understand why remainers can't accept it. We are a parliamentary democracy and yet the Tory party were spooked into a hastily arranged referendum by an ex-stockbroking chancer with a pathological hatred for the EU. The rules of the referendum were not agreed upon, it was in or out. Only a simple majority required to undo 40 years of status quo. I can't think of another democracy where such fundamental decisions are taken based on a simple majority like this. In Switzerland, where referendum are common, they require a double majority for major decisions. There are loads of examples here actually: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Double_majority I don't think much of the simple majority referendum determining Scottish independence either for exactly the same reasons.

Had a more concrete majority been required, I'd have had more time for Farage when he said "if it's 52-48 then it's far from over". How come it's over when it's close the other way? Based on a campaign of lies from both sides? And where it is possible that a majority would actually no longer want Brexit?

I don't think I'll ever forgive the conservatives for the way they mishandled this. We now have a divided country fighting among ourselves, and it has caused problems even inside the constituent parts of the UK.

Nailed it.

daveinprague · May 10, 2018

melias shoes said:
Keep clutching those straws Dave.

No answer? A second referendum wouldnt stop Brexit would it?

daveinprague · May 10, 2018

pastafarian said:
Not backtracking, it is the answer, we already won and the decision was to Leave.
Give me your rough wording of your proposed second referendum, the one that apparently respects the original vote to leave and still has us leaving the EU after it, considering you are saying a second referendum wont stop Brexit.

Why are you scared of respecting democracy and having the next referendum(to rejoin) after we have left?

Im not scared in the slightest mate, but your fear of a second vote after all the lies 'the people' were fed is tangible

My wording? In light of the mistruths, and some downright lies fed to you during the buildup to the referendum, do you still want Brexit.

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[Politics] Brexit

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