Will we ever know what went wrong?

1066familyman · Dec 14, 2014

El Presidente said:
Poyet wasn't happy with the budget, if he was serious about resigning in March he would have simply walked, instead we went on an unbeaten run until the end of the season.

I suspect it wasn't the first or last time he made such a threat, it's just the only one that TB told us about.

But no one knows what the gross misconduct charge was, although we all have our suspicions. Arguments over budget are clear enough, but there seems to have been more going on than just that. Anyway, Gus is Gus and he was never going to be easy to please, I understand that.

If it had stopped with the Gus debacle then I could have written it off as one of those things, but for mild mannered Oscar to then go the following season after again making the play offs just feels like something is clearly not right at the club.

Horses Arse · Dec 14, 2014

sir albion said:
The club is bigger than his ego and how we're doing has got nothing to do with it.
You like many on here are really not getting it and you can't grasp the fact that when poyet was here we as a club was on the crest of a wave and was always going to have a great 2-3 years when moving to the amex.

People on here really need to get a grip and realise this instead of thinking it's all thanks to poyet...well poyet is a part of what was great and that was all.You get highs and lows and inevitably a low was due at the amex.

The club was on a crest of a wave because of Poyet. Plenty of clubs move into new stadiums and struggle. There was no inevitability about having a great 2-3 years, it was down to Poyet's talent and the way he has with payers. Yes he was egotistical, yes we moaned at times (first half v Watford and playing that Colombian bloody keeper) and yes he was a fool for letting Murray go but that's what you get with talented people. He did amazing things for us and despite appalling behaviour from him toward the end that doesn't take away what he achieved. It may also be the case that he was driven to behave in the way that he did, which is what many are coming around to now with Barber's antics and the subsequent departure of Oscar. It seems to me that Oscar loved the club but was driven out, much in the same way that Poyet was eased out.

Westdene Wonder · Dec 14, 2014

sir albion said:
Why?
Personally are can't stand the bloke and couldn't give a shite about why he was booted out,but he was a nob and obviously wanted out in march.

He's gone thank fack and we've moved on

No lets get it right,we moved DOWN.

thejackal · Dec 14, 2014

Horses Arse said:
The club was on a crest of a wave because of Poyet. Plenty of clubs move into new stadiums and struggle. There was no inevitability about having a great 2-3 years, it was down to Poyet's talent and the way he has with payers. Yes he was egotistical, yes we moaned at times (first half v Watford and playing that Colombian bloody keeper) and yes he was a fool for letting Murray go but that's what you get with talented people. He did amazing things for us and despite appalling behaviour from him toward the end that doesn't take away what he achieved. It may also be the case that he was driven to behave in the way that he did, which is what many are coming around to now with Barber's antics and the subsequent departure of Oscar. It seems to me that Oscar loved the club but was driven out, much in the same way that Poyet was eased out.

100% this. Gus is by far the best manager I've ever known us to have, in 35 years of watching the albion.

Commander · Dec 14, 2014

Horses Arse said:
The club was on a crest of a wave because of Poyet. Plenty of clubs move into new stadiums and struggle. There was no inevitability about having a great 2-3 years, it was down to Poyet's talent and the way he has with payers. Yes he was egotistical, yes we moaned at times (first half v Watford and playing that Colombian bloody keeper) and yes he was a fool for letting Murray go but that's what you get with talented people. He did amazing things for us and despite appalling behaviour from him toward the end that doesn't take away what he achieved. It may also be the case that he was driven to behave in the way that he did, which is what many are coming around to now with Barber's antics and the subsequent departure of Oscar. It seems to me that Oscar loved the club but was driven out, much in the same way that Poyet was eased out.

This.

thejackal said:
100% this. Gus is by far the best manager I've ever known us to have, in 35 years of watching the albion.

And this.

People like to rewrite history, but Poyet was fantastic for us. Yes he had a decent wedge to spend, but so do loads of managers who are unsuccessful. Poyet's League 1 team would take our current team apart.

Westdene Wonder · Dec 14, 2014

kevo said:
OG also made very similar comments when he was in charge. We need to ask why he wanted to leave, as well. It's a shame, because although I was never his biggest fan, I think Oscar could have built something here if he'd stayed another season (health conditions aside). He did very well to get us into the play-offs.

Were both Gus and Oscar aware that there was very little money for players and weighed it up against unrealistic expectations? Or did both just not get on with Barber et al (well, we already know that Gus didn't from his email, when he rightly threw his toys out of the pram over the clackers and sh*tgate).

Perhaps there was resentment over Burke's role in player recruitment (when the Gus thing blew up it was initially because he refused to talk to the players about the retained list - that was when he was suspended. He could have done this simply because he was throwing a hissy fit - or it could have been because he vehemently disagreed about being told which players we could afford to keep on).

We have lost two good managers and now seemingly have a clueless one. Perhaps Bloom likes Hyppia because he's a 'Yes' man and is just there to (hopefully) keep us in the Championship for the time being and not moan about the playing budget.

It is obvious that both managers wanted to improve the team but were not given the necessary cash.
There is too much pressure in getting into the Premiership,Why? unless you are one of the top ten sides the team and supporters are in for a dismal period,Man Utd,Saturday followed on Wednesday by Arsenal but an easier game next week its only Spurs.
Lets build a good top half of the Championship table team which would provide us with entertaining matches and keep us in a safe financial situation,ask Bolton supporters if they now think that promotion to the top tier was a good thing,you could also ask the three teams promoted to the Premiership last season.

dejavuatbtn · Dec 14, 2014

Whilst I agree that Poyet was one of our better managers there is no doubt that he wanted a say in every decision made within the club, from kit design to player transfers in and out. Bloom obviously has a business plan that he wants to work to and this doesn't include his manager running the whole show, and dorsn't include consulting the fans on it. Unfortunately Gus threw his toys out of the pram too many times for Bloom's liking.
I just hope that Bloom's ego is not the undoing of the progress he and the club has made in recent years.

kevo · Dec 14, 2014

Westdene Wonder said:
It is obvious that both managers wanted to improve the team but were not given the necessary cash.
There is too much pressure in getting into the Premiership,Why? unless you are one of the top ten sides the team and supporters are in for a dismal period,Man Utd,Saturday followed on Wednesday by Arsenal but an easier game next week its only Spurs.
Lets build a good top half of the Championship table team which would provide us with entertaining matches and keep us in a safe financial situation,ask Bolton supporters if they now think that promotion to the top tier was a good thing,you could also ask the three teams promoted to the Premiership last season.

It's not necessarily always the case though. Look at Swansea and Southampton.

topbanana36 · Dec 14, 2014

mune ni kamome said:
Yes, it all started with Gus' comments about reaching the ceiling and everyone thought it was the start of GP making the first noises to leave for better offers. Maybe he wasn't the villain of the piece at all.

Villain of the piece when he had led the club to touching distance of the premiership I don't think so. We have moved on but look what we have moved onto at present.

Mutts Nuts · Dec 14, 2014

Dub-67 said:
Will we ever know what went wrong? I'm sure non disclosure contracts were signed... Will the true story ever get out?
I backed the club during the Poyet debacle.. but hasnt he since been proved correct? Whatever it was that was winding him up about out club is still there and has sucked us into a downward spiral that show no signs of stopping. What the hell went on?
Until we know we are poisoned.

We all know where it went wrong ,it was when we gave Murray to the scum and did not replace him. It was obvious that McSmudger was shit after only a couple of months ,all that we lacked were goal scoring strikers, now though the squad needs a complete rebuild from shit keeper to shit strikers that can`t score in this division :albion2:

Mutts Nuts · Dec 14, 2014

kevo said:
It's not necessarily always the case though. Look at Swansea and Southampton.

The Scummers kept their leading goal scorer we gave ours away,that has cost the club dearly in lost PL revenue

kevo · Dec 14, 2014

Mutts Nuts said:
The Scummers kept their leading goal scorer we gave ours away,that has cost the club dearly in lost PL revenue

Point I was trying to make was it is possible for 'smaller' club's to get promoted to the PL and make a decent job of staying there.

marshy68 · Dec 14, 2014

Uncle Spielberg said:
With 1 win in 17 games and 12 points it is now looking like gross negligence from Bloom 5 points adrift of 5th bottom with some very tough games in the next month, it may well be too late now if/when he finally does something , and to think Poyet was drummed out for " gross misconduct " mmmm

That team should have won the league at a canter 19 draws and we finished 4th bloom gambled on promotion gave poyet the cash to deliver and he didnt. GP probay knew there was no cash left....

kevo · Dec 15, 2014

marshy68 said:
That team should have won the league at a canter 19 draws and we finished 4th bloom gambled on promotion gave poyet the cash to deliver and he didnt. GP probay knew there was no cash left....

Well we had the 8th biggest player wage budget that season, so in one sense Gus overachieved. You are right about the draws though - the number of games we dominated but didn't win was staggering (anyone remember Bolton at home...?!). It changed when Ulloa joined. If only we'd had him from the start of the season, we'd have walked it.

Mutts Nuts · Dec 15, 2014

kevo said:
Point I was trying to make was it is possible for 'smaller' club's to get promoted to the PL and make a decent job of staying there.

My point is we will never get there all the while we are a selling club

Tony Meolas Loan Spell · Dec 15, 2014

Uncle Spielberg said:
We were discussing this in the pub yesterday and no one can believe Hyypia is still at the club, he should have gone 2 months ago. It may be too late now

It should have been at the first intl break in mid september thats when I could see things were not right.

I hate being proved right.

TWOCHOICEStom · Dec 15, 2014

Tony Meolas Loan Spell said:
It should have been at the first intl break in mid september thats when I could see things were not right.

I hate being proved right.

You do seem to bloody love going on about being right though.

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