[Albion] Davy Propper - I'm sorry

BensGrandad · Sep 18, 2018

I cannot understand people saying he shoud be replaced by Bissouma who looks exciting but loses thd ball in dangerous areas too often . People forget hd is young and learning and will make mistakes while doing so. In the mean time support and get behind Davy.

jackanada · Sep 18, 2018

Just had a chance to catch up on the match. Not being a masochist I just watched the second half.
Very solid game from Davy.

Dorset Seagull · Sep 18, 2018

sussex_guy2k2 said:
It's key that Propper was the one freed up (and kept on) second half and those slight tactical changes brought about our recovery. He's one of the only players we have who consistently, successfully receives the ball in half spaces on the turn and allows us to go at the opposition.

So whilst I agree, he was poor first half (only really Duffy who wasn't), I think that was in part because the midfield 3 simply didn't know what their roles were. The second half shape changes made a massive difference and Propper was absolutely key to that with his movement and technical ability.

I sensed that first half it was all about having a defensive midfield 3 in order to keep it at 0-0 and then be more adventurous later on to get something. The midfield 3 never seemed to have any players further forward to pass to as Solly and Knockeart were too deep to stop the full backs rather than looking to get in behind. This left Murray on his lonesome which is not unfamiliar in away matches. Being behind at half time meant we had to be more adventurous 2nd half which is why we saw much more forward momentum.

dejavuatbtn · Sep 18, 2018

Dorset Seagull said:
I sensed that first half it was all about having a defensive midfield 3 in order to keep it at 0-0 and then be more adventurous later on to get something. The midfield 3 never seemed to have any players further forward to pass to as Solly and Knockeart were too deep to stop the full backs rather than looking to get in behind. This left Murray on his lonesome which is not unfamiliar in away matches. Being behind at half time meant we had to be more adventurous 2nd half which is why we saw much more forward momentum.

Yes, we played three in the middle and the surprise was that we were completely overrun. If the objective was to maintain the status quo in the first half then Bissouma isn’t the guy we want in there. I see him more as an impact sub for away games and get him to run at the opposition from midfield. He is clearly good at that but needs to do it more often.
Whilst Propper had a poor game, it really wasn’t that much worse than the rest. I can’t remember a game where the opposition had so little to do to gain possession. Hughton needs to keep the dvd of the first half and play it to them at least once a week to remind them not to do it again!

Codner pharmaceuticals · Sep 18, 2018

Daily NSC Headlines "Human being slammed after being not perfect every game"

"In news today, a man was found to be human after not being very good for the first 45 mins. Despite an impeccable full season and a full International with Holland, Davy Pröpper didn't play very well in a slightly changed system. Fans are outraged despite a much improved second half and are calling for his head".

The observation that Davy was poor just goes to show how fantastic and what a normally consistent a performer he is. My biggest Davy concern is that he could be nabbed by a top-six club.

rippleman · Sep 18, 2018

Propper was proper crap last night. But surely we can cut him a bit of slack taking into account his performances since he joined us? I can't recall another game he has played for us when he has been proper crap.

First half, all three CMs were shocking. It didn't seem as if any of them knew where they were supposed to be playing. When Gross plays, the other two shield, but nobody seemed to know who was playing in the Gross role last night. It really was a circus.

It's down to the manager now to ensure we get through the season without a repeat of the shocking first half last night.

stss30 · Sep 18, 2018

BensGrandad said:
I cannot understand people saying he shoud be replaced by Bissouma who looks exciting but loses thd ball in dangerous areas too often . People forget hd is young and learning and will make mistakes while doing so. In the mean time support and get behind Davy.

Completely agree BG. Bissouma looks like an exciting young talent but lost the ball on a number of occasions in the Liverpool and Southampton games. Propper is a much more reliable player at this stage, and that's what clubs like us require. Admittedly he was horrific in the first half last night but he was also superb in the Man United game. Has to be first choice still alongside Stephens for me.

sussex_guy2k2 · Sep 18, 2018

One Teddy Maybank said:
Good summary on this thread regarding the tactics, however, I do draw the line on technical ability.

Picks and usually executes good passes, but technically he appears limited when in the penalty area (which is surprising). The header was very poor, and when in a goal scoring position for some reason he freezes and rarely looks like scoring.

He needs to urgently improve in this area IMO.

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I wouldn't necessarily confuse a lack of time in those areas with a lack of technical ability. The simple reality is he rarely plays that role in our team as he's usually one of the two sitters in front of the back four.

I guess, for me personally, I think his ability on the half turn, the ability to pass and the ability to wriggle out of tight spaces are the technical elements I was referring to. There are very few players in our side that possess these abilities or, at the very least, use them as consistently as Propper does.

I agree he needs to improve his efficiency in front of goal. However, I'd also argue that applies to 90% of our side.

BensGrandad · Sep 18, 2018

Like most I would like to see him become more of a goal mouth threat but am grateful for what he does do, generally very efficiently.

dingodan · Sep 18, 2018

Davy Propper is class. He was cr*p first half yesterday. Dale Stephens is class. He was cr*p first half yesterday. Yves Bissouma is class. He was cr*p first half yesterday.

I think it's fair to say the first half yesterday doesn't reflect the talent of the squad, nor will it reflect our performance over the course of a season.

Players have bad games, the fact that we were that bad in the first half yesterday, and got an away point out of the game, is something to be delighted with.

Now lets move on.

One Teddy Maybank · Sep 18, 2018

sussex_guy2k2 said:
I wouldn't necessarily confuse a lack of time in those areas with a lack of technical ability. The simple reality is he rarely plays that role in our team as he's usually one of the two sitters in front of the back four.

I guess, for me personally, I think his ability on the half turn, the ability to pass and the ability to wriggle out of tight spaces are the technical elements I was referring to. There are very few players in our side that possess these abilities or, at the very least, use them as consistently as Propper does.

I agree he needs to improve his efficiency in front of goal. However, I'd also argue that applies to 90% of our side.

Agree, though if you have natural technical ability, time doesn’t come into it, as you do it automatically.

Difference between good and great.....

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sussex_guy2k2 · Sep 19, 2018

One Teddy Maybank said:
Agree, though if you have natural technical ability, time doesn’t come into it, as you do it automatically.

Difference between good and great.....

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I just meant time in those situations. I think goal scoring is a talent in and of itself to a degree. If you spend your time miles away from goal, you aren't likely to be as efficient in front of it as someone who regularly finds themselves in such a position. It's about practice ultimately.

Not that I think he'll end up being a world class, "great" footballer necessarily, just that I think he brings things to our team that few others do at present.

Machiavelli · Sep 19, 2018

sussex_guy2k2 said:
I wouldn't necessarily confuse a lack of time in those areas with a lack of technical ability. The simple reality is he rarely plays that role in our team as he's usually one of the two sitters in front of the back four.

I guess, for me personally, I think his ability on the half turn, the ability to pass and the ability to wriggle out of tight spaces are the technical elements I was referring to. There are very few players in our side that possess these abilities or, at the very least, use them as consistently as Propper does.

I agree he needs to improve his efficiency in front of goal. However, I'd also argue that applies to 90% of our side.

I really like your assessment of Propper, especially re half turn, tight spaces

amexer · Sep 19, 2018

When we are dominating like 2nd half it is easy to look good. It is when under cosh you need your midfielders to perform and chage game. It was here that Propper was so poor on Monday. Needlessly gave ball away for first goal. Lost who he was marking at a corner that nearly cost us and couldnt believe how far wide he was with a header when completly free and unmarked. These along with lots of other times lost or gave away possesion. Considering how many players were of form we did very well to get a point.

Napper · Sep 19, 2018

dingodan said:
. Yves Bissouma is class. He was cr*p first half yesterday.

.

Could well be but no where near seen anything from him to suggest this yet.

Gives the ball away way too much at the moment

Mellotron · Sep 19, 2018

Only Bruno comes close to Propper's class in this squad. When on song (as he was for most of last season) he's a joy to watch.

He had a bad 45 minutes.

One Teddy Maybank · Sep 19, 2018

sussex_guy2k2 said:
I just meant time in those situations. I think goal scoring is a talent in and of itself to a degree. If you spend your time miles away from goal, you aren't likely to be as efficient in front of it as someone who regularly finds themselves in such a position. It's about practice ultimately.

Not that I think he'll end up being a world class, "great" footballer necessarily, just that I think he brings things to our team that few others do at present.

Though arguably if you have technical ability, you should be able to finish.

I do take your point though, and as well as finishing I think movement in the box is a skill in itself.

I am not expecting Propper to play on the shoulder of a he last defender, just show a lot more prowess in front of goal than we have seen so far.

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twickers · Sep 19, 2018

Napper said:
Could well be but no where near seen anything from him to suggest this yet.

Gives the ball away way too much at the moment

Agree, Bissouma must do better in posession. Unfortunately that's resulted in conceding two goals.

One Teddy Maybank · Sep 19, 2018

twickers said:
Agree, Bissouma must do better in posession. Unfortunately that's resulted in conceding two goals.

When was the second one? Certainly did at Liverpool, Propper did for Stains first.

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twickers · Sep 19, 2018

One Teddy Maybank said:
When was the second one? Certainly did at Liverpool, Propper did for Stains first.

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Saints second, Bong ultimately gave the penalty, but unfortunately it started from posession lost by Bissouma.

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