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Hillsborough prosecutions



Carrot Cruncher

Carrot Cruncher

NHS Slave
Helpful Moderator
Jul 30, 2003
5,052
Southampton, United Kingdom
portlock seagull said:
I'd get a MOD to remove this post if I were you. I'll give you benefit of doubt that you're just badly informed and meant no malice, insensitive and misguided as your comments are. But because this is such a sensitive, appallling miscarage of justice and loss of life that's unique in British law, and it's a football matter, on a football forum, then you really ought not to be able to make such comments. It's not about entitlement to an opinion or free speech. This is an exceptional case, proved beyond doubt that the establishment caused, made worse and then covered up the deaths of essentially nearly 100 NSC'ers. Forget Paul Rogers situation, if anything should be muzzled on here, its people still perpetuating the lies and mistruths of that tragic day...like you.
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I actually believe posts like his should be kept (as long as they're not libellous) instead of being swept under the rug. As [MENTION=1200]Harry Wilson's tackle[/MENTION] says, it needs to be challenged. If someone is that stupid as to hold those views, people need to be able to call them up on it.
 




The Large One

The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
Thunder Bolt said:
You expressed an opinion, which you are quite entitled to, but you must realise that your opinion is not fact, or even true. It is a pack of lies, that you believe.
The fans were totally exonerated. Being late, or having a drink, made no difference whatsoever to the tragedy.

Incidentally, I am slightly right of centre, so no left wing anti establishment agenda here.
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He might be entitled to it, but it doesn't follow he's obliged to offer it.

As for his 'left wing anti establishment view' comment - pitiable, pathetic, and devoid of any intelligence.
 


Westdene Seagull

Westdene Seagull

aka Cap'n Carl Firecrotch
NSC Patron
Oct 27, 2003
21,023
The arse end of Hangleton
Beach Seagull said:
Remove the post indeed!! Why because on a forum I've had the 'cheek' to express an opinion?? Agree hours of evidence but are you all seriously telling me every Liverpool fan on the day turned up sober, in plenty of time for the match and with a ticket? I used the expression 'totally exenorate' in my original post I didn't say I blame the Liverpool fans for what happened. A lot of you on here have a very left wing anti establishment view of the world and it's very much reflected on the comments you've made.
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Me left wing ? Your judgement seems to be getting even worse !
 










H

Husty

Mooderator
Oct 18, 2008
11,991
portlock seagull said:
I'd get a MOD to remove this post if I were you. I'll give you benefit of doubt that you're just badly informed and meant no malice, insensitive and misguided as your comments are. But because this is such a sensitive, appallling miscarage of justice and loss of life that's unique in British law, and it's a football matter, on a football forum, then you really ought not to be able to make such comments. It's not about entitlement to an opinion or free speech. This is an exceptional case, proved beyond doubt that the establishment caused, made worse and then covered up the deaths of essentially nearly 100 NSC'ers. Forget Paul Rogers situation, if anything should be muzzled on here, its people still perpetuating the lies and mistruths of that tragic day...like you.
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Absolutely nothing wrong with what he said though :shrug:
 


B

Beach Seagull

New member
Jan 2, 2010
1,310
The Large One said:
He might be entitled to it, but it doesn't follow he's obliged to offer it.

As for his 'left wing anti establishment view' comment - pitiable, pathetic, and devoid of any intelligence.[/QUOTE]

Yeah because I've dared to disagree with the esteemed radio presenter 'the large one.' Unbelievable I find it as you probably the first to preach 'tolerance' but resort to insults if someone dares to express a view you disagree with.
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Herr Tubthumper

Herr Tubthumper

Well-known member
NSC Patron
Jul 11, 2003
59,567
The Fatherland
Beach Seagull said:
Because I live in the real world and I know that football fans will turn up drunk and as late as they can.
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True. But which bit of "being late, having drunk, made no difference to the tragedy" do you not understand?
 


The Large One

The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
Beach Seagull said:
Remove the post indeed!! Why because on a forum I've had the 'cheek' to express an opinion?? Agree hours of evidence but are you all seriously telling me every Liverpool fan on the day turned up sober, in plenty of time for the match and with a ticket? I used the expression 'totally exenorate' in my original post I didn't say I blame the Liverpool fans for what happened. A lot of you on here have a very left wing anti establishment view of the world and it's very much reflected on the comments you've made.
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However, I will answer your questions (some of which were answered 26 years ago).

Alcohol toxicology tests were carried out on all of the deceased - even children. None were found to have had excessive amounts of alcohol within their system. Similarly, no evidence was presented to either Taylor nor the HIP that fans' behaviour due to excessive alcohol had been a factor. Your phrase 'Turning up sober' is irrelevant.

Additionally, turning up in time is also irrelevant. If the situation had been managed properly, the time of arrival would not have been a factor. But it wasn't managed properly, so it was a factor. In fact, it was the factor.

As for supposed ticketlessness, that question has been answered many times, including on here, yet you still refuse to acknowledge it. This is entirely your failing.

Put it this way, fan behaviour in terms of drinking and prompt arrival has not changed massively in the 28 intervening years (not the preceding 28 years) and indeed is still the case now at the Amex. What has changed is the improved set-up ensuring greater safety and security.
 










Thunder Bolt

Thunder Bolt

Silly old bat
Aug 18, 2009
65,491
Beside the seaside, beside the sea
Beach Seagull said:
The Large One said:
He might be entitled to it, but it doesn't follow he's obliged to offer it.

As for his 'left wing anti establishment view' comment - pitiable, pathetic, and devoid of any intelligence.[/QUOTE]

Yeah because I've dared to disagree with the esteemed radio presenter 'the large one.' Unbelievable I find it as you probably the first to preach 'tolerance' but resort to insults if someone dares to express a view you disagree with.
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He didn't insult you. It was a view of your comment that he posted.
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The Large One

The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
Beach Seagull said:
Yeah because I've dared to disagree with the esteemed radio presenter 'the large one.' Unbelievable I find it as you probably the first to preach 'tolerance' but resort to insults if someone dares to express a view you disagree with.
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Seriously, grow up.

You've come on here to 'express an opinion' which is based on lies, and then grizzle when you get called out and shown up. You haven't 'disagreed' with anyone, you've argued with facts, and you're continuing to do so.

Considering what you're posting, 'pitiable, pathetic, and devoid of any intelligence' is hardly an insult.
 




B

Beach Seagull

New member
Jan 2, 2010
1,310
Thunder Bolt said:
But that doesn't kill people.
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Didn't say i did. I never said i 'blame' the Liverpool fans for what happened, i said wrong to 'totally exenorate' them. Knowing the culture of football fans (especially pre 90's one's) many would've turned up as close to kick off as they possibly could, drunk and some without tickets, wanting to be in the stadium ready for k/o. Hence the chaotic scenes outside the ground.
 




The Large One

The Large One

Who's Next?
Jul 7, 2003
52,343
97.2FM
Beach Seagull said:
Because I live in the real world and I know that football fans will turn up drunk and as late as they can.
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And that has precisely WHAT to do with what happened here?

Oh yeah, nothing. Which has been proved by a judge-led inquiry, an independent inquiry, and an inquest.

Please, if you have first-hand, peer-tested evidence which shows that 'football fans will turn up drunk and as late as they can' was the key factor in this disaster, thereby nullifying the hundreds of thousands of pages of evidence collected over the past quarter of a century, let us know. Over to you...
 




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