[Albion] Solly March untouchable ?

sussex_guy2k2 · Sep 2, 2018

Aveacarlin' said:
BBC reporter saw it very differently to you and I have to agree. He was given MotM as well.......

Murray stars for resilient Brighton

Form going into this game suggested it would be a contest between evenly matched sides, and so it proved as the hosts levelled the scores with six minutes remaining.

Manchester United (twice), Arsenal and Tottenham have all visited the Amex Stadium since Hughton's side last lost at home in the Premier League - a hefty 4-0 reverse to Chelsea - on 20 January.

That resilience had led to Hughton largely keeping faith with the players that ensured top-flight survival last season; of 10 summer signings only Spanish defender Martin Montoya made the starting XI.

Murray was one of those key performers last season. He proved his worth again here in a performance just about running the fine line between combative and undisciplined as he scored for the second home league game in succession.

His nuisance value unnerved the visiting defenders throughout, winning Brighton's first penalty and almost adding to his tally of two goals on three other occasions.

While his late foul on Seri was unwise when already on a booking, his contribution ultimately proved the difference between defeat and a valuable point.

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I don't deny the last bit. His contribution to decisive moments was the difference ultimately and I'm not debating that. And anyone that has read my previous posts would know I rate Murray very highly for what he brings to the team. But one BBC reporter's opinion doesn't make me wrong either. When the Murray MOTM award was announced there was noticeable laughter around my section of the North Stand and everyone around me was questioning it too, so I'm obviously not the only one I thought his all round game wasn't at his usual standards.

For example, his passing was all over the place I thought. If he completed even 50% of his passes today I'd be surprised. He missed a couple of glorious headed chances where he didn't even get the ball on target from good positions and without any pressure (one being straight after the missed penalty). He committed a fair few fouls which slowed attacks down and often went down far too easily under the slightest hint of pressure, often looking for a free kick that wasn't forthcoming (and in total contrast to Mitrovic who was strong throughout and gave Dunk and Duffy a torrid afternoon). In fairness to him, he did seem to win his share in the air, but his hold up play was not as good as usual and consequently there were a share of those headers which went to no one and meant we lost the ball and momentum.

So yeh... whilst I appreciate he was decisive (although he scored a penalty and a tap in that he nearly contrived to miss after all of Knockaert's good work, so it wasn't exactly like the decisive moments were all his own doing!), I don't think his all round game today was up to his usual standards, even if the highlights would've suggested otherwise... it's constructive criticism, of one performance, nothing more and nothing less. I'm not exactly crying out for him to be dropped. Although I thought his treatment of March was a bit pathetic, if I'm being honest and I imagine contributed to March's missed opportunity not soon after.

TSB · Sep 2, 2018

You know nothing John Snow.

Aveacarlin' · Sep 2, 2018

sussex_guy2k2 said:
I don't deny the last bit. His contribution to decisive moments was the difference ultimately and I'm not debating that. And anyone that has read my previous posts would know I rate Murray very highly for what he brings to the team. But one BBC reporter's opinion doesn't make me wrong either. When the Murray MOTM award was announced there was noticeable laughter around my section of the North Stand and everyone around me was questioning it too, so I'm obviously not the only one I thought his all round game wasn't at his usual standards.

No one is saying it makes you wrong but it highlights that others do not necessarily share your views - me being one of them. I'm in the NS too and when MotM was announced it was met with applause. I certainly didn't hear or see anyone questioning it or laughing for that matter.

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the right footed denilson · Sep 2, 2018

He was decent in the first half, not so in the second but eventually Jose will be back to replace him if he fades. Think he has found a bit of form after a poor start the season.

PILTDOWN MAN · Sep 2, 2018

Captain Sensible said:
I thought March had a good game. Yes he missed one chance, but then again so do all players. For the first 20 mins March was the best player on the pitch.

Please remind me of a dangerous cross, pass or shot he had in that period

One Teddy Maybank · Sep 2, 2018

The Kid Frankie said:
Just about sums up modern football when so many are so quick to have a pop at one of of the two local lads we have in our side. The same player who scored the goal that promoted us. On top of that I think he actually had a good game.

Where players come from is completely irrelevant, as is previous contributions, you should only judge players at the level they are playing at.

His crossing was poor.

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One Teddy Maybank · Sep 2, 2018

In fairness to [MENTION=28213]suusex_guy2k2[/MENTION] he is a Murray supporter normally.

However, I would also disagree in that I thought Murray led the line well, given the minimal support he had from Gross, and poor delivery from March particularly.

It was only when we played higher with Bissouma did we finally get players around him.

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The Kid Frankie · Sep 2, 2018

One Teddy Maybank said:
Where players come from is completely irrelevant, as is previous contributions, you should only judge players at the level they are playing at.

His crossing was poor.

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I agree his crossing was poor and he should have at least hit the target for his one on one.

No one should be immune from criticism.

My point is there are posters on here just being snide rather that critical.

One Teddy Maybank · Sep 2, 2018

The Kid Frankie said:
I agree his crossing was poor and he should have at least hit the target for his one on one.

No one should be immune from criticism.

My point is there are posters on here just being snide rather that critical.

Sorry, don’t agree. None of us want him to fail, and as Watford his touch was excellent, defensive work has improved, but he needs to deliver crosses otherwise he doesn’t warrant a place IMO.

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samtheseagull · Sep 2, 2018

drew said:
Going forward, Suttner is head and shoulders above Bong. Bernardo had one game and is seemingly dumped by CH yet he had to switch from left to right!

So you are saying Suttner is head and shoulders above Bong even tho our manager (who use to be a fullback) watches them every day in training, seen them in countless games etc and still picks Bong? So is CH completely wrong and you seem to be able to judge a player better than him?

samtheseagull · Sep 2, 2018

sussex_guy2k2 said:
His all round game was very poor. The fact he was decisive with a penalty and an easy finish and he potentially dived for a penalty (all decisive moments, I must confess), shouldn’t overlook the fact that he didn’t do a lot of basics right today.

He’ll play much better and not score, put it that way. Although I guess we’d all take decisive but not on it most days of the week week.

This is brilliant. What are you on mate

Triggaaar · Sep 2, 2018

I thought he started really well. His crossing wasn't good, but that applies to Gross (unusually) and Bong too.

His effort on goal was really poor. He lost his composure, perhaps because he's not found himself in those positions often enough to take it in his stride, but he's going to be more annoyed about that miss this morning than any of us.

I thought Knocky did well too. Served it on a plate to Murray.

Drumstick · Sep 2, 2018

This is me said:
can’t beat his man

He regularly beats his man, he often also gets in some great balls into the box.

You must be watching a different match!

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Cozzy · Sep 2, 2018

Solly has improved a lot in parts of his game , but others he has stood still in his development. He clearly has improved his defensive contribution & puts in a shift in getting back to support the LB but he needs to work on his attacking side more with his crossing lacking accuracy & his shooting has that panic look about it rather than coolness.

Overall still think he has what it takes but I lean towards him being a no.10 more than a winger over time ... he could learn a lot from how Gross does that role

Mo Gosfield · Sep 2, 2018

When Solly March first broke into the side, we accepted that he was young and learning. We saw the potential. We saw a left sided player who looked capable of beating a man in a small space and whipping in a delivery from the by-line. We accepted the overhit crosses, free-kicks and corners. He will learn, mature and adapt. He will learn when to cross, when to check back. The hundreds of hours of practise will hone and improve his skills, crossing on the run or from a deadball. It is an art, a skill, a feel is needed when to cushion the ball, when to fade it, when to drive it in.
We are a few years on now and Solly is no longer a boy. He is approaching his football maturity and we have to ask the question as to whether his all round game has advanced to the level required. Maybe we have to accept that he has never had the feel and touch to be able to cross accurately, to pick out a player with precision. The inaccuracy is still too regular. He still shows the ability to beat people and cause problems but ultimately a lot of his decision making is awry. Talented as he is, maybe we just have to accept that he lacks that little bit extra. That footballing nous, that split second decision making process, that defines a player.
Solly excites and frustrates ( similar to Knockaert ) but the PL demands simple, quick, accurate football and at the moment there is too much waste amongst the occasional good stuff.

One Teddy Maybank · Sep 2, 2018

Mo Gosfield said:
When Solly March first broke into the side, we accepted that he was young and learning. We saw the potential. We saw a left sided player who looked capable of beating a man in a small space and whipping in a delivery from the by-line. We accepted the overhit crosses, free-kicks and corners. He will learn, mature and adapt. He will learn when to cross, when to check back. The hundreds of hours of practise will hone and improve his skills, crossing on the run or from a deadball. It is an art, a skill, a feel is needed when to cushion the ball, when to fade it, when to drive it in.
We are a few years on now and Solly is no longer a boy. He is approaching his football maturity and we have to ask the question as to whether his all round game has advanced to the level required. Maybe we have to accept that he has never had the feel and touch to be able to cross accurately, to pick out a player with precision. The inaccuracy is still too regular. He still shows the ability to beat people and cause problems but ultimately a lot of his decision making is awry. Talented as he is, maybe we just have to accept that he lacks that little bit extra. That footballing nous, that split second decision making process, that defines a player.
Solly excites and frustrates ( similar to Knockaert ) but the PL demands simple, quick, accurate football and at the moment there is too much waste amongst the occasional good stuff.

Great post Mo.

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sussex_guy2k2 · Sep 2, 2018

Aveacarlin' said:
No one is saying it makes you wrong but it highlights that others do not necessarily share your views - me being one of them. I'm in the NS too and when MotM was announced it was met with applause. I certainly didn't hear or see anyone questioning it or laughing for that matter.

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And that's fair enough. I never questioned anyone else's right to an opinion - just that not everyone shares yours and the BBC reporter's either. We disagree, and that's fair enough. Simple question though... take away the goals, and are you happy with his performance?

Mo Gosfield · Sep 2, 2018

Cozzy said:
Solly has improved a lot in parts of his game , but others he has stood still in his development. He clearly has improved his defensive contribution & puts in a shift in getting back to support the LB but he needs to work on his attacking side more with his crossing lacking accuracy & his shooting has that panic look about it rather than coolness.

Overall still think he has what it takes but I lean towards him being a no.10 more than a winger over time ... he could learn a lot from how Gross does that role

Most players can improve their game defensively. It is at the other end of the pitch that improvement is most critical. Creativity is vital. Without it, you have nothing. Very few players can run 50-60 yards with the ball, beating 4-5 men, before blasting home. Strikers need accurate service. Our approach play, as a side, is often very good. Our delivery in is poor. Neither March nor Knockaert have the touch to play accurate balls in. The majority is wasted. It stops us progressing as a side.

sussex_guy2k2 · Sep 2, 2018

samtheseagull said:
This is brilliant. What are you on mate

I've explained it elsewhere. Just because he scored, doesn't mean he played well. It just means he's decisive. It's the blessing of being a striker - you can have a below par game and still be seen as the hero by fans because you've been decisive, even in a game like this where Murray's decisive moments were a) put on a plate for him by Knockaert and b) a penalty.

But to be so sarcastically derogatory because I've disagreed with your opinion makes you look like a bit of a t*at.

sussex_guy2k2 · Sep 2, 2018

Mo Gosfield said:
When Solly March first broke into the side, we accepted that he was young and learning. We saw the potential. We saw a left sided player who looked capable of beating a man in a small space and whipping in a delivery from the by-line. We accepted the overhit crosses, free-kicks and corners. He will learn, mature and adapt. He will learn when to cross, when to check back. The hundreds of hours of practise will hone and improve his skills, crossing on the run or from a deadball. It is an art, a skill, a feel is needed when to cushion the ball, when to fade it, when to drive it in.
We are a few years on now and Solly is no longer a boy. He is approaching his football maturity and we have to ask the question as to whether his all round game has advanced to the level required. Maybe we have to accept that he has never had the feel and touch to be able to cross accurately, to pick out a player with precision. The inaccuracy is still too regular. He still shows the ability to beat people and cause problems but ultimately a lot of his decision making is awry. Talented as he is, maybe we just have to accept that he lacks that little bit extra. That footballing nous, that split second decision making process, that defines a player.
Solly excites and frustrates ( similar to Knockaert ) but the PL demands simple, quick, accurate football and at the moment there is too much waste amongst the occasional good stuff.

Your third sentence hits the nail on the head though, doesn't it. His best performances have been on the right, cutting in yet he's barely played there over the last year. He's being asked to play essentially as a left full back at times to cover Bong's positioning down the left. It's a very defensive, one dimensional role which does demand a great deal of work going backwards and a great engine to get back up the other end of the pitch. And when he does have the ball, he's often aiming at literally one man (often just Murray) who will often be up against 3-4 defenders in the box, as we barely ever have men break from midfield on to crosses - this demands an incredible amount of accuracy which, no matter your level, is very difficult to achieve. I don't envy the guy at all to be honest as the system just isn't set up for our wide men to thrive at this level.

You only have to compare the roles of March and Knockaert yesterday with Schurrle and Vietto. Fulham's wide men stayed very high up the pitch throughout, pushing our full backs back and with the freedom to run in behind (but over much shorter distances) and to run inside. Their job is simple and is confined to attacking areas. Ours are asked to do this, plus they're asked to defend on top of the full backs, and they're asked to often carry the ball 30 yards just to get to the opposition half, and then to beat 3-4 defenders to create a chance, and then they have often only one body to aim at... it really is a thankless task.

So whilst I agree March isn't perfect (although neither are Knoackert, the new guy or Izquierdo), I think you have to look at the bigger picture a little bit to understand why they play the way they play for CH, and why March has maybe developed the way he has.

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