Time to abolish single faith schools

cunning fergus · Jun 7, 2017

Honky Tonx said:
Single faith schools do not promote integration, hinder Children from mixing with Children from different faiths, different religions and different cultures. When I was at School we all got along and made friends with Jews, Muslims, Buddhists and Christians alike. We played together, ate together and shared class rooms with each other. We even went to each other's homes. If we want our Children to grow up living side by side in some kind of peaceful existence, then I honestly believe that single faith schools need to be abolished. There is no need for them. What good do they do? Children need to socialise and integrate.

I think you are barking up the wrong tree, if you really want our children growing up living side by side peacefully then you need to abolish the way Islam is practised in this country.

That is the problem that needs to be reformed, and its root cause is not a school related issue.

Islam in the UK needs its King James Bible moment.......the Govt needs to licence all mosques and Imams (in a similar way to pubs), and with the involvement of moderate British Muslim scholars recast the doctrine of the Koran and Islamism so that it can much integrate easily into a modern western liberal democracy.

No separation of sexes in the mosque, no misogyny, no burkas, no denigration of homosexual or women's rights etc.

Licensed mosques and imams will be required to celebrate western liberal values via the new recast Koran, failure to do so will mean its shut down and the building sold for housing.

The moderate muslims in this country appear to need help, they would surely support this action to reform Islam to orientate it into a western context.

Those that don't want to worship Islam this way would be free to find another country that fits in with their view.

pastafarian · Jun 7, 2017

cunning fergus said:
I think you are barking up the wrong tree, if you really want our children growing up living side by side peacefully then you need to abolish the way Islam is practised in this country.

That is the problem that needs to be reformed, and its root cause is not a school related issue.

Islam in the UK needs its King James Bible moment.......the Govt needs to licence all mosques and Imams (in a similar way to pubs), and with the involvement of moderate British Muslim scholars recast the doctrine of the Koran and Islamism so that it can much integrate easily into a modern western liberal democracy.

No separation of sexes in the mosque, no misogyny, no burkas, no denigration of homosexual or women's rights etc.

Licensed mosques and imams will be required to celebrate western liberal values via the new recast Koran, failure to do so will mean its shut down and the building sold for housing.

The moderate muslims in this country appear to need help, they would surely support this action to reform Islam to orientate it into a western context.

Those that don't want to worship Islam this way would be free to find another country that fits in with their view.

You are wrong here.......after the recent attacks moderate muslims are indeed queuing up to make their religion more UK friendly and accept their holy book is flawed in many areas if you want to be compatible with western ideals...........oh wait

Tyrone Biggums · Jun 7, 2017

Governments would never do it. Private schools help ease the burden on the state ran schools. Especially financially.

Wilko · Jun 7, 2017

In a world trying to move to equality and integration I find it bizarre that schools can limit themselves to a single faith, it makes no sense to me at all. I went myself to a Roman Catholic school and although the teaching and standards were high, the blinkered view of the world and science was alarming, I also only mixed with white middle class catholic kids, I think I had 2 black kids in my school. I now work in International schools and find it absolutely superb, my Sociology class has Christians, Muslims, Atheists, 2 Jewish kids, one Buddhist and a Sikh, now if you want a proper discussion on religion and ethics this is the environment to dot it imho!

As a teacher I have also been interested in some jobs until the specification states that ´In your role you must apply the strong Christian values of the school at all time´, I am going to be really pedantic, stir the pot a bit and say that as an atheist am I not being discriminated against here?

Lower West Stander · Jun 7, 2017

Tyrone Biggums said:
Governments would never do it. Private schools help ease the burden on the state ran schools. Especially financially.

I suspect this is very close to the truth. But it's not really private schools, but faith based ones.

The government is willing to accept silly faith based admissions policies in return for church funding which is money they don't have to find.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Tyrone Biggums · Jun 7, 2017

Wilko said:
As a teacher I have also been interested in some jobs until the specification states that ´In your role you must apply the strong Christian values of the school at all time´, I am going to be really pedantic, stir the pot a bit and say that as an atheist am I not being discriminated against here?

Not discrimination, a skill/background required for that specific role.

Tyrone Biggums · Jun 7, 2017

Lower West Stander said:
I suspect this is very close to the truth. But it's not really private schools, but faith based ones.

The government is willing to accept silly faith based admissions policies in return for church funding which is money they don't have to find.

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Most education institutions have some requirements.

Universities discriminate all the time based on intelligence, gender, social status.

I'd be more worried about the health of the university system than junior schools. Western Universities are becoming seats of unlearning.

The Kid Frankie · Jun 7, 2017

The Large One said:
Maybe. But all the while there are religious faiths, it's more prudent to be told about who believes what and why. It's better to have an appreciation of the next person's belief system (even if you do think it's bollocks) than to live in total ignorance of it. To be in ignorance of it only ever breeds hatred.

Put it this way, there are still some people out there who think Islam has no place in the UK. If that was the case, for the very same reason, nor does Christianity, Judaism, Buddhism and football.

I'm not saying live in ignorance of Religion. I am saying we should be teaching the basic practices of all mainstream religions, as well as Agnosticism and Atheism. Naturally I lean heavily on the side of the latter, hence my offer.

beorhthelm · Jun 7, 2017

Wilko said:
As a teacher I have also been interested in some jobs until the specification states that ´In your role you must apply the strong Christian values of the school at all time´, I am going to be really pedantic, stir the pot a bit and say that as an atheist am I not being discriminated against here?

yes you are and i'm surprised they put that. they'd probably argue they are not asking you to be Christian, only to apply "Christian values", but its implied that only Christians should apply.

Wilko · Jun 7, 2017

beorhthelm said:
yes you are and i'm surprised they put that. they'd probably argue they are not asking you to be Christian, only to apply "Christian values", but its implied that only Christians should apply.

I may ask them if that includes misogynistic views towards female students and an intolerance to any homosexual pupils.

Herr Tubthumper · Jun 7, 2017

Tyrone Biggums said:
Universities discriminate all the time based on intelligence.

Isn't that the point of universities though?

Mattywerewolf · Jun 7, 2017

Wilko said:
In a world trying to move to equality and integration I find it bizarre that schools can limit themselves to a single faith, it makes no sense to me at all. I went myself to a Roman Catholic school and although the teaching and standards were high, the blinkered view of the world and science was alarming, I also only mixed with white middle class catholic kids, I think I had 2 black kids in my school. I now work in International schools and find it absolutely superb, my Sociology class has Christians, Muslims, Atheists, 2 Jewish kids, one Buddhist and a Sikh, now if you want a proper discussion on religion and ethics this is the environment to dot it imho!

As a teacher I have also been interested in some jobs until the specification states that ´In your role you must apply the strong Christian values of the school at all time´, I am going to be really pedantic, stir the pot a bit and say that as an atheist am I not being discriminated against here?

I would agree if it said Christian beliefs. Christian values are probably something you would regard as normal 'good person' values, unless they have specified otherwise.

For what its worth the single faith schools I have seen are required to have certain percentage of non faith pupils (10% minimum I think), fund a large part of the school themselves, and are generally high performing. For that reason many parents suddenly dig out a grandparent of that faith and start attending Sunday school or the like to get their children in. It all becomes a bit of a game, but the provision of these high performing schools takes the burden off the state system given the faiths high level of funding. Perhaps losing these would make the schooling situation even more critical?

Wilko · Jun 7, 2017

Mattywerewolf said:
I would agree if it said Christian beliefs. Christian values are probably something you would regard as normal 'good person' values, unless they have specified otherwise.

Why have the word Christian at all though? Apply good values to the school works.

Tyrone Biggums · Jun 7, 2017

Herr Tubthumper said:
Isn't that the point of universities though?

If you see some of the rubbish coming from universities these days it would seem not.

Albumen · Jun 7, 2017

Religion should be an option for theological study following a basic understanding of all faiths in our multicultural society, not one hotchpotched idea of a deity rammed down their throats, and definitely definitely not a bloody pre-requisite for their kid joining a school.

Mattywerewolf · Jun 7, 2017

Wilko said:
Why have the word Christian at all though? Apply good values to the school works.

I guess because they are funding a large part of the school and want to justify it to the Board of Directors

deena_gold · Jun 7, 2017

How about abolishing 'faith' in schools completely and set about teaching quantum science from the age of about 8 onward, you can teach the basics of quantum science to an 8 year old and they will start asking questions and thinking about things as they really are. More so they will start becoming skeptical of 'faith' the more they question, the more they will leave that convenient 'black box' called faith behind, and we will have evolved a step further.

'Oh it's my faith, I can't discuss that' - how convenient, how convenient.

jaghebby · Jun 7, 2017

Would that include Hogwarts?

Seriously though I am reminded of the quite from Victor Hugo “There is in every village a torch - the teacher; and an extinguisher - the priest.” Think that about sums it up religion should have no place in education as it really pretty much akin to teaching children that fairy stories are fact!

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