The possession footbal we try and play and the boredom factor

Giraffe · May 12, 2014

Possession football only works if you are good at it. We snuck into 6th this year because our defence was generally rock solid. But that was a result of packing the midfield and dropping deep. What this means is that the attacking flair is deprived any real support.

We were incapable of showing any real attacking intent in a large amount of games, and it gradually became a case of hanging on to games until 20-30 minutes to go and then bringing on the flair players with pace to try and win it. Against lesser teams this works, but against the better teams it really didn't.

A big re-think is needed.

We have definitely gone backwards on the pitch. Last season we played some incredible stuff until the end, this season we have flattered to deceive.

BigGully · May 12, 2014

mikeyjh said:
You know there is football that's somewhere between the two right? Being attacking doesn't have to mean kick and rush.

Of course there are different styles of play, but Brighton has a distinct style that suits them, it has offered some success.

The coaches and scouts from academy upwards have encouraged a style of play and type of player required, it doesnt always offer exciting displays but the alternative wouldnt necessarily offer a Derby like display, they perhaps possess a few players that offer that excitement and 'cutting edge' that could turn our style into that style you demand.

Generally the comments here are not analysing our style in that way, its more a view on possession lead football against and more direct style of play.

Ali_rrr · May 12, 2014

All we do is look to cross it anyway when we get into their half to one person in the box who doesn't even win that many headers. We don't actually shoot. I was very surprised at the fact yesterday that all of our players were getting out-strengthed by the Derby players. We are a good team, we just have been so unlucky with everything this year. We'll do a lot better next year.

perseus · May 12, 2014

Possession football is the best form of defence. And it is difficult to argue against that it is better to keep the ball than to attempt a cross or pass that is likely to be intercepted or a shot that will be saved. Except that the % football theory says that most goals come as a result of mistakes and just to get the sheer number of crosses, shots in and one is more likely to go in.

In the Championship, an annoying division, the defences are usually more competent than the attackers. The defences can deal with any number of rotten crosses. Most teams seem to cross from deep a lot and shoot from long range because they cannot get past our first choice full backs. Full backs have got to be fast and nowadays they have to be adequate to deal with deep crosses to the far post as well. We were in bad enough trouble without Bruno, When Greer went off I feared the worst.

beorhthelm · May 12, 2014

perseus said:
Possession football is the best form of defence. And it is difficult to argue against that it is better to keep the ball than to attempt a cross or pass that is likely to be intercepted or a shot that will be saved. Except that the % football theory says that most goals come as a result of mistakes and just to get the sheer number of crosses, shots in and one is more likely to go in.

seems though that you've managed to provide the argument yourself. of course if you are going to put in a poor cross or shot, then it may be worth keeping possession, but then at this level the quality shouldnt be so poor. and what does possession football do for attack if you aren't getting forward, stretching a team or otherwise simply getting the ball into the final third and the box?

kevo · May 12, 2014

It makes me laugh now that people said Poyet's style was "boring"....... then we brought in Oscar....

I loved our style under Poyet, we played possession football with flair and frequently outclassed the opposition. This season, however, it's been incredibly dull - mainly because, conversely, we have tried to mix it up and play more directly (so more misplaced passes and less possession), allied to the fact that OG is a much more defensive-minded manager than Poyet. It will always be boring until he goes.

Who approaches the second leg of a play off needing to turn the tie round and then selects a team and tactics as if we had a lead to defend?

perseus · May 12, 2014

beorhthelm said:
seems though that you've managed to provide the argument yourself. of course if you are going to put in a poor cross or shot, then it may be worth keeping possession, but then at this level the quality shouldnt be so poor. and what does possession football do for attack if you aren't getting forward, stretching a team or otherwise simply getting the ball into the final third and the box?

I don't like % football. But some fans like the hustle and bustle of it. I think we play too much % football as it is.

Passing it around a bit until you find an opening (decision making). A lot of our shots get blocked and do not even register on the stats. I liked it when Vicente dummied the defender committing him to try and block it and then got the shot over the flailing body.

I think it is the second striker that should have this guile. And that is why I did not mind getting rid of Ashley Barnes. Other people see this as hesitation on the part of the striker! And sometimes the bit of trickery is because the striker can only shoot with one foot. To my mind Agustien is either hesitant or does not shoot when the defender can block it easily.

piersa · May 12, 2014

Goring Gull said:
I like the fact we try and control the game but admit it can be dull as dishwater and painfully frustrating however look at the success it has brought Spain.

I don't think it will ever stop being boring though anyway else remember and agree how dull Spain were in the last Euros and yet they still won the competition?

Would you prefer we keep playing like we do or go for a more attacking way of playing like Liverpool?

Spain were/are much better at it and they won the world cup doing it. They are excused. We achieved very little other than frustration.

Captain Sensible · May 12, 2014

Possession football can be great if you play like we did in the opening 20 minutes on Thursday and as we did quite often last season under Gus. Yet too often BHAFC are too slow in the build up, don't get behind the opposition quick enough (they always take a safe sideways rather than the pass out wide behind a full back), most importantly we don't press! If you play the tika taka you HAVE to press high up and hard. We simply don't do it at all! Leo is not fast enough for the high pressing so others need to take over, yet they dont. So the whole thing falls apart. This season more than last year our players have not known what to do with it when the opposition drops back, we don't try to open them up with some quick ball, we just pass it back and start again.
So it's not the style that is wrong, it's the way it's applied.
This is why I must admit I'm not that worried about Oscar leaving.

trueblue · May 12, 2014

I'm broadly in favour of possession football but it's got to be much higher tempo. Also, the big difference between us and the teams that do it well, is that we just don't press players high up the pitch. Derby had all the time in the world yesterday. When Oscar started it looked like that was the plan - get the ball forward quickly, then win it back quickly if we lose it in the opponents' half and play possession football there. But that just fell by the wayside.

Captain Sensible · May 12, 2014

Also we do play far too many long balls up to Leo when we run out of ideas. There is another problem that Leo seems to have forgotten how to hold up the ball and bring someone into play. He seems to want to flick it on with his head and run behind the last defender and he simply hasn't got the pace for it.
I remember the first game he played against arsenal in the fa cup, his hold up play was superb, yet he also had someone near him like barns and too often this season he's been isolated.
So bad posession football mixed with bad long ball play is more an accurate description of our play this year.

Don Quixote · May 12, 2014

This may all change with a new manager. We might score!

PILTDOWN MAN · May 12, 2014

Giraffe said:
We were incapable of showing any real attacking intent in a large amount of games, and it gradually became a case of hanging on to games until 20-30 minutes to go and then bringing on the flair players with pace to try and win it. Against lesser teams this works, but against the better teams it really didn't.

I agree with most of what you say but this point I wouldn't. We took 6 the champions, 4 off Burnley 3 off Wigan 4 off QPR. So not a bad record.

We took 17 points off the other top 6 clubs they collectively took 11

Kevlar · May 12, 2014

the Liverpool manager has based his career on possession football
it is not a contradiction to attacking play
derby kept hold of the ball much better than we did it
they kept coming wave after wave because we just couldn't keep hold of the ball
I do agree we are too slow with the ball but were much the same with Gus
with similar results .
I have been critical of our wide players too few goals and assists
but they are not helped by getting the ball to them too slowly

Frampler · May 12, 2014

Possession football only works in an attacking sense if the attackers not in possession of the ball make runs to create space. For too much of this season our players have been static, leading to the mind-numbing sight of 20 passes between Andrews, Upson and Greer, or a lazy hoof in the direction of an ever-frustrated Ulloa.

I don't think it helps when the guys building the play up from the back are such mediocre passers of the ball, or when defenders are too slow to play a high defensive line: we don't have the right players for the system we are trying to force them into.

e77 · May 12, 2014

I am a firm believer in the old adage league tables don't lie so we deserved 6th place.

However, I see two problems in the way we play:

When we lose the ball we don't start defending quick enough. Derby exploited this.
Ulloa gets no support in the box, especially since Crofts got injured. Nothing wrong with one up front if midfielders help out.

peterward · May 12, 2014

trueblue said:
I'm broadly in favour of possession football but it's got to be much higher tempo. Also, the big difference between us and the teams that do it well, is that we just don't press players high up the pitch. Derby had all the time in the world yesterday. When Oscar started it looked like that was the plan - get the ball forward quickly, then win it back quickly if we lose it in the opponents' half and play possession football there. But that just fell by the wayside.

this.

Derby as awesome as they were in the play offs, were pretty shit under Clough, in walks McLaren with many of the same players, makes a few adjustments and they fly.

quality manager made all the difference

wellquickwoody · May 12, 2014

GT49er said:
Nothing wrong with possession football - it's WHERE we play it (and play it too slowly, but that's because our players aren't as good as Barcelona's). Whilst we're playing tippy tappy comfortably in the space between our penalty area and the centre circle, all that it achieves is giving the other side time to stroll back and arrange their two banks of four perfectly, so that when our attack is finally launched......surprise, surprise, it gets mopped up all too easily.

Ulloa (and our other attacking players) might have a lot more success if they were to get the ball in our opponents' penalty areas BEFORE THEY WERE READY IN TWO BANKS OF FOUR TO DEFEND IT! If, on the other hand, we were playing tippy tappy in the space between the centre circle and THEIR penalty area (like Derby did at times), things might be different................

Spot on!

But that would risk giving the ball away.

Someone should tell OG that having the ball when the final whistle blows does not give your team the 3 points. Putting the ball in your opponents goal gets you the victory.

wellquickwoody · May 12, 2014

Ali_rrr said:
All we do is look to cross it anyway when we get into their half to one person in the box who doesn't even win that many headers. We don't actually shoot. I was very surprised at the fact yesterday that all of our players were getting out-strengthed by the Derby players. We are a good team, we just have been so unlucky with everything this year. We'll do a lot better next year.

Blind faith I guess.

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