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David Moyes to be SACKED over comments



J

joeinbrighton

New member
Nov 20, 2012
1,853
Brighton
wellquickwoody said:
Wow! You really are the epitome of 'offended on someone else's behalf'. Well done for taking it to a new level.
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Where have I said anywhere that I was offended?

I refer you to my earlier post - "I felt that what Moyes said was crass but I only feel he should be sacked on the basis of having done an utterly incompetent job as Sunderland manager this season".

I do, however, find some of the attitudes towards women working in football or watching football quite unpleasant in 2017 and I don't think this episode is going to help matters very much.
 




S

Spicy

We're going up.
Dec 18, 2003
6,038
London
joeinbrighton said:
Yes I did listen to it and actually it changed how I thought about it.

When I first read a summary of what Moyes said, I thought it was a bit of an overreaction and that it was Moyes being clumsy in what he said.

Listening to it, yes it is clear that Moyes' tone is jocular and on the surface, he is trying to give the impression that the words are in jest.

However, the words along the lines of "do that again and you will get a slap even though you are a woman" and "be careful if you want to come back here again", there is something unpleasant about even thinking it is appropriate to say that in the context of a joke. It is belittling in tone, almost saying "who do you think you are asking me these questions?" or "don't have the temerity to ask me a difficult question".

I work in an office where most of my colleagues are women. Like any office, there is banter and repartee between colleagues. Would I say to a colleague "you are asking for a slap" if they were pushing their luck though? No, because that crosses a boundary I think of what is acceptable to say to a female colleague in a professional environment. David Moyes is not a colleague of Vicki Sparks', but he is talking to her in a professional capacity and so he should really follow the same guidelines on how he interacts with her.

These types of incidents are scrutinised a lot more now than they were before the days of 24 hour news media and so there is a natural tendency to think everything is blown out of proportion. But with that, people should also know that they are more likely to be picked up on stuff and moderate what they say and how they behave.

The unspoken issue with this is that a lot of people that will dismiss this as a storm in a teacup are possibly subconsciously thinking "what business has a woman got asking David Moyes that question?". One only needs to go on Twitter and realise that there are plenty of people out there who think like this and who think it acceptable to air those viewpoints on social media, not caring that they are sharing those thoughts with the Twittosphere.
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I agree that Moyes' tone was unpleasant but don't think it was sexist. He should expect to be asked questions about why his team are bottom, etc, etc, and the reporters, whether male or female, are only doing their jobs so to be warned that they should "be careful if you want to come back here again" is IMO unacceptable. I am never short of something to say so might well have responded with "well I won't love if you manage your team properly and get them off the bottom".
 


J

joeinbrighton

New member
Nov 20, 2012
1,853
Brighton
Spicy said:
I agree that Moyes' tone was unpleasant but don't think it was sexist. He should expect to be asked questions about why his team are bottom, etc, etc, and the reporters, whether male or female, are only doing their jobs so to be warned that they should "be careful if you want to come back here again" is IMO unacceptable. I am never short of something to say so might well have responded with "well I won't love if you manage your team properly and get them off the bottom".
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There was an exchange last week between Paul Ince and Jacqui Oatley on the Spain-France friendly where they were discussion the TV replays being used to overturn incorrect decisions. Ince, being somewhat old school, was opposed to it because he felt it would slow the game down and sanitise things.

Anyway, he and Oatley got into a bit of a debate about it and at the end of the conversation he referred to her as "love". Oatley being the smart cookie she is responded by saying something along the lines of "OK dear" and gave as good as she got.

I don't think there was any issue between the 2 of them, I think they get on well not least because Ince used to play for Oatley's beloved Wolves. But the incident did serve generally to make Paul Ince look a bit of a plank.
 


Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
65,454
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
wellquickwoody said:
People are having a discussion about a topic that is in the press currently. The fact the event happened some time ago is immaterial, it is currently part of the news headlines. Now if you have no interest in the topic.......
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Stop trying to wind people up, because you're not very good at it. Moyes hasn't been sacked, hence the reference to the timeline.
My comments, should you care to read them properly, is that he wasn't professional. Your comment about the reporter being bitchy says more about your attitudes than hers.
 


Bold Seagull

Bold Seagull

strong and stable with me, or...
Mar 18, 2010
29,789
Hove
Thunder Bolt said:
Stop trying to wind people up, because you're not very good at it. Moyes hasn't been sacked, hence the reference to the timeline.
My comments, should you care to read them properly, is that he wasn't professional. Your comment about the reporter being bitchy says more about your attitudes than hers.
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Quite. Given Moyes unreservedly apologised, and said his own behaviour was unacceptable - it seems most people getting upset on other people's behalf is whoever thinks he didn't really do anything wrong.
 




S

Spicy

We're going up.
Dec 18, 2003
6,038
London
joeinbrighton said:
There was an exchange last week between Paul Ince and Jacqui Oatley on the Spain-France friendly where they were discussion the TV replays being used to overturn incorrect decisions. Ince, being somewhat old school, was opposed to it because he felt it would slow the game down and sanitise things.

Anyway, he and Oatley got into a bit of a debate about it and at the end of the conversation he referred to her as "love". Oatley being the smart cookie she is responded by saying something along the lines of "OK dear" and gave as good as she got.

I don't think there was any issue between the 2 of them, I think they get on well not least because Ince used to play for Oatley's beloved Wolves. But the incident did serve generally to make Paul Ince look a bit of a plank.
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Well I think that is fair enough and Jacqui Oatley is right and that is a good example. Moyes is obviously frustrated but should not be taking it out on reporters. I think we get caught up too easily in what is sexist or not these days - I have often said to a male colleague "go away or I will give you a slap" and he hasn't been offended, and I don't believe the reporter in this case was offended either from what I have heard.
 




Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
65,454
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
GT49er said:
We don't.

However, some people have decided they have a right and a duty to be offended on her behalf. They presumably don't know whether or not she was offended either, but hey, that's beside the point to them!
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On the contrary, most of the posters on this thread, and the 'who is going down' thread aren't offended on her behalf. The most common opinion is that it is unprofessional.
It can be banter between mates, but not in a workplace situation, even if you know the person well. There is a big difference.
There are some posters who like to think that people are being offended, so they can then post their own biased views and show us how 'cool' and laid back they are.
 




G

Greg Bobkin

Silver Seagull
May 22, 2012
14,847
wellquickwoody said:
Not a professional question in my view, a bitchy childish question designed to get a reaction, which it did.
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Well then she's done her job! In a world of constant social media, it's even more difficult for actual trained reporters to get an angle or something out of a story that hasn't already been said. One of the first rules of journalism is to keep it simple and she asked a relatively simple question. All he had to do was answer her and not accuse her of being 'cheeky'!

It smacks of Trump who can't seem to handle difficult questions from the press and actively seeks out people who will give him an easy ride. The question to Moyes was fair enough – I'm not sure whether a male journalist would've got the same reaction, but plenty of others have when managers have spat their dummies out – LVG, Harry 'Wheeler Dealer' Redknapp' and José to name just three. I agree there has to be respect on both sides (not asking the same question again and again as the likes of Paxman and John Humpries do, the latter sometimes because he hasn't listened to the original answer), but ALL she was doing was asking a question. That's her job :shrug:
 


J

jfs

Member
Jul 6, 2003
121
Brighton
Tyrone Biggums said:
How you get xenophobe from that boggles the mind. You must be in a constant state of being offended.

As someone who is neither British nor African it sounds a lot like he's referring to a playing style. One which would indicate wanting players to throw themselves about a bit more and play a more physical style of football(which is less common in African football and more common in British). Because you know, different nations play with different styles...

Or is that xenophobic these days to say countries play different styles to each other?
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If he meant more physical then he should have said more physical, he is stereotyping based on nationality or colour ...
 


wellquickwoody

wellquickwoody

Many More Voting Years
NSC Patron
Aug 10, 2007
13,622
Melbourne
Thunder Bolt said:
Stop trying to wind people up, because you're not very good at it. Moyes hasn't been sacked, hence the reference to the timeline.
My comments, should you care to read them properly, is that he wasn't professional. Your comment about the reporter being bitchy says more about your attitudes than hers.
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Not trying to wind anyone up, just you keep on about how Ernest is winding em in but you keep posting yourself :shrug:
 








Publius Ovidius

Publius Ovidius

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
46,019
at home
Bold Seagull said:
Moyes unreservedly apologised. If he is an honest man, then he too believes his behaviour wasn't acceptable. Why are people defending it, if Moyes himself has accepted it was wrong?
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I think because now the press and media have cottoned on they scent blood and I expect this to hit the " he must be sacked and publicly disgraced " stand at any time soon.
 




smudge

smudge

Up the Albion!
Jul 8, 2003
7,368
On the ocean wave
looney said:
This is just fake news lapped up by soft sops. He is not responsible for the behaviour of other men any more than you can be hung out to dry for using capital letters like Hitler did. This is weak identity politics, try and rise above the mindless way of thinking.

He is joking she is laughing, no crime has been committed. And if Sunderland are stupid enough to give him a job after he buggered up Manure then more fool them.
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Watched it a few times today, & I really don't think he was joking at all. He was trying to be quite threatening, especially with his final remark, "Be careful when you come in here, just be careful". He was not joking at all.

I would hate it if we ever had a manager like that. Can you imagine CH acting like that?
 


N

NooBHA

Well-known member
Jan 13, 2015
8,584
One other thing overlooked in this discussion

The BBC and Sky and BT Sport pay mega bucks to clubs nowadays. Part of those fees are for them to be able to interview the Managers afterwards and to pay good money for a ''slap in the face'' is probably not what they intended their money to be used for.
 




trueblue

trueblue

Well-known member
Jul 5, 2003
10,381
Hove
It's very poor behaviour from David Moyes but it's nothing to do with sexism. Male football reporters have all come up against the same type of attitude at some point. Those that haven't aren't doing their job properly.
 






Brightonfan1983

Brightonfan1983

Tiny member
Jul 5, 2003
4,807
UK
jfs said:
In this season alone, he dropped Ndong because he "needed more Britishness in the middle", said he had lot of work to do on training ground to get "more Britishness" into Djilobodji, was pleased that Gibson "gives us a bit of Britishness" and claimed that "there's a Britishness about night games".
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Their message board on the matter is full of very 'British' black humour. Moyes' would approve:

https://www.readytogo.net/smb/threads/more-britishness.1342586/

"There was a period in the 1st half where I kept an eye on Rodwell and he didn't touch the ball for 15 minutes - thank God he's British though."

"The man is a complete clown. Our midfield 5 consisted of an Irishman, a Swede, an Italian and a Belgian. The only 'Brit' has less spine than a jellyfish."

"Just sack this embarrassing f^ckwit of a manager. What an absolute f^cking tool Moyes is."
 


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