TODAYS BIG CONVERSATION: War with Russia

beorhthelm · Jun 29, 2017

The Antikythera Mechanism said:
Never going to happen, aliens will put a stop to it.

everyone forgets/doesnt know about the the alien overlords.

Putin's Russia is emboldened and sees weakness in the Europeans and US more focused on the Pacific. however they arent in a position to go to war, they have a fragile economy that relies on selling oil and gas mainly to Europe so wouldnt really work out if fighting. he plays for the crowd and keep core army on their toes and interested (so they dont look inward) with skirmishes in Ukraine and threatening Baltics, cant see anything serious coming from it.

vegster · Jun 29, 2017

Brighton Lines said:
What would anyone go to war with ? The following hostilities would be fought with bows and arrows.

Seriously, as reasoned as it sounds it's a dumb question. No one side could win as there would be no spoils. When both sides have the capacity to totally destroy each other the battle is fought without death- just the wish to make impoverished.

We probably would not go to war with Russia ....but Putin would certainly push the envelope as regard Russian expansion. he's willing to think he could get away with re-absorbing more of Ukraine and Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania and moving up to the border with Kaliningrad before the West had a debate about what to do. Putin is a calculating chancer and he will gamble on there being weakness and division amongst European countries while he seizes what he wants.

portlock seagull · Jun 29, 2017

Anyone read Richard Shirriff's 'War with Russia' btw? Interested to hear views if so. Sounds interesting read but is it overly sensationalist or is it creditable arguments that yes, we could well be heading for another conflict with the old enemy?

portlock seagull · Jun 29, 2017

vegster said:
We probably would not go to war with Russia ....but Putin would certainly push the envelope as regard Russian expansion. he's willing to think he could get away with re-absorbing more of Ukraine and Latvia, Estonia and Lithuania and moving up to the border with Kaliningrad before the West had a debate about what to do. Putin is a calculating chancer and he will gamble on there being weakness and division amongst European countries while he seizes what he wants.

Sorry, what does push the envelope mean? Odd phrase, do you mean money changing hands?

vegster · Jun 29, 2017

portlock seagull said:
Sorry, what does push the envelope mean? Odd phrase, do you mean money changing hands?

Push the envelope is .....If someone pushes the envelope, they do something to a greater degree or in a more extreme way than it has ever been done before.

portlock seagull · Jun 29, 2017

vegster said:
Push the envelope is .....If someone pushes the envelope, they do something to a greater degree or in a more extreme way than it has ever been done before.

Oh. So same as 'push to the limit'. But thank you, jargon decrypted!

Tarpon · Jun 29, 2017

Taybha said:
As long as it does not clash with august 12th i'm no bothered

I agree old chap. If my grouse shooting is disrupted I will be quite miffed.

Blue Valkyrie · Nov 25, 2018

Looks like it could escalate badly in Ukraine

https://twitter.com/nolanwpeterson/status/1066809497627303937?s=19

https://twitter.com/loogunda/status/1066813305262616576?s=19

vegster · Nov 25, 2018

Not looking good. Putin the Gambler has rolled his dice and is feeling lucky.

portlock seagull · Nov 25, 2018

Blue Valkyrie said:
Looks like it could escalate badly in Ukraine

https://twitter.com/nolanwpeterson/status/1066809497627303937?s=19

https://twitter.com/loogunda/status/1066813305262616576?s=19

Not sure Nolan is that creditable given he’s a ‘conflict journalist’, he’s always going to see things in their most dramatic narrative. It’s not a great situation obviously but I fail to see how this will change what is already a proxy war and a long one at that between east and west. That and I can never see Nato getting it’s act together enough to defend Britain let alone Ukraine (and let’s face it, there’s a pecking order to these situations)

symyjym · Nov 26, 2018

Crimea is Russia's Gibralta, Ukraine is a fascist state and the Middle East is on their doorstep as with China. It has nothing to do with us or NATO.

Thunder Bolt · Nov 26, 2018

symyjym said:
Crimea is Russia's Gibralta, Ukraine is a fascist state and the Middle East is on their doorstep as with China. It has nothing to do with us or NATO.

We've already got British troops in the Ukraine and are increasing the number.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...oyed-ukraine-face-threat-russia-mod-announce/

symyjym · Nov 26, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
We've already got British troops in the Ukraine and are increasing the number.
https://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/20...oyed-ukraine-face-threat-russia-mod-announce/

Only in training capacity at the moment and NATO has been on Russia's doorstep for years carrying out exercises and training. Ukraine is like our Northern Ireland problem. There are Russians living in the Ukraine who want to remain Russian, and the Ukraine is less politically stable than Russia anyway.

The problem really arises when the Ukraine gains too much confidence from NATO backing just like the Jihadi rebels did in Syria.

Thunder Bolt · Nov 26, 2018

symyjym said:
Only in training capacity at the moment and NATO has been on Russia's doorstep for years carrying out exercises and training. Ukraine is like our Northern Ireland problem. There are Russians living in the Ukraine who want to remain Russian, and the Ukraine is less politically stable than Russia anyway.

Not forgetting that previously neutral Finland is now linked with NATO, and Sweden, although still neutral, takes part in NATO talks.
Many countries feel threatened by Russia, not just the Ukraine.

The Antikythera Mechanism · Nov 26, 2018

A few drunk Russians having a row with a few drunk Ukrainians.Happens all the time.

symyjym · Nov 26, 2018

Thunder Bolt said:
Not forgetting that previously neutral Finland is now linked with NATO, and Sweden, although still neutral, takes part in NATO talks.
Many countries feel threatened by Russia, not just the Ukraine.

I don't feel threatened by Russia. I am more worried about the British government being sucked into wars, financing them, and warmongering from the sidelines. Unfortunately in Syria we gave the so called rebels confidence it taking the war to Assad and are responsible for mass migration from the Middle East and North Africa. I don't believe we have ever been at war with Russia unlike our friends across the pond and our old foes in Europe during and before the British Empire.

Charlies Shinpad · Nov 26, 2018

portlock seagull said:
Anyone read Richard Shirriff's 'War with Russia' btw? Interested to hear views if so. Sounds interesting read but is it overly sensationalist or is it creditable arguments that yes, we could well be heading for another conflict with the old enemy?

Our conflict underwater has never ended up North with them

Sent from my EML-L09 using Tapatalk

Blue Valkyrie · Nov 26, 2018

symyjym said:
Crimea is Russia's Gibralta, Ukraine is a fascist state and the Middle East is on their doorstep as with China. It has nothing to do with us or NATO.

Disgusting Fake News pushed by the Kremlin's propaganda department.

Thunder Bolt · Nov 26, 2018

symyjym said:
I don't feel threatened by Russia. I am more worried about the British government being sucked into wars, financing them, and warmongering from the sidelines. Unfortunately in Syria we gave the so called rebels confidence it taking the war to Assad and are responsible for mass migration from the Middle East and North Africa. I don't believe we have ever been at war with Russia unlike our friends across the pond and our old foes in Europe during and before the British Empire.

You need to widen your research.

Gazwag · Nov 26, 2018

AmexRuislip; said:
Brighton fans mocked Palace's new striker on Thursday, saying Benteke "a large crap footballer" and would be wise to keep his distance from Brighton's defenders.

The giant vessel, Palace's most expensive and biggest striker, embarked on his debut on Monday, prompting Palace fans to say they thought Brighton fans should look at it "with a little bit of envy."

I'm sure we had this thread a couple of years ago

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TODAYS BIG CONVERSATION: War with Russia

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